Custom Bats Cricket Forum
Equipment => Bats => Topic started by: PedalsMcgrew on April 23, 2011, 08:37:44 PM
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Hello,
I bought a custom made bat in January of last year, made to my specs, best of the best willow, 2.11 in weight once stickered and gripped. It cost a lot of money! A few weeks later the bat arrived, I had paid extra for it to be knocked in, although when it arrived the edges were still sharp so I knocked it in myself until I had rounded them off a little. It was finished beautifully on arrival with me so I didn't kick up a fuss about the apparent lack of knocking in as I was still pretty chuffed with it. I then had a dozen or so nets before the start of the season and then played an entire season with it. At first the wood felt lifeless and the middle was very hard to find but I put that down to the very bouncy nets I was using and the low middle I had asked for on the bat not getting along together. As the season progressed the bat started to get better but it didn't improve as much as I wanted or indeed expected. Ok, I thought, it probably needs a bit more work. At the end of the season I took it to Serious Cricket to get a new scuff fitted and explained that I didn't believe that it was properly knocked in. They suggested giving it a session on their 'knocking-in' machine as they felt it was still incredibly soft. I duly stuck it on the machine, had a new scuff fitted and approached pre season nets this year with a lot more confidence in it.
Thing is, it seems to have made no difference at all! The bat is still ridiculously soft, the middle (when I can find it) seems to lack power, it feels lifeless (at least compared to my Newberry Mjolnir) when hit with a mallet and generally seems to lack any kind of 'ping' whatsoever...
It's a brand that seems VERY highly rated on here and as far as I can see (if your all being honest) this would be the only bad bat this company has ever made....!
What can I do to try and improve it's performance? or alternatively do I just accept that I have bought a bat that doesn't suit me and move on to something else? I mean, it should have come good by now shouldn't it?
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Intrigue on a Saturday night, please God let it not be a Talisman!!!!!!
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Hahaha, Your safe, It's not one of yours! It is in the top 4 of the recent Bat World Cup held on this forum and that's all I'm saying!
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drum roll when was you down at dummer what date was the bat knocked in
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laver?
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do not be daft
redback or scat
Buzz somebody mentioned your dream mate
bloody hell you must be a mind reader
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User error? Has any one else used the bat- to get a second opinion?
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Maybe the problem lies in who is holding the bat rather than the bat itself ;)
Buzz beat me too it.
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who were the top 4? newbery scat?
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maybe sometimes people think there bats score the runs not the user...
better players find the middle
but then again it could be a duff bat..
Every maker bar none get it wrong sometimes
That world cup thing made me laugh half the people have never used half the bats...
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Well I have had a stunner end up being a bit of a dud too, it has gone through a few hands and never hardened fully, I have no idea why and it baffled some seriously knowledgeable people too. I guess it is just one of those things, it has made me aware that quite often first impressions are right when you know what works for you bat wise. I think I know after the first knock if it is the real deal or knock, harder to know when tapping unless you have had the chance to own 6+ bats and use them fully.
The beans will needed to be spilled, by pm if required, I'll keep it secret honest!!!
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bats are like harry potter with his wand! lol
not all bats are perfect for you!
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drum roll when was you down at dummer what date was the bat knocked in
I'm down there most weeks for nets, can't remember the actual date I had it on the machine but it was towards the end of last season, say September time?
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That machine is fine with hard bats but kills good ones....
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it was a redback...
I have seen many bats on that machine it better than fordhams press..
A lot of people use it Mike..
I may add i'm not one of them...
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User error? Has any one else used the bat- to get a second opinion?
I have lent the bat to 3 trusted teammates and none have been particularly enamoured with it. It picks up well and feels nice in the hand but it's the performance from the middle of the bat that is very disappointing.
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if it's dead i will give you 50 pound for it providing there no bad cracks or shot handle
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it was a redback...
I have seen many bats on that machine it better than fordhams press..
A lot of people use it Mike..
I may add i'm not one of them...
Dammit :D
Hang on a sec........how do you know that? Do you work for Serious in a kind of 'Rain man' role, their walking, talking filing system? :D :D
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No mate i do not work there
Is the bat for sale.....
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So, the question is what do I do? Having lent the bat to a few teammates, none of whom gave it anymore than a 'meh' do I accept that it's just not a great bat or that it doesn't suit mine or their style of play or do I persevere in the hope that a few more innings and, possibly, a lot more knocking in will turn it into the bat I hope it is?
I doubt very much that the machine killed it as I had done at least a dozen nets and an entire season with it before and it was certainly no worse after it went on it.
The bat might be for sale.....it depends on what I can get to replace it with......money is tight at the moment...!
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I could hand knock it in for you using my vl Mallett..
Have you oiled it got any pictures of it
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VL mallet or LV mallet?
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either way round mate makes no odds i guess your right Dom
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lignum_vitae
as you know Shills
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It was oiled and 'ready to go' when I received it and at the end of the season I removed the scuff, oiled it again then put another scuff on it.
I'd be happy to let you have a look at it and try and get it going better than I obviously can...!
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Willow is a natural substance, and I think every now and again, the experts get it wrong and pick a cleft that doesn't perform
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Youve done 3 sets of knocking in (From the company, yourself and the machine). You have also used the bat for a season. You do not need any more knocking in and you didnt even really require the machine knocking in.
If using it for a season didnt knock it in then what will. Knocking in also really doesnt make the bat better. It should strengthen the wood to prevent a bit of cracking etc but it wont turn a average bat into a good bat. The fact is youve got a dud bat and that can happen in any company at any price point.
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I think, as Talisman has stated earlier, the issue is with the bat not hardening up at all. Now, maybe that is to do with my knocking in/machine knocking in and if that is the case then fine, it's my fault, you live and learn but I have knocked in a great many bats in the last 20 odd years and have had good service and life out of all of them (apart from a Kook bubble I bought to be like Graham Thorpe that was a plank and broke within 3 months!)
I'm going to persevere with it for the time being but if it hasn't hardened up by the end of May then I think I will have to cut my losses and look for something else as there is nothing quite so soul destroying as perfectly timing a sweet off drive and it not having the power to reach the boundary! Although I may not be the greatest batsman in the world I have been perfectly capable of clearing the boundaries with ease with other bats.
@Hads45
Your right mate, but I am still having trouble believing that to be the case! If that is true then I certainly don't blame anyone but I am at pains to basically discard the bat and move onto something else without knowing for sure that it's the bat and not me!
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I would not waste any more time on it, let it go and get another this week that will live up to your standards, some bats just do this and that is because we will never fully know every single aspect of a cleft, just get better at guessing.
Take up Procricket's offer and I'll take the money as a deposit on a new bat ;)
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Can we see a picture of the said bat please
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One of my club mate bought 300+ Pounds bat, Kookaburra Blade 950 and trust me we knocked it and played with it enough and believe me or not that bat doesn't ping at all! I myself tested few times it would just not ping even the middle won't ping. So as Mike said it happens and we can't know every aspect of the cleft
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every makers has rogue no doubt it all in the lottery of buying bats. there one brand i would never buy a bat from i bought 2 and all of them were bad. I have no doubt though that they makes good bats though but got nowhere with them. And me favourite saying at the minute when has a cost of a bat had any indication of the quality it has not.
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Dave mind mentioning there name ?
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there not on the forum so no point and so many rate them so in truth they must make good bats just i just got a bad couple
I have even tried one of the lads and it was good but the two i paid money for not good enough..
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I think I might have at least been offered a helping hand in finding a solution by Petehosk. He has offered to lend me his near identical bat to net with this coming week and he is going to take mine away with him and net with it to see if I'm being an idiot or not! At least then I will know for certain.
How kind is that? Can't thank him enough...
Based on what he finds I'll make a decision. Talisman/Procricket, I may well take you up on that kind offer....we'll see what he thinks about it...will send some pics today...
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Fair enough by that stage i will have another in the bag by another i think...
But good luck mate
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I have limited knowlege in this subject compared to some of our more seasoned forum members, but surely if you are getting a custom made bat from a small batmaker, he will have the ability to know which piece of wood will be a plank and which will be responsive? If I am not mistake, he will use a mallet, and an unresponsive bat will surely not feel the same as a gun?
Are we not paying for this expertise when we choose a custom bat? Please correct me if I am wrong
Also in this instance, does the batmaker/company have any oligation to PedalsMcgrew, or anybody else who finds himself in this same situation, to recitify the situation?
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not after a year they do not at all.
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but in my experience it can take a season for a bat to "come good"
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in the old days i used to knock a bat in for a year a diamond but i doubt anybody is going to gice you your money back for it after a years use and all
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For what it's worth it has never even crossed my mind to look for any kind of solution from the maker of the bat. After a year of ownership he has no obligation to me at all and IF there is an issue with my bat (which is still unknown) it is far more likely to have come as a result of something I have done than anything else. Also, if I have just been unlucky and got something that isn't that great then I have to accept this. Batmaking isn't an exact science and as Talisman has stated earlier in this thread sometimes these things just happen and there is no explanation for it. You pay your money you take your chance...!
Anyway, a very kind member of this forum is lending me a number of his bats to try out over the next few weeks whilst he assesses mine so it's not all bad news!
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For what it's worth it has never even crossed my mind to look for any kind of solution from the maker of the bat. After a year of ownership he has no obligation to me at all and IF there is an issue with my bat (which is still unknown) it is far more likely to have come as a result of something I have done than anything else. Also, if I have just been unlucky and got something that isn't that great then I have to accept this. Batmaking isn't an exact science and as Talisman has stated earlier in this thread sometimes these things just happen and there is no explanation for it. You pay your money you take your chance...!
Anyway, a very kind member of this forum is lending me a number of his bats to try out over the next few weeks whilst he assesses mine so it's not all bad news!
Assuming it is one of mine (you didnt actually confirm), send it back and ill take a look.
Its always best to contact the maker, regardless of time scale if your unhappy with any product - else how can we help if we dont know there is a problem?
Please send me an email and ill reply with my address etc to return it to.
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How cool is this forum? A member offers to help out another by opening up his bat treasure trove, while a batmaker steps up and offers to do the right thing more than a year after the sale, not knowing for sure whether it's his bat. Would have been quite easy to just look the other way...
Kudos guys!
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How cool is this forum? A member offers to help out another by opening up his bat treasure trove, while a batmaker steps up and offers to do the right thing more than a year after the sale, not knowing for sure whether it's his bat. Would have been quite easy to just look the other way...
Kudos guys!
SkipperJ I have to second your post!!!
2 thumbs up to both PeteHosk and Redback.
This just further confirms how excellent this forum is! That due to a common bond over a game we all love, friendships can be formed and kindness and generosity prevail from everyone in all aspects. Whether it is passing on advice, constructive criticism or help in situations like this.
It really is a joy to be a part of this group and to be able to interact with everyone.
PedalsMcgrew really hope the situation works out for you!! Best of luck in find a bat and having your issue resolved.
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Couldn't agree more fellas, Not only has Gary at Redback offered to have the bat picked up from me at his cost in order to examine it (even though the chances are the fault is with me and the bat is over a year old!) but I'm meeting up with Pete who's bringing me a selection of bats to try and has offered to lend me a few to use! It's like christmas! Such generosity has really taken me aback.
If this isn't a great advert for the forum, the people and custom batmakers then I don't know what is....
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Happy days
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Uuuugh Pete. My bat's a dud, broken piece of (No Swearing Please). :D
Only joking, I love my wood ;)
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I have to say this Forum is superb and is confirmed by the actions of its members in special regard to this topic in the way Gary from Redback is prepared to have a look at the bat at his cost. You don't get better customer service than that very often. And Mr Hosk coming to the guys rescue, superb. Before i read this forum and took its advice i have to say i was not prepared to deal with the scammers out there especially on e bay etc. Well done guys keep up the good work!!
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Nice to see there seems to be a happy solution to this.
However if we can all learn one thing from it, perhaps it is that should we ever have a problem with a bat, the first port of call should always be the maker or supplier. Had that happened in this instance the outcome would have been the same, but without the thread that could have been potentially damaging to the reputation of the batmaker. It hasn't become damaging, thankfully but it could have done.
Pete's offer goes above and beyond the call, but it shouldn't be seen as an incentive to come on here and give a sob story in the hope that a similar offer is made again. I hope this doesn't set a precedent.
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I drive past Luke on the way back from work so I don't mind in this instance!!
And was just about to sort a nice Kashmir willow bat for colesey until I saw he was kidding! ;)
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Nice to see there seems to be a happy solution to this.
However if we can all learn one thing from it, perhaps it is that should we ever have a problem with a bat, the first port of call should always be the maker or supplier. Had that happened in this instance the outcome would have been the same, but without the thread that could have been potentially damaging to the reputation of the batmaker. It hasn't become damaging, thankfully but it could have done.
Pete's offer goes above and beyond the call, but it shouldn't be seen as an incentive to come on here and give a sob story in the hope that a similar offer is made again. I hope this doesn't set a precedent.
Totally agree with you Mr Pinson, to be fair though I doubt many people would think of contacting the maker of a bat a year after it was made and purchased in order to have them rectify a problem that is quite possibly down to the actions of the user and/or maybe in their head! What I have learnt is that the customer service and back up of this custom batmaker is second to none and goes far and beyond what I would ever expect or what I have ever received in the past in any area. If you'll note in my original post I do not name the manufacturer and actually ask for ways to increase the performance of the bat. I was trying to ascertain whether it was me or the bat. Something I still do not know but hopefully something Pete is going to help me with over the next few days. I'll be the first to post here and admit if I have been an idiot (If Pete doesn't beat me to it!) and I'm prepared to take the abuse if that's the case!
I do think it would be an error though if people felt unable to question an individual bats quality or performance for fear of upsetting anyone on this forum. If we're only allowed to say good things about our experiences then the forum loses a lot of it's power and usefullness. Unbiased views are what I would like to see here and as long as people are always 100% honest (as I have been) and have no ulterior motives then I do not see any problem with threads such as these.
As for Pete's offer it just goes to show the quality of the subscribers to this forum and I hope that they and any 'lurkers' who may be viewing this topic will take note of the outstanding customer service I am receiving. For what it's worth I'd have another bat from this manufacturer tomorrow. I love the thing and I desperately want it to work for me and if it's perceived lack of performance is down to me then I will happily pay any amount to have it sorted out. If anything the likelihood of me purchasing another bat from this maker has increased.
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In fairness to the OP he did only ask for how to help it and never slated the brand . Also I dont think a year after buying a bat id contact the seller, in fact ive been in the same situation with a bat and never thought to contact the company.
and I agree in his last post. If everyone goes on and tell you how good there bat is, it sets a fake precendent for bats. According to the forum there are many brands which make bats which are all amazing and perfect and have middles the whole way up. I will openly say ive used a screaming cat which was just ok, not bad, but not amazing... but if you asked anyone on the forum there opinion on screaming cats theyd say simply unbelievable. So I think its good hes openly honest.
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id say a bat only comes to full pontential after its been used for a season and its gone bit soft.
new bats "ping" the wood is still hard etc.ive got some new bats they feel fantastic but i will know more near end of season when they are propa "played" in
but i think u can hit the ball harder where the wood flexs more transfering the energy into the ball.
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Well then we can take from this that no matter how long it has been or how unlikely the OP thought he would get a positive outcome, it is certainly worth seeking advice from the maker. I don't think for a moment that everyone would get such a positive outcome as here, it will depend on a case to case basis, for instance I don't think Hunts would be interested in replacing my 20 year old reflex that is now about 20% polyfiller.
There is no issue with the OP here, I just hope that someone doesn't read this thread and expect people to show the kindness they have here every time.
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id say a bat only comes to full pontential after its been used for a season and its gone bit soft.
new bats "ping" the wood is still hard etc.ive got some new bats they feel fantastic but i will know more near end of season when they are propa "played" in
but i think u can hit the ball harder where the wood flexs more transfering the energy into the ball.
Surely its the other way round.
After a while when you use a bat the fibre's tighten and the face of the bat will harden due to the use you have given it. But when you first receive a bat, the fibres are loose as it has only been pressed so far. Thats why you need to 'play' a bat in, to harden the face.
Well thats the way ive always seen it!
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in theory yes u knock the bat in to make the fibers nit 2gether. but a used bat never feels hard when u hit the ball allways soft!
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My belief has always been that the softer the bat the better the bat as long as you can get the face to harden sufficiently in order to create that 'trampoline' effect that we're all after...in the same way that the laminated bats work but to a lesser degree...Mind you, I can't tell whether my bat is good or not without getting someone else to tell me so what do I know! :D
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Must admit that is an aspect that confuses me too. If we think of willow in it's natural state it is very soft, incredibly so for wood. Pressing will have a hardening effect, compressing the soft fiberous wood into a smaller volume, then knocking in will do a similar thing, compressing the face further. I don't understand how a bat can then become softer through use. All playing in is a form of further knocking in, surely? Both processes involve hitting the bat with a hard object and potentially compressing fibres more so.
Similarly, I don't follow the logic of batmakers who are known to press the bat harder than average who say that the bat will take longer to play well. Surely if a bat is harder to start with, it isn't going to get better the harder it gets (through knocking in, or use)?
There was talk a while ago that soft pressed bats have ultimate initial performance, I get that. I don't see how it works the other way around though.
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I think if you have a softer pressed bat and the face hasn't hardened sufficiently then you can lose performance as some of the balls momentum is lost in the wood, on the flip side if you have a harder pressed bat then you must surely have less of the trampoline effect as their is less compression behind the hard face of it? I think this is why laminated bats work well enough to get banned! The top laminate is harder and denser with a softer less dense lower laminate that increases the 'spring' for the blade.
As a bat gets older it gets harder, through naturally drying out and use and it must eventually reach a point where it's performance starts to suffer as a result of having less compression available to help 'ping' the ball off the face?
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I think if you have a softer pressed bat and the face hasn't hardened sufficiently then you can lose performance as some of the balls momentum is lost in the wood, on the flip side if you have a harder pressed bat then you must surely have less of the trampoline effect as their is less compression behind the hard face of it? I think this is why laminated bats work well enough to get banned! The top laminate is harder and denser with a softer less dense lower laminate that increases the 'spring' for the blade.
As a bat gets older it gets harder, through naturally drying out and use and it must eventually reach a point where it's performance starts to suffer as a result of having less compression available to help 'ping' the ball off the face?
Makes sense and I think we are falling foul to the marketing departments. I was always told a softer pressed bat will perform better immediately but not last as long, so I don't see how in a case like yours, softness reduce performance. It's all very confusing!
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The way I think about it is like this:-
If you think of 4 bedsprings lined up next to each other with a layer across the top of errrm, lets say aluminum. If the ball strikes the middle of the aluminum strip all 4 springs are compressed and the ball flys off using the power of all the springs. If you remove the aluminum strip and do the same thing your only ever going to be using the power of the 1 spring the ball hits so it must effect the power of the strike............musn't it? So a hard face and a soft blade would seem to me to give the best performance. My issues stem from having a very soft blade but a complete inability on my part to be able to harden the face of it to get the performance I think this bat is capable of which is why I think my bat is slightly down on power. Again the flip side is that if I can get the face to harden up I might well have the bat to end all bats in my poesession as there is no question that the softness of the willow will provide exceptional spring!
Not sure if that's correct at all but it's how I think....!
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Think of softness being the strings of a tennis racquet, imagine the racquet came with such loose string that you would struggle to hit a ball over the net, so you press the bat and tighten the strings, now it is able to hit the ball over the net but is still a bit slack and does not have the tautness needed for hard shots, so you knock it in and tighten the strings a bit more and it starts to hit the ball well and give the response you are after, now if you keep hitting it the face will compress beyond the perfect point and you will not be able to generate the same power as the spring has gone. Some bats never harden they just continue to compress with no real power.
Soft pressed bats need more knocking in, this is a real skill to get right and it not done well will lead to dull unresponsive bats.