Custom Bats Cricket Forum
Equipment => Bats => Topic started by: 19reading87 on May 17, 2011, 07:48:33 PM
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Bored on a Tuesday night looking at the rain outside my bedroom window I was wondering a few things...
* Would a Grade 1 willow bat costing £160 perform worse or same as a Grade 1 Willow bat cost £260???
* Would a Grade 2/3 bat last as long as a Grade 1 bat???
* Would a lesser grade bat (again grade 2/3) not hit the ball as far/ as cleanly as a Grade 1 bat - yes it might depend on how strong the person using it is but you get where I'm coming from....
Thought's on all 3 points gentleman
Reds
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Point 2: I think it will last longer because if Grade 2/3 has fewer grains than a Grade 1 then it should last longer.
Rest are the questions I would like to be answered as well :D
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Does it depend on whose grading system is used??? Just with the whole thing on bats being graded on looks with some companies, not performance....(point 3 I'm talking about)
Anyway out of my area of expertise really!
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Would be good to hear from some of the bat makers/company owners with their views....
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There are plenty of threads discussing these points somewhere...
'Grade 1' depends on what the bat maker grades the wood on I assume, so two G1 bats from different companies may be graded as G1 on different merits so therefore I would assume you would get different performance from each bat.
Again, Grade 2/3 may only be different to a Grade 1 bat on looks rather than performance - so they may perform the same, however the looks of the bat may make it uglier, therefore the batmaker might grade it down to a G2/3. I 'think' G1 is normally around 8 grains(?) because then then pressing of the bat can be manipulated the most(?) so that it should be a better bat to one that is 3 grains due to the pressing is different. However you can find bats that are graded as G2/3 that perform very good indeed.
(There is a table somewhere of what normally grades wood but I can't find the link).
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Good info mate.
P.s posted your things today - let me know when you get them
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Nice one cheers, Will do!
http://www.quantumcricket.com/willow.html (http://www.quantumcricket.com/willow.html)
Here's something I found...
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I'm loving that link!!
Grade 2 here i come!! :D
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I'm loving that link!!
Grade 2 here i come!! :D
lol why's that mate
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Being somewhat of a cheapskate of late, i always used to buy top of the range bats as i always thought they would perform better. I am not one now of being a bit of a 'tart' when it comes to bats in the way of its looks. If it feels good and the ball goes to the boundary, i will keep using it.
2 of my last 3 bats have been bought for £80 or less, and are probably the best i have used. So basically the link says to me, grade 2 is only graded as that because of its looks.
I must repeat. I AM A CHEAPSKATE
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haha quality explanation!
My mate has so far scored 4 tons this season 3 in 3 innings and he uses a nitro 5 star which is graded as grade 2 and the ball absolutely flys!!!!!
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All this stuff about bays being better and less grains means it last longer and tighter grains are showers from the start
I think bats are variable in all grains and grades you have half a chance of a good un if it pressed proper but the rest is as variable as willow itself
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I must say, it is probably school boy stuff but,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,
Decent pressing and Knocking in your bat properly will make your bat last longer, and from my experience (not as long as some on here) it does make your bat perform better.
But i would probably not buy grade 3......................... unless the price is right lol.
Friend of mine had a V12 armour web years ago, he got the urine taken out of him for it, but with near on 1000 league runs with it, i must say, it was a gun. So looks are not everything.
I do feel we are in an age of cricket bat tarts. Although i must say, i am not shy on letting a batsman know how poor a bat looks for a bit of banter. I get loads when i come out with a Fatso, it isnt the prettiest, but an absolute gun, oh, and the name does fit the batsman :)
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The H4L I have is graded as a 5* due to having a couple of wavy lines on its face. If the mallet is anything to go by, it will perform like the Instinct, which is graded as a Zenith on performance.
Different manufacturers grade differently. Your questions will result in different answers dependent on who has made the bat and how it is graded. There is therefore no easy way to answer them.
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I am suprised that the V12 shape has never made a comeback. . . .what a bat it was.
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I think all od those could be answered with 'it depends on the particular bats in question'
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following on from the quantum willow link, how do you bleach a bat? that may be a stupid question and if it is im sorry but does it have to be redried or is it a case you rub bleach onto the surface as if your oiling the bat? dont worry no going to get the domestos out just wondered how it worked
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I think it would be nice to hear the opinions of some of our custom bat makers on this thread as I would be really interested on thier thoughts re grading of willow
The 3 star bat I have recently recieved and used from H4L goes like a gun and If I'm being truly honest I wasnt expecting it to perform as well as it does.... and this set me thinking Why is that? why wouldnt it perform as well as it does? My reasoning i think is because of past experience with "Big Brands" lower grade willow and how that performs.
So thats why I think it would be worth one of those guys giving us a rundown on their grading systems
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Good news mate so your 3 star is a top bat?
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Honest to god mate its Legendary I've been so shocked by it (even to the point I m starting to bore myself by how much I'm going on about it!!)
Matt really does make a spot on Bat!
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Lol that's quality mate. Big runs with it?
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I think it would be nice to hear the opinions of some of our custom bat makers on this thread as I would be really interested on thier thoughts re grading of willow
The 3 star bat I have recently recieved and used from H4L goes like a gun and If I'm being truly honest I wasnt expecting it to perform as well as it does.... and this set me thinking Why is that? why wouldnt it perform as well as it does? My reasoning i think is because of past experience with "Big Brands" lower grade willow and how that performs.
So thats why I think it would be worth one of those guys giving us a rundown on their grading systems
In reality I'd say you are pretty unlikely to get a batmaker commenting on this thread. After all, they're not going come out and say that their cheapest bat may well go as well as their most expensive...and you can't blame them.
'Grading' is something of a smokescreen to be honest. It wouldn't surprise me if some makers grade both ways:- 'it's grade 1 because it looks good' and then when all the pretty wood has run out 'it's grade 1 because it goes well'. Thus enabling almost the entire delivery of willow (normally made up of a mixture of grades 1-4) to be graded as top grade in one way or another. There is at least one maker who only seems to deal with ugly willow, yet justify their very high prices by claiming unparalleled performance.
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In reality I'd say you are pretty unlikely to get a batmaker commenting on this thread. After all, they're not going come out and say that their cheapest bat may well go as well as their most expensive...and you can't blame them.
'Grading' is something of a smokescreen to be honest. It wouldn't surprise me if some makers grade both ways:- 'it's grade 1 because it looks good' and then when all the pretty wood has run out 'it's grade 1 because it goes well'. Thus enabling almost the entire delivery of willow (normally made up of a mixture of grades 1-4) to be graded as top grade in one way or another. There is at least one maker who only seems to deal with ugly willow, yet justify their very high prices by claiming unparalleled performance.
That's kind of a cynical view JP and I'm hoping that at least 1 of the bat makers on here would be willing to give us all an insight as to the "kinds of things" they use to measure their grading I'm not expecting them to reveal any Magicians circle stuff here but I think it would be interesting to get a smaller brands view on it as I personally feel from experience that a lower grade custom made bat from a boutique company tends to be of a higher quality than those of the equivalent larger brands offerings.
I would especially believe that one of our illustrious brands on here would like to retort your slanderous comments RE: upgrading willow due to amount of stock!!? :D :D
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Oh and I have always been a little wary of a certain brands performance only grading system? as I have seen at least one of their top of the line bats that was awful (the owner had convinced himself that it was a stunner but then you would when youve spent just shy of 300 quid on a stick)
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Lol that's quality mate. Big runs with it?
50 not out with it at the weekend 36 of them coming of 12 balls!! (I got a bit carried away with how the ball was flying off the bat!!)
but still gotta say its a cracker!!! and zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz sorry bored myself!! lol
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I can share with people here my trick of bleaching willow so your used bats can be returned to brand new condition.
It is easier and cheaper than anybody thinks and it works perfectly.
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go for it! hows it done?
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It is a piece of piss.
You know that stuff you can buy from the supermarket to spray onto carpet stains?
It turns white and powdery and sits on your carpet - when you vacuum it away, your carpet stains have been removed.
Well...you can spray it onto your willow - leave it over night, then wipe/dust it off and WHALLA - your willow looks whiter than ever and sensational.
WARNING: Cover your bat stickers with masking tape as it can bleach them too!
Also, never spray directly onto the splice as it may loosen glue.
I do it all the time and my older bats are rejuvenated.
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How did you come across doing that? ive got a old GM radius thats been in the garage for years. may give it a go on that and see how it works. which brand spray do u use?
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How did you come across doing that? ive got a old GM radius thats been in the garage for years. may give it a go on that and see how it works. which brand spray do u use?
All the carpet stain remover sprays work.
Shake the can...hold about 20cms away and spray away!
Leave it on over night.
I usually sand first to get surface stains off and then I spray.
Magnifico!
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Found this article thought it might be helpful so sharing with you guys
Is a grade 1 bat always better than a grade 2 which is better than a grade 3 etc?
The simple and to some surprising answer is NO. We are talking approximations, the physical appearance between a low end grade 1 and high end grade 2 bat can be very similar and it is hard to tell which one will be best. The willow is only the starting raw material - the skill of the bat maker makes a huge difference to how a cleft of wood performs. Some clefts that look to be lower grade perform better than those that look better, performance also changes over time. Most clefts tend to get a bit better with age as they settle into their job, then as they get too old they tend to dry out, start to crack and loose the springyness that creates a good bat - this is normal and expected - no bat lasts forever. Some blades also perform better in different areas, most bats will perform if you time the ball out of the middle, thats how they are designed, some however give better rebound higher up the blade, or lower down the blade or can be more forgiving and responsive to edges and mistimed shots - this can be a result of the profile or just the natural variation of the wood.
So in summary, by buying a higher grade bat you expect and would normally get a better performing bat (from within a manufacturers range), but not always and this does not constitute a fault, this is down to natural variation. Higher grade bats cost more to buy and grading is done on appearance by most systems. The skill of the bat maker is just as important as the appearance of the wood, each maker has their own skills, their own equipment and methods of pressing the bats to create what they believe is the optimal product. The real skill comes in the retailer and the purchaser matching those specifics to the player, and thats how you will get the best bat for you.
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It is a piece of piss.
You know that stuff you can buy from the supermarket to spray onto carpet stains?
It turns white and powdery and sits on your carpet - when you vacuum it away, your carpet stains have been removed.
Well...you can spray it onto your willow - leave it over night, then wipe/dust it off and WHALLA - your willow looks whiter than ever and sensational.
WARNING: Cover your bat stickers with masking tape as it can bleach them too!
Also, never spray directly onto the splice as it may loosen glue.
I do it all the time and my older bats are rejuvenated.
This is gold! Anyone got a before and after?
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This is gold! Anyone got a before and after?
Gold perhaps but this is the kind of thing which is ripping thousands of people off in the world! Appauling imo!
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if used for financial gain then yes i agree it is appauling but if its just to tart up an old bat for yourself it cant be that bad can it?
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Very good point mate I should have said that.
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You guys are a bunch of sad sacks!
Also, you cannot spell either.
"APPALLING"
ap·pall·ing/əˈpôliNG/
Adjective: Awful; terrible.
I like my bats to look white and new at all times - so I sand ball stains off the edges and I cover the full face with extratec, so I can peel it off and change it a couple of times a season so my bats always look new.
What the hell is wrong with that?
The only thing appalling is your judgmental attitude. :(
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You guys are a bunch of sad sacks!
Also, you cannot spell either.
"APPALLING"
ap·pall·ing/əˈpôliNG/
Adjective: Awful; terrible.
I like my bats to look white and new at all times - so I sand ball stains off the edges and I cover the full face with extratec, so I can peel it off and change it a couple of times a season so my bats always look new.
What the hell is wrong with that?
The only thing appalling is your judgmental attitude. :(
Forgive me for possibly asking a stupid question but how on earth did you discover that Shake and Vac works?
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Must of been a Kim & Aggie moment.
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I like to think he was too lazy to remove a bat from the floor before cleaning his carpet! :D
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That's kind of a cynical view JP and I'm hoping that at least 1 of the bat makers on here would be willing to give us all an insight as to the "kinds of things" they use to measure their grading I'm not expecting them to reveal any Magicians circle stuff here but I think it would be interesting to get a smaller brands view on it as I personally feel from experience that a lower grade custom made bat from a boutique company tends to be of a higher quality than those of the equivalent larger brands offerings.
I would especially believe that one of our illustrious brands on here would like to retort your slanderous comments RE: upgrading willow due to amount of stock!!? :D :D
Cynical perhaps, but only born out of reading a fair bit of nonsense and contradiction both here and elsewhere. The ones that make me laugh are the makers who proudly state they only grade on performance, then they bring out a model which carries a premium because it is pretty.
'Upgrading' (good word) does go on, we have seen it here quite recently. Although no one would ever admit to it. If you as a batmaker buy in 500 clefts a year for instance, of which say 25 are what you would normally reserve for your very top models and then you suddenly get a rush of orders for 40 of them, what can you do? All of a sudden you start seeing people receiving bats that are stickered up as a higher grade than the willow really deserves.
I'm not for a moment saying they all do it, indeed I know some makers here who will tell the customer that they cannot provide them with a top grade bat as they do not have a suitable piece of willow for them. That of course is the right thing to do, but it must be very tempting to pass some lower grade stuff as higher grade and increase the profit margins a bit.
We have in the past attempted to ask batmakers questions about certain aspects and the silence has been deafening. Don't expect a response on this one either.
As for my 'slanderous' comments, get a life.
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Forgive me for possibly asking a stupid question but how on earth did you discover that Shake and Vac works?
Actually, the hint came from YOU guys!
I kept reading on this and other bat forums about sinister bat companies bleaching willow.
I would read advertisements "Grade 3 Unbleached English Willow.." and I would think to myself "you can bleach willow??"
So I used regular bleach which I borrowed from the laundry and rubbed it into the bat....but nothing.
I then kept thinking - how the hell do they do it???
I then remembered that carpet stain remover lifts stains out of carpet and if left on too long, starts to bleach the carpet. So I thought I would give it a try.
I sprayed a bat...left it on over night. The next day I wiped off the spray which turns to white powder pretty quickly with a dry cloth...and whaddya know??? The willow is bleached to a lovely whitish colour!!!
Have a look at my bats in the pics in the link below:
http://custombats.co.uk/cbforum/index.php?topic=9914.0
WIth the exception of the LH GM ICON LE, the rest of the bats are two years old and have seen heavy use - but looking at those pics, you would never know it.
So refurbing a bat is relatively simple, you just need some Aussie native cunning!
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Hi all,
Can anyone help me. I saw someone posted earlier about v1.1 and v.3 stickers. I have just sold a pellara on ebay presuming that the v1.1 i had was brand new and 2011 (given to me to auction off for charity).
The guy who bought it insists that v1.1 was 2010 and v.3 is the 2011 bat.
Anyone know if this is correct?
Thanks
Graham
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It was probably brand new, but v3.0 denotes 2011 and v1.1 is 2010 edition.
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ah ok thanks. any idea what a pellara v1.1 would be worth?
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The ECB shops sold the county edition ones off at £40 each about three or four months back.
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this was an eilte.
found it on some websites for £200+.
Thanks for your help
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It is very difficult to accurately price obsolete models. Your best bet is to fling it on ebay with a very low starting price and see what happens. You may have to bite the bullet and take a loss as there things are unlikely to go up in value.
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Bored on a Tuesday night looking at the rain outside my bedroom window I was wondering a few things...
* Would a Grade 1 willow bat costing £160 perform worse or same as a Grade 1 Willow bat cost £260???
* Would a Grade 2/3 bat last as long as a Grade 1 bat???
* Would a lesser grade bat (again grade 2/3) not hit the ball as far/ as cleanly as a Grade 1 bat - yes it might depend on how strong the person using it is but you get where I'm coming from....
Thought's on all 3 points gentleman
Reds
Bringing up an old topic to see if anybody have any thoughts???
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Grading of bats is nonsense, one bat makers grade 1 is another's grade 3 and vice versa.
Its All down to the pressing of the bat.