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General Cricket => Cricket Training, Fitness and Injuries => Topic started by: johan95 on May 17, 2011, 02:07:24 PM

Title: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: johan95 on May 17, 2011, 02:07:24 PM
Pondering to myself this afternoon, I was thinking about the benefits of a trigger movement? If this has come up previously, sorry then please link and subsequently delete. Just as our overseas has a trigger but I'm not sure quite how it helps, but am interested to know :)
Cheers,
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: Hads45 on May 17, 2011, 02:13:10 PM
Alot of batsman have i guess what you call "heavy feet" , where your feet dont really move or get going...potentially for some just early in ur innings.

A trigger movement gets your feet moving. I guess it makers you a bit lighter on your feet and in some bit way a bit more flexible. If you ever think your feet arent quite moving the way you like try it, personally it has worked a few times for me.
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: Mafito89 on May 17, 2011, 02:15:44 PM
I've been doing a lot of one on one batting work with my coach recently and he has made me abandon my trigger movement of going back and across.

Instead he's worked on me taking guard on middle and just working on keeping my head as straight as possible, with my body as still as possible concentrating my focus on the bowlers hand.

His philosophy is if I'm still and balanced then I can play any shot I want because I'll always be in the right position whether I need to come forward or go back.

My trigger was causing me to lose balance and fall away from the ball when playing. So I'm not really sure there is a benefit to having a trigger, although I think it might be a case of to each his own, as I know players who are uncomfortable without a trigger.
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: johan95 on May 17, 2011, 02:18:48 PM
OK guys thanks for your views keep 'em coming :)
I don't have one myself, I just like to remain perfectly still as the bowler is running up. I sometimes make sure my backlift is in a straight line as he runs up as sometimes I slice across the ball if it comes from fine leg, which it used to.

But it obviously works for some given even the pros use the same technique/method, so I'd be intrigued to know why and what the benefits are :)
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: Buzz on May 17, 2011, 02:50:18 PM
I've been doing a lot of one on one batting work with my coach recently and he has made me abandon my trigger movement of going back and across.

Instead he's worked on me taking guard on middle and just working on keeping my head as straight as possible, with my body as still as possible concentrating my focus on the bowlers hand.

His philosophy is if I'm still and balanced then I can play any shot I want because I'll always be in the right position whether I need to come forward or go back.

My trigger was causing me to lose balance and fall away from the ball when playing. So I'm not really sure there is a benefit to having a trigger, although I think it might be a case of to each his own, as I know players who are uncomfortable without a trigger.

There are virtually no benefits to a trigger movement. Mafito - I don't know who your coach is, but I think he sounds like a good one.

Some pro's use it - although increasing numbers are ditching it - to help get their feet moving against pace bowling. Realistically 95% of the people on this forum wont ever face bowling quick enough to need a trigger.

Michael Clarke, Matt Prior, Sehwag, Chris Gayle, Jesse Ryder and loads of others don't have a trigger they stand still.

There are quite a few topics on triggers on the forum, take a look around.

At club level I have yet to see a trigger seriously improve a batsman. 
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: roco on May 17, 2011, 02:57:39 PM
I wondered how long till buzz came in ;)
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: Buzz on May 17, 2011, 03:10:09 PM
humm - it was like dangling bait over a hungry fish - I had replied before I had realised what had happened!!
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: roco on May 17, 2011, 03:13:54 PM
Well I'm tempted to try no trigger tommorow in the t20 but risky in a match when not done it in nets
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: Buzz on May 17, 2011, 03:20:45 PM
Give it a go. Neither of the two current best 2020 batsman (Sehwag and Gayle) have a trigger...

Stand still and whack it.
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: roco on May 17, 2011, 03:22:19 PM
I have seen gayle use a trigger in the longer forms just not lately

Very tempted
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: Damo1583 on May 17, 2011, 03:43:22 PM
I personally see no reason what so ever of having a trigger movement.......All you will do is trap yourself on you back or front foot, your weight will be un-balanced and therefore your head will never propperly be in the correct position.....The first part of your body to move has to be your head to be correctly inline with the ball then your weight can generate the power from a solid foundation!
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: tommo256 on May 17, 2011, 03:55:28 PM
I trigger, it helps me get into position quicker so i can pounce on the ball quicker and also with the movement i have found in the last week, has helped me get a quicker start to getting runs as you have already made a kovement
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: procricket on May 17, 2011, 04:19:55 PM
None at all most do not even understand triggers and most people playing league cricket use them and it harms there batting more than it helps

Use the numonic  KISS when batting

Kiss. Keep It Simple Stupid
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: Johnny on August 19, 2012, 09:51:19 AM
Old topic I know, but just thought I'd add my experience.

I had a trigger movement coached into me at age 11 by an international cricketer. It served me well for 18 years, but last season I decided to ditch it. Not through poor form or anything like that, but just because the arguments for not having a trigger made so much sense - keep you head still, kept things simple etc...

My first triggerless year was ok, without being spectacular. I missed 6 weeks of cricket due to the birth of my daughter, plus having always batted in the top 4 all of a sudden I was batting 6-7. I had lots of 20-30 not outs but no really big scores, partly due to where I was batting in the order.

This season I've been atrocious though.

So I got to thinking, last time I had a 500+ run season, was there anything in particular I was doing differently? The answer: yes, I had a trigger movement.

So I've decided to try and get myself back in the habit. Yesterday was the first match and I hit 32, my first meaningful runs of the year.
My footwork felt a lot better.

So think I'm going to stick with it. The reasons don't really make sense, it just seems to work for me
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: Number4 on August 19, 2012, 09:54:14 AM
Old topic I know, but just thought I'd add my experience.

I had a trigger movement coached into me at age 11 by an international cricketer. It served me well for 18 years, but last season I decided to ditch it. Not through poor form or anything like that, but just because the arguments for not having a trigger made so much sense - keep you head still, kept things simple etc...

My first triggerless year was ok, without being spectacular. I missed 6 weeks of cricket due to the birth of my daughter, plus having always batted in the top 4 all of a sudden I was batting 6-7. I had lots of 20-30 not outs but no really big scores, partly due to where I was batting in the order.

This season I've been atrocious though.

So I got to thinking, last time I had a 500+ run season, was there anything in particular I was doing differently? The answer: yes, I had a trigger movement.

So I've decided to try and get myself back in the habit. Yesterday was the first match and I hit 32, my first meaningful runs of the year.
My footwork felt a lot better.

So think I'm going to stick with it. The reasons don't really make sense, it just seems to work for me

And what is your actual trigger movement Johnny?
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: Johnny on August 19, 2012, 09:55:47 AM
Back foot goes back and across
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: Number4 on August 19, 2012, 09:59:58 AM
Back foot goes back and across

Worked great for Steve Waugh so is good enough for me too
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: 97notout on August 19, 2012, 10:06:40 AM
I'd read a lot on the forum about 'trigger movement' and understood what it was but never thought much of it and may have or may not have had one, until yesterday................................

Got to the club early for a net and the groundsman who is a qualified coach just happened to be watching me straight on and he noticed that I was always planting my front foot, virtually to every delivery, which he said was fine if it was an over pitched delivery. Any other time I would over reach or wasn't in a position to move about the crease.

So I tried on his instruction, right foot back and across, getting my head into line and then dealing with the delivery and then checking the position of my back foot. I think a lot of batsmen use this, it might be basics and I've been crap for years but it was the first time someone had took the time to try and improve my position at the crease.

It seemed to work when I opened the batting and made me concentrate more (until I got one that kept low) so I think I'll stick with it.
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: GarrettJ on August 19, 2012, 10:44:50 AM
I'll go against coach buzz and say any serious batsman must have a trigger, 95% of international batsmen do it. If done incorrectly it's a minefield though!!

You must complete the trigger before the ball has been released so you are perfectly still at poInt of release. Timing is everything with the trigger. Get it wrong and you are in big big trouble with your weight moving in a certain direction causing you to restrict the shots you can play.

Here is the trigger I was coached by gus logie and Desmond Haynes:

Move your back foot back and across
Further for pace bowling just a little for slow bowling
Start the trigger just before the bowler jumps
Keep head still and forward of the body
Unweight your front foot .... Weight on ball of back foot front foot barely touching the ground.

You are now in a coiled position ready to go forward and back with power stored in your hips which you can drive through the ball for extra power.

Someone is going to say now I'm stuck as my weight is on my backfoot .... Well

My head is forward and this is key all with basic biomechanics.

To go forward you have to use your right foot .... Try it. Stand in your stance and go forward you will feel that it is your right foot that takes the weight to move you forward and vice versa.

So now I'm stuck you are now rightly saying, I can't go back!

Now try this ..... Stand in your stance head forward and drop your front shoulder to the ground ...... Your backfoot just lifted as it forced the weight onto your front foot.

So now alll you need to do to go back is stay still dip your front shoulder, which helps keep your head forwArd when playing back, and your backfoot is easy to move.

This is a great way to trigger but you must time it right and be still at the point of release.

If you can't get it right then it's best to not bother as it will cause serious balance and alignment problems

Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: rbanners on August 20, 2012, 11:34:25 AM
This is a fascinating discussion, thanks for starting it and thanks for all the contributions so far.

I intermittently use a trigger (back and across), but have had 2 LBWs from what the umpires have described as "shuffling in front of the stumps". Reading GarrettJs post, this either means I am triggering late or just too slow on my feet/lacking in skill against the quicker bowlers.

Against average bowling, I dont need to use a trigger, but I force myself to use one in order to get forward on the predominantly low wickets we play on, since I am more naturally a back foot driver and cutter (to the point where I late cut anything vaguely short of a length).

I was just thinking about what to do next with my footwork, and reading these responses makes me want to ditch the trigger and concentrate more on watching the ball out of the hand and getting my head into position ie thinking less about my footwork and trusting my body to find the right balance with my head leading the way.

Will be great to hear what others with more experience have to say about trigger vs no trigger.
Thanks
Banners
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: shazz on August 20, 2012, 03:57:58 PM
agaisn't spinners a forward press is uselful, place 85% of weight on front foot, and take a half step frowards, as he is in his bound/ whenever comfortable.
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: GarrettJ on August 20, 2012, 04:20:19 PM
the trigger should be as natural as lifting your bat, if you are thinking about the trigger then how can you focus on the ball????? Its need more practice if you are at this stage. Maybe go to winter nets in Janauary with the aim of having it nailed by March.

again, if the trigger isnt perfect it does more harm than good.
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: GarrettJ on August 20, 2012, 04:22:03 PM
agaisn't spinners a forward press is uselful, place 85% of weight on front foot, and take a half step frowards, as he is in his bound/ whenever comfortable.

press which way, straight down, towards leg or towards off? I see a lot of internationals using this forward press to spinners but im not convinced indian batsmen do it and they are masters of playing spin ....... they prefer back foot and then front foot as the last resort??
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: PedalsMcgrew on August 20, 2012, 04:30:45 PM
I'll go with Buzz's view. He is a proper coach after all......... ;)
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: Nickauger on August 20, 2012, 04:41:11 PM
All the literature and coaching expertise that I have come across has said that a trigger movement is no good. However, I'm just as proper a coach as Buzz, and I'm looking to develop a trigger myself that might help! Clutching at straws perhaps, and if people didn't have differing views of things like this Pedals, no-one would ever improve as a coach!
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: GarrettJ on August 20, 2012, 04:46:47 PM
i just dont see how you can dismiss the trigger movement when all the internationals do it

having played agaisnt very fast bowlers myself, i can tell you that without the back and across trigger i would have had no chance against those quick bowlers.

Buzz is right in that most batsmen should ditch it ........ but only becasue they dont do it right and it causes some pretty serious balance issues.
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: GarrettJ on August 20, 2012, 04:50:45 PM
All the literature and coaching expertise that I have come across has said that a trigger movement is no good. However, I'm just as proper a coach as Buzz, and I'm looking to develop a trigger myself that might help! Clutching at straws perhaps, and if people didn't have differing views of things like this Pedals, no-one would ever improve as a coach!

coaching literature .... how old is it. does it say you should have your baclift over middle, off or pointing to cover??? Don Bradman had a strange backlift, Chanderpaul has a shocking stance and exaggerated trigger, Brian Lara had a stupidly high backlift, the feet in the stance past shoulder width apart of Chris Gayle and Kevin Pietersen, the trigger across the stumps of Amla .... all of that went against all coaching manuals i have read.

There is no one way to bat in my opinion and that is why cricket is such a fantastic game.

There are batting fundamentals which you must obey ....

keep your head still
eyes level 
weight into the shot
keep balanced

 .... how you do that is upto you but there is no one correct way to do it but without it you will fail to reach the top.
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: GarrettJ on August 20, 2012, 04:52:43 PM
I'll go with Buzz's view. He is a proper coach after all......... ;)

where is he getting his literature/learning materials from?

one coaching manual, personal experience or examining the traits of the successful players .... i dont know but you cant use one source to tell someone how to bat
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: Nickauger on August 20, 2012, 04:57:24 PM
Errrr I was completely agreeing with you mate!
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: GarrettJ on August 20, 2012, 05:00:31 PM
Errrr I was completely agreeing with you mate!

i know you were Nick, was throwing out a few questions to get this discussion going ......
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: Buzz on August 20, 2012, 05:02:46 PM
i just dont see how you can dismiss the trigger movement when all the internationals do it

having played agaisnt very fast bowlers myself, i can tell you that without the back and across trigger i would have had no chance against those quick bowlers.

Buzz is right in that most batsmen should ditch it ........ but only becasue they dont do it right and it causes some pretty serious balance issues.


I agree, I also agree with your technical points about when to trigger. although typically I prefer the tigger to be complete before the bowled gets to his "coil" position. I am not sure if that is the same as what you have said.

Also remember a trigger doesn't have to be a foot movement.

most of the batsmen I see don't face the quality of bowling that merits a trigger and my experience on this forum is that most batsmen would benefit from being still rather than a poorly executed trigger, which is why a suggest you stand still at the crease.
again this is just a repeat of what is above.

as for playing spin, look at how amla plays it and how VVS played spin and that will give you some ideas!

Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: GarrettJ on August 20, 2012, 05:08:09 PM
i think you hit the nail on the head buzz

a trigger or pre delivery movement needs to be done and completed before the bowler is in the air and if not then it will cause more harm than good.

i think it needs to be taken more seriosuly thanjsut rocking up for a game and deciding to inorporate a trigger, its something that needs doing over a winter and needs watching on a video to see if everything is correct
Title: Re: Benefits of a Trigger Movement?
Post by: ammo on August 21, 2012, 09:42:24 AM
I move my back foot back and across with my front foot resting on its toes this allows my front foot to move anywhere and saves time whe facing a short ball.
I just can't stand still when a bowler is running in i need to move... :-[