Custom Bats Cricket Forum
General Cricket => Players => Topic started by: PedalsMcgrew on August 06, 2012, 10:35:22 PM
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http://www.espncricinfo.com/england-v-south-africa-2012/content/story/576041.html?CMP=chrome
The article suggests he might have played his last game for England!!!!
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He needs to man up just because he can't play T20 cricket for England. It's almost saying, pick me for that and I'll carry on my test career.
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I never thought I'd say it but I'm actually getting bored of him now....
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I'd be happy if he's played his last test, Taylor at number 4 or keep him at 6. Then bring in someone like Joe Root. I can only see that this would be a good thing for England :)
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Agreed - just count the number of uses of "I, me, myself" etc in the quote in that article - tells you all you need to know.
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England are going to be very average again. Don't make him the sole scapegoat.
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I'd be happy if he's played his last test, Taylor at number 4 or keep him at 6. Then bring in someone like Joe Root. I can only see that this would be a good thing for England :)
I hope you're being sarcastic.
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KP only plays for KP. He's not a team player. Personally, i think england may be better iff without him. I know he's a phenominal talent, but the team should be a group of people all pulling for one purpose. KP seems to want to pull in a different direction...
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He is drama queen really.
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Accept KP for who he is- antagonise him and he will retire- but we do need him, that is the fact of the matter. He may be selfish in some respects, but I do believe he wants to play for England, so the ECB must find a way as to see him walk away from test cricket at 31 would be a real shame for cricket, not just England.
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KP only plays for KP. He's not a team player. Personally, i think england may be better iff without him. I know he's a phenominal talent, but the team should be a group of people all pulling for one purpose. KP seems to want to pull in a different direction...
Although Cricket is a Team sport. It is very individual, imo.
Batting: Batsman versus Bowler
Bowling: Bowler Vs Batsman
Fielding: Normally 1 player chasing/ fielding a ball.
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But the team should be a group of people all pulling for one purpose. KP seems to want to pull in a different direction...
If this were the case New Zealand would be the best team in the world.
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It was obvious that everything was frosty when his team mates politely applauded his hundred with minimal enthusiasm.
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bullshit speculation story. If you want to see more of the pathetic stuff then go to the bleacher report and see the endless articles on "10 reasons why RVP will go", then 10 minutes later "10 reasons why RVP will stay". It will sort itself out but maybe they should write some more fairytales:-
1. Taylor played his last test (Ravi Bop back)
2. Ravi Bop played his last test (Taylor)
3. Tremlett played his last test (injury)
4. Bresnan played his last test (replaced by fit again Tremlett)
5. Finn played his last test (replaced with Onions)
and so on.
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Personally I don't feel KP is what he used to be batting wise. Just seems hes not that appreciative of being selected to play for England and wants to have games when and if he fancies it. Much rather see another player replace him that shows appreciation of playing for is country.
All to many sports are becoming driven by greed for money rather than the pride of playing for your country.
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Personally I don't feel KP is what he used to be batting wise....
Have you been living under a rock????! He just blazed 149 against arguably the best bowling attack in the world, including hitting the best fast bowler in the world straight back over his head for 6! This is after a couple of double centuries in the last 18 months, as well as his knock for Surrey v Lancs the other week - if anything Pieterson is back to his very best!
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No appreciate recently he has had some great innings with the bat, but just feel it seems he only performs when he has another agenda. It's as if his recent performances are to make the England selectors question whether they should pick him for the twenty20 world cup and let him have his own way.
When he applies himself he can still bat but just feel at times he gets out because he isn't too bothered or interested.
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I think that measured on talent alone KP would be a huge loss for the England team BUT his presence and current attitude could be quite divisive. How much effect is he having on the rest of the dressing room? If the answer is anything other than 'none' then I reckon Flower and Strauss will just cut him adrift.
Looking at it from their point of view you can't have a guy who wants to pick and choose what England games he plays....
He says it's absolutely not about money in the article but then says he wants to play the entire IPL and miss the early season England games.....Which one is it?
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Sky have a lot to answer for. They're the reason England have these Mickey Mouse Test series that begin increasingly early in the summer (!?). Two Tests in April/May against NZ - I'd let the ego play IPL, England would win anyway.
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IMO I think it's a big shame, who can honestly say they don't look forward to KP walking out to bat in a test match?
BUT I can't see the ECB backing down, they want to preserve test cricket and not go down the awful road the West Indies have by letting players pick and choose what they want to do for the sake of the IPL.
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The ECB want to save face.
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The ECB also do not like KP - why else would they continually be leaking his discussions to the media...
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It's a known fact that KP is "Tolerated" in the dressing room rather than liked.
Whilst I personally love watching KP bat (be honest, who doesn't) I don't believe he should be treated different to anyone else and if this hissy fit does stem from the IPL argument then let him play IPL and get rid from the test team. If he is allowed to play how long until we start seeing the same thing happening with the next generation of cricketers? By getting rid of KP (arguably one of the most gifted players ever to play the game...and I said gifted, not best) it shows the current and next crop of players that no-one is bigger than the England team.
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Let's face it no one is bigger than the game. There is life after KP
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The thing is, whatever you may think of his strutting peacock act, Pietersen does kind of have a point about his dealings with the ECB.
Post Freddie, he is their most marketable player - some would say that in overseas territories he may be their only one. As a result, they feel obliged to play him in every game going to appease home boards and TV rights holders and as such, its not unreasonable that he might feel a little jaded, and a bit hacked off when its seperately deemed okay for Strauss, Broad, Anderson, Swann et al to be rested.
Add in a meaningless series against a Kiwi side shorn of its only two world class players...
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Do you like everyone you work with?
A cricket team is made up of individuals who are responsible for their own performances.
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The thing is, whatever you may think of his strutting peacock act, Pietersen does kind of have a point about his dealings with the ECB.
Post Freddie, he is their most marketable player - some would say that in overseas territories he may be their only one. As a result, they feel obliged to play him in every game going to appease home boards and TV rights holders and as such, its not unreasonable that he might feel a little jaded, and a bit hacked off when its seperately deemed okay for Strauss, Broad, Anderson, Swann et al to be rested.
Add in a meaningless series against a Kiwi side shorn of its only two world class players...
Agree totally - also, what was the comeback for Swann's comments about KP? Nothing. They're hanging him out to dry to protect their face and income (which is what all ECB admin really care about in the end).
To go OTT, this is another nail in Test cricket's coffin. Attendances in England are falling, and throwing out the baby with the bathwater so earnest Englishmen like Joe Root get games will only end in tears. Would you pay £90 to watch a KP-less England bat?
p.s. Do NZ have world class players?
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I hope you're being sarcastic.
Not at all. I can't stand KP.
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To go OTT, this is another nail in Test cricket's coffin. Attendances in England are falling, and throwing out the baby with the bathwater so earnest Englishmen like Joe Root get games will only end in tears. Would you pay £90 to watch a KP-less England bat?
p.s. Do NZ have world class players?
I think Joe Root is a bit better than earnest - in fact, I reckon he'll go on to score pretty near to 8'000 test runs. But at this point in time, England do not need to be bringing him in for KP when Taylor is new to the international game and Strauss getting close to his last legs.
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I say drop him before the next test :D
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But he doesn't want to be rested he wants to play ipl big bash and whatever other new money laden 2020 competition is started. I think the ECB have no other option because once they allow him to do it then others will follow. Remember would he be the player he is now without England and the Ecb? My guess is no. Would he be worth as much without the opportunities given to him in England? Once again no? We are entering the era of specialists and the Ecb must do all it can to protect test cricket or the counties will be bankrupt. If it means losing the odd player then so be it. Remember he is 31 and until recently his form has been patchy and if he is causing probs in the dressing room well then some may not be too sad to lose him. We all agree he is an outstanding batsman and great to watch but also frustrating when he gives his wicket away. I think he will not renew his central contract, the money on offer for ipl and big bash is simply too great and he has achieved all he needs/wants to for England.
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I think Joe Root is a bit better than earnest - in fact, I reckon he'll go on to score pretty near to 8'000 test runs. But at this point in time, England do not need to be bringing him in for KP when Taylor is new to the international game and Strauss getting close to his last legs.
That was my point - he's a prospect who could be very good. Cook will get 10,000 Test runs, but it's like watching someone butcher a kitten.
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We are entering the era of specialists and the Ecb must do all it can to protect test cricket or the counties will be bankrupt.
But that's my point. Why take away the box office player people really want to see. Him not being there means fewer people will stump up to watch attritional, earnest Test cricket.
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That was my point - he's a prospect who could be very good. Cook will get 10,000 Test runs, but it's like watching someone butcher a kitten.
Root is considerably better to watch than Cook!
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But he doesn't want to be rested he wants to play ipl big bash and whatever other new money laden 2020 competition is started. I think the ECB have no other option because once they allow him to do it then others will follow. Remember would he be the player he is now without England and the Ecb? My guess is no. Would he be worth as much without the opportunities given to him in England? Once again no? We are entering the era of specialists and the Ecb must do all it can to protect test cricket or the counties will be bankrupt. If it means losing the odd player then so be it. Remember he is 31 and until recently his form has been patchy and if he is causing probs in the dressing room well then some may not be too sad to lose him. We all agree he is an outstanding batsman and great to watch but also frustrating when he gives his wicket away. I think he will not renew his central contract, the money on offer for ipl and big bash is simply too great and he has achieved all he needs/wants to for England.
Playing devils advocate here - KP wants to spend some time with his family (so, for example, would have wanted to miss the West Indies ODIs) and yes, wants to make a few quid from the IPL. Lets be fair to him though - we're talking a few MILLION quid, life changing money - and to do so, he'd like to either arrive at the very last minute for or preferably be rested from a series that matters less than zero because the opposition are nowhere close to world class and have already released their two bets players from it. Chance for someone like Joe Root to make a low pressure debut to me...
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In England people watch test cricket because it is attritional earnest cricket and many of those people are prob not big fans of KP and their decision does not rest on whether KP or other big names are playing. Ashes tickets are sold out in advance, you have no idea who is going to be playing. Freddie is gone tickets still sell, England are still a top side the same will the case with KP. With regard your comment about Cook I love watching him bat but then I have never hit a six in my life. Test cricket is the pinnacle and it's not how you score but how many you score. If the kids at my club learnt that then maybe we would win a few more games on a weekend!
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Can you guys answer me a question and if you had the opportunity of making £2 million for a few months work abroad or being loyal to your country for 1 month out of the year would you be saying no?
I think i know the answer
The thing that gets me is that everyone is getting on KP's back because he isn't liked...
If this was Flintoff/Anderson/Swann etc that was asking the same thing I dare say no one would bat an eyelid or say anything because they are 'liked'
Yet a friend of mine spend the night with the England team in the WI a few years ago and he said that KP was the most friendly, down to earth guy out of the team and it was the likes of Owai Shah and Monty that was the most arrogant and wouldn't give him the time of day.
Its funny what can be potrayed by the media and TV - Don't believe everything you hear...
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Playing devils advocate here - KP wants to spend some time with his family (so, for example, would have wanted to miss the West Indies ODIs) and yes, wants to make a few quid from the IPL. Lets be fair to him though - we're talking a few MILLION quid, life changing money - and to do so, he'd like to either arrive at the very last minute for or preferably be rested from a series that matters less than zero because the opposition are nowhere close to world class and have already released their two bets players from it. Chance for someone like Joe Root to make a low pressure debut to me...
I am not against kp decision, in fact I agree if it was me at his time of life having had a successful test career, young family then I would say thank you England but I have to put family and earnings first and play ipl and big bash while I am still fit and healthy. The issue is kp wants his cake and eat it. He wants to an England player and play the big money tournaments because being an England player still has kudos and endorsement earnings which he will lose.
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I love Test cricket, but you need variety, something that makes it special. Otherwise why not go to a county match?
There's now too much Test cricket in England. It won't be the pinnacle if individuals like KP are shunted out the door by pig-headed bean counters.
Hugh Morris is Nero in this little play.
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Can you guys answer me a question and if you had the opportunity of making £2 million for a few months work abroad or being loyal to your country for 1 month out of the year would you be saying no?
I think i know the answer
The thing that gets me is that everyone is getting on KP's back because he isn't liked...
If this was Flintoff/Anderson/Swann etc that was asking the same thing I dare say no one would bat an eyelid or say anything because they are 'liked'
Yet a friend of mine spend the night with the England team in the WI a few years ago and he said that KP was the most friendly, down to earth guy out of the team and it was the likes of Owai Shah and Monty that was the most arrogant and wouldn't give him the time of day.
Its funny what can be potrayed by the media and TV - Don't believe everything you hear...
I heard kp texted Irish guys and gave hints and tips during Caribbean wc a few years ago. I like him and would love to spend time with. He could teach me how to hit a six!
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think KP get all this flak is crap tbh.
Lets be honest, We do play way way way too many ODis (majority are pointless). KP asks to sit out WIndies odi series to have a bit of a break ECB say no. Afterthe schedules the ecb put out to the players, espcially players like KP who has played in all 3 formats for numerous years now, what is so wrong about that! Kallis is missing the ODI series against us, is he getting forced to retire?
In terms of the IPL, ECB need to use their brains. why arrange a test series whilst the IPL is on? oh wait, its cause the ecb want money as well?
KP still does it utmost for England, as seen by his innings on saturday, and his celebration when he reached a 100. shame no one appreciates the cricketing genius he is and the pressure he is always put under. He is the most publiscised england cricketer (you may argue that he has drawn that upon himself) but even still he is a family man now, and he deserves to be cut a little slack. The media have turned him into some sort of monster, when i can guarantee you, if you ask people who have met the REAL kp (not the one prtrayed in the papers) he is a kind honest and funny man.
Lets face it, we need KP, and i for one, will not be as pumped watching us play test cricket with KP not in the side.
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Can you guys answer me a question and if you had the opportunity of making £2 million for a few months work abroad or being loyal to your country for 1 month out of the year would you be saying no?
I think i know the answer
it's hardly that simple a choice though is it.
He already probably earns more than all of us
His current job is representing his country in a privileged role
He can still attend parts of the IPL and walk away with the proportionate salery
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Can you guys answer me a question and if you had the opportunity of making £2 million for a few months work abroad or being loyal to your country for 1 month out of the year would you be saying no?
I think i know the answer
The thing that gets me is that everyone is getting on KP's back because he isn't liked...
If this was Flintoff/Anderson/Swann etc that was asking the same thing I dare say no one would bat an eyelid or say anything because they are 'liked'
Yet a friend of mine spend the night with the England team in the WI a few years ago and he said that KP was the most friendly, down to earth guy out of the team and it was the likes of Owai Shah and Monty that was the most arrogant and wouldn't give him the time of day.
Its funny what can be potrayed by the media and TV - Don't believe everything you hear...
He wouldn't be being disloyal to his country for 1 month out of the year he would be disloyal to his country....full stop...and the same would apply to any other England contracted player who decided he would rather play a hit and giggle competition in the subcontinent. You seem toforget that the England contracted players are comfortably the best paid of any in the world...
And based on your point that we shouldn't believe everything we hear then why should we believe you regarding KP's character? 'A mate said' is just about as tenuous as it gets!! :D
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Just because he's paid well doesn't mean he should turn down the oppotunity to earn more for him and his family if he has the chance to do so
and i never mentioned believing what i said, my point was believe nothing until you find out the truth for yourself
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Ok forget abt KP's persona & money for a minute and think of it like this...
Aussies did this to Symonds and now English are doing this to KP, characters are important for the game, they bring in ppl and make it interesting, dont kill them / run them out of the game because of some silly rules/policies. Rules, Policies are important and required as well to keep order and things organized but sometimes common sense needs to prevail. Guy wants a break from one format then why not? Most other countries let their players rest now, even the Aussies. What if your best test batsman was your worst one day player e.g. Rahul Dravid for short while, would you impose a similar rule? no because they are 2 different formats, so why put T-20 and ODI in the same bucket?
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KP is pretty much the only player who hasn't been rested in almost his whole career - I think Flower and the selectors have been making a point that his scheduled rest period is the IPL and if he plays in that, then he wont get rested from an international.
KP is saying that everyone else gets rested and that the IPL is a major place to learn how to play on the sub continent and to play in "pressure" situations and it isn't his fault he is the only one good enough to get a gig.
so rock and hard place. Is there room for a tour off - yes - but the issue is that if KP has a tour off, he can't be seen to be playing anywhere else when England are playing.
KP has been a hugely positive influence at Surrey - his work rate and pratice sessions are legendary - he isn't like Symonds who has drinking issues - everyone who meets him says he is generous and courteous and the media image isn't how he is in real life.
For me it is imperative that both sides are able to back down and come to a compromise which allows KP to play as much international cricket as he can - he is wonderful to watch and seeing him playing rubbish 2020 village smashes around the world would be a total waste of one of the finest talents of a generation.
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hear hear
very eruditely put, Sir Buzz
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Problem is, the Andocracy seem to have decided that KP must be "disciplied" pour encourager les autres!
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We had a lad in our first team around the Hampshire squad when KP was there. Said he would drop you in a instant, if someone more important in his eyes entered the room. Don't forget when he left Notts, they tipped all his kit over the side from the changing room. Hope he doesn't quit but KP has only ever looked out for himself so i won't be surprised if he walks!
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KP is pretty much the only player who hasn't been rested in almost his whole career - I think Flower and the selectors have been making a point that his scheduled rest period is the IPL and if he plays in that, then he wont get rested from an international.
KP is saying that everyone else gets rested and that the IPL is a major place to learn how to play on the sub continent and to play in "pressure" situations and it isn't his fault he is the only one good enough to get a gig.
so rock and hard place. Is there room for a tour off - yes - but the issue is that if KP has a tour off, he can't be seen to be playing anywhere else when England are playing.
KP has been a hugely positive influence at Surrey - his work rate and pratice sessions are legendary - he isn't like Symonds who has drinking issues - everyone who meets him says he is generous and courteous and the media image isn't how he is in real life.
For me it is imperative that both sides are able to back down and come to a compromise which allows KP to play as much international cricket as he can - he is wonderful to watch and seeing him playing rubbish 2020 village smashes around the world would be a total waste of one of the finest talents of a generation.
I wasn't comparing KP to Symonds, Symonds had issues agreed but instead my point was adminstration might end the career of KP earlier than it should just like Symonds' ended.
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We had a lad in our first team around the Hampshire squad when KP was there. Said he would drop you in a instant, if someone more important in his eyes entered the room. Don't forget when he left Notts, they tipped all his kit over the side from the changing room. Hope he doesn't quit but KP has only ever looked out for himself so i won't be surprised if he walks!
He could well be a psychopath, but he's too good to drop!
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For me this screams of what at times is wrong with the English mindset in sport. For years in the 70's through to the early 00's we have been idolising the rest of the cricketing world who's match winners have all been world beaters and our mere mortals aren't up to scratch. We finally get someone in our side who is genuinely feared by all across the world and we lambast him and treat him like a child. It's a shame as he will play IPL and probably continue to amaze every one as he always does.
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I am not going to comment on who is right or wrong, but one thing I can say from my 2 meetings with KP during a charity event is that he is one of the most humble, polite, generous and friendly cricketers I have met till now. His media image is in total contrast to his real life.
There is not a speck of doubt that he trains harder than any other player, if fitter than most and still has the talent to turn the course of a game single-handedly.
Some of the younger guys can pick-up a lot of from KP - train hard, stay fit, aggression and self-confidence/belief. Even with the world against him, he never gives-up - in fact works harder and hits back harder with performances.
Without KP the English middle order will be even more unsettled, unpredictable and highly inexperienced.
If Eng have any doubt on his capabilities, then why was he sent to open the innings yesterday? Simple because right from Andy Flower to Gooch and all the other guys knew that only KP could change the course of this test in England's favour if he got a quick 50-70. If he was selfish he would have insisted that he play at his normal position.
I think it is his very high degree of self confidence with portrays him as being selfish.
There is not a single player who is not selfish - in fact yet to see a human being who is or has never been selfish. We all are only the degree varies - so the guys who call KP selfish should first prove that they are not selfish.
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http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/cricket/article-2184911/Kevin-Pietersen-conundrum-England--The-Top-Spin.html
worth a read - from the editor of Wisden
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For me, KP seems to be a very committed and hard working individual, and he has been a great servant over his time with the England team. He is one of the best batsman in the world on his day, and his record is up there with the best. To lose him at any point would be a big loss to the England team - he is that good - but to lose him right now would leave a big hole in the team. Seriously, since Collingwood "retired" (or was forced to, depends on what you think happened), they have yet to find his replacement. They tried Morgan, who in 16 tests averages just over 30; then Prior got moved up with Patel coming in at seven and that failed; then Bairstow came in and failed to seize his chance (though he does deserve another one at a later date); then they went to Bopara (again) and he failed (again); and now they're trying James Taylor, who showed some promise, but needs time to adapt to international cricket. But so far this year England have used 5 different number six batsmen, and so far none of them have been able to really take hold of that position. So can England afford to let KP retire, which then puts two spots up for debate?
I don't think they can afford to let that happen, because the hole that has been left by Collingwood is nothing compared to the hole that KP would leave. If they can't replace Collingwood, how are they going to replace a batsmen like KP? I'm not sure they can, but I suppose there are three ways they could do it;
1. Bell moves up to four, which then sees Taylor promoted to five, Prior to six, and Patel or another all rounder at seven.
2. Bell moves up to four, which then sees Taylor and another batsman at five and six, with Prior at seven.
3. Bell stays at five, which then sees Taylor and another batsman at four and six, with Prior at seven.
Now in each situation it would take time for that new team to gel, but the problem is the English public expecting things to happen straight away. Morgan's hit and miss start to his test career put a ton of pressure on him. Some argue it was his technique that led him to fail, but I think that the pressure and expectancy placed upon him played a bigger role. After all, Cook and KP's technique has never been perfect and has often been questioned, so it is not beyond possibility that Morgan could have adapted under different circumstances. But that pressure to replace Collingwood, and to win every match, has meant that every set up so far has been under pressure from the outset. I think England have found his replacement in Taylor, but if you take away KP then England have lost two experienced mid order batsmen who that averaged 40 and 50. With that loss, the pressure only gets more for Taylor, and for that matter, everyone in the team.
For me, what England need to do is keep KP at all costs, because at 32 the lad should play well into his mid thirties. Even though his form has been questioned at times, his lowest yearly average was 41.5 in 2010, and since then it has improved. So he is still contributing at a very high level and is very important to the team. As far as I'm concerned, having KP in that side is a fear factor for other teams because they know what he is capable of doing. On his day he is arguably one of the most destructive batsman on the planet and can turn a game on its head - like he did in the last test. Take that away and it will affect the England team. There might be questions around his attitude, and his relationship with management, but ultimately he is too good to let go and that is especially the case while a question mark remains around Strauss' position in the team. In the past three years he has not averaged beyond the low to mid 30s, and last year averaged in the late 20s. If anything, England need to prioritise keeping KP and potentially look at replacing Strauss in the side, with the captaincy going to Cook, and the opening slot going to someone like Denly who has performing quite well, or maybe Compton who has had a very good season and used to open for Middlesex. The worrying thing here is if KP does go, and then is followed by Strauss if he is dropped; that leaves three unproven spots in the team. So keeping KP until the sixth place is solved, and then potentially the new opening spot is solved, for me, should be a priority for the England management.
However, if KP wants to retire and no longer has the desire to play test cricket, or wants to pick and choose what tests he plays and which he does not, then I think it would be best to say goodbye now and move on, rather than wait around. As good as he is, no one is bigger than the team.
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He wants to not play in the NZ series, which I can see his point of several of NZ's best players are at the IPL and won't be playing.
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If Warne was still playing for Australia he would definitely play in the T20 tournaments around the world, and the Aussie board would not have adopted the same stance that the ECB have to KP.
His reputation among the media is unfair, he is a supreme trainer, after his failures in the UAE he said that he was unfit, by his own admissions, so without being asked to, he has come back fitter and stronger and made a 'daddy' hundred against the best bowling attack in the world, and besides Cook, is the only one to have scored a hundred this series.
The ECB needs KP, he does not need them to earn money.
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Another blog on this
http://cricketwithballs.com/2012/08/07/kp-to-divorce-his-parents/
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The KP plot thickens. I used the word pinnacle in one of my posts and it was mentioned in these tweets on same day! Is the mystery tweeter a forum reader!
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/cricket/19183540
Clearly big split in the dressing room which may not be repairable.
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Honest this all like kids school games !!! Who said this who said that get on with it and play cricket
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reading this is quality lets get 2 things right
1.KP is possibly England best batsman of the last 20 years for which is longer than most can remember.
2.Joe Root are people serious he needs to do it at county level first
For all his vaults KP is quality and there comes a price well worth paying.
Putting Cook in any bracket with Root is laughable Cook is proven at the very highest level Root is not even at county level
For me it is simple keep your best players playing and agree with the man who said "do you like everybody you work with".
For me KP is the leading light in a very average batting line up and has been for a good number of years and although MR 1 series got much of the accolade after the ashes 2005 it was KP who was pivotal in changing our mentality.
Game changers come very seldomly in cricket Gilchrist was one there has not been that many others i would like him to continue for a long time to come at all costs..
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Some interesting points there Dave and i find myself a little confused by the whole thing, i feel there are a number of issues which are going on within the dressing room and ive heard that a number of players are causing problems within the dressing room and not just KP.
That info was released by an ex England bowler who is a very good friend of kp so could be a little stick up for my best mate but i think there is more to this than meets the eye and there is certinly unrest in the camp which is very disappointing, i find myself agreeing with some of KP points and some points from the ecb however id like to know the whole truth before jumping one way or the other.
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Does all this childish nonsense have anything to do with Swann being dropped - bizarre decision if it wasn't some form of punishment for his part?
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again this is my thoughts no evidence to back this up but i do believe swann was not dropped for strictly playing reasons, a number of players are causing problems in the dressing room not just KP ? Broad Swann KP Anderson are those i believe to be behind some of the issues.
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(http://d3j5vwomefv46c.cloudfront.net/photos/large/634578014.jpg?key=8711115&Expires=1344637128&Key-Pair-Id=APKAIYVGSUJFNRFZBBTA&Signature=eFQY-Tk9PzPzKhv~3XzJ8~CgdB0Z6gjNi3Jkxr0Oi0tbLo~FwwRnnfzFxQiEB3pgG70FliiseMWV1HX~2uSFHLPK1oVrrD52UBYj0vYeh1krs~Bfn6Oyo7~sTKu~8gkdBOz-egEM5WMObR4-S~CGaPKh5rQctayAOCwcXAiQN-Y_)
KP being investigated by the ECB for texting Steyn and AB De Villiers during the last test.
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Cant find this article on the DM website? Where did you find this Tom?
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On the back of tomorrows paper. Will be on their site tomorrow I reckon
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Surely if he has been texting the opposition abusing our skipper and coach that's him done?
To be honest just let him merc himself in 20/20s round the world now - good riddance if this ends up being true!
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([url]http://d3j5vwomefv46c.cloudfront.net/photos/large/634578014.jpg?key=8711115&Expires=1344637128&Key-Pair-Id=APKAIYVGSUJFNRFZBBTA&Signature=eFQY-Tk9PzPzKhv~3XzJ8~CgdB0Z6gjNi3Jkxr0Oi0tbLo~FwwRnnfzFxQiEB3pgG70FliiseMWV1HX~2uSFHLPK1oVrrD52UBYj0vYeh1krs~Bfn6Oyo7~sTKu~8gkdBOz-egEM5WMObR4-S~CGaPKh5rQctayAOCwcXAiQN-Y_[/url])
KP being investigated by the ECB for texting Steyn and AB De Villiers during the last test.
But ECB is not interested in investigating who has / has been leaking closed door / confidential talks between them and KP to media. Very surprising.
All seems very one-sided with ECB using their position to dominate.
Both English cricket and KP will loose if a amicable solution is not found soon.
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It baffles me that people are surprised that KP 'plays for himself'.
He left the country of his birth to play international cricket for another team, albeit after being treated badly. Nelson Mandela he is not
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Michael Vaughan has just posted on twitter he has in retired himself !! Aparently sky sports news states there is a you tube video but I can't find it :(
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Thats a lie
Here it is :o
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Thats a lie
Here it is :o
Am I the only person who can't see this?
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Oh dear forgot the link
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kiaZnXayjTQ
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am i the only one who doesnt care if kevin pietersen never palys cricket again? Gives a youngster who actually wants to play a chance.
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It's strange I'm taking kps side ! If Like a few rumours atelier that there is a certain "click" in the dressing room who don't have an issiue with kp why should he bother people forget that not only did he score the big innings last week but he also took key wickets otherwise we would never of even been in with a shot of having a crack at winning .
His celebration when scoring the ton last week proves he still without a shadow of a doubt loves playing for England !
Having met the man on numerous occasions he is a gentleman who does not have an ego that makes me think it's all about him .
The west Indies test match poring down with rain !! The only england player to out an announcement over the tannoy to say he will be meeting fans and signing autographs !
People need to look at the England squad and realise that maybe kp is not the trouble having met Stuart broad as well all I can say is he is one hell of an ego maniac
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Oh dear forgot the link
[url]http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=kiaZnXayjTQ[/url]
fair play KP. he gets emotional, made a bad choice and is doing what he can to put it right. if he misses out he knows why and if ECB leave him out they've left out one of the best batsmen in the world as a punishment. Hopefully he'll be back playing in all formats, he makes the game more interesting. Either way, KP will live and the ECB will survive.
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am i the only one who doesnt care if kevin pietersen never palys cricket again? Gives a youngster who actually wants to play a chance.
i care best batsmani have seen in 20 years done the 3 lions
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i care best batsmani have seen in 20 years done the 3 lions
Exactly, don't understand people who aren't bothered if he retires, he lights up the England team.
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So KP has been dropped for the next test against S.Africa.
Madness
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I imagine we will see kp return in the one day series we will get some sort of bulcrap story how this was for him to rest and sort his head let him go back to the county's matches will probs get treated with more respect !
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Pietersen is an arrogant idiot, who hides behind his agent and celebrity friends. But he's also Englands best player.
No-one in the Aussie side liked Shane Warne, but they recognised he was a World class player. Can't believe KP has been dropped.
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I think bairstow is a cracking talent but don't bring him in in the most important match of the series !!!! We loose goodbye number 1 spot !!
Kp can be arrogant cos he knows he is the best !
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Regardless of the outcome. It should never have got this far and have been dealt with so publically with leaks, youtube videos and interviews. KP and the ECB are both at blame for that.
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Once the issue appeared the ecb should of got kp straight away say with him and found out what the hell was really going on .
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Replace KP with Swann, 5 man attack for the last test.
Personally I don't see a way back for KP
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Replace KP with Swann, 5 man attack for the last test.
Personally I don't see a way back for KP
Not even a swift return in the odi series ?
Just take the test abcence as a telling off ?
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Kp will be back, if he isn't then it is the fault of the English management.
he is the best we have and will have for the next 10 years, we shouldn't just through him away.
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Does this not make him look bigger if he gets recalled.
That he would have made the difference after 100 in last test.
Surely make do + sort out after last test
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He doesn't fit in. Swann and Broad can write derogatory comments in their autobiography's and read out tweets posted by their mates in the dressing room and no action is taken.
But a Daily Mail journalist alleges that KP text a SA player something derogatory and he's dropped, with little proof at all.
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I would have preferred to have seen Woakes called up and england play a 5 man attack
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He doesn't fit in. Swann and Broad can write derogatory comments in their autobiography's and read out tweets posted by their mates in the dressing room and no action is taken.
But a Daily Mail journalist alleges that KP text a SA player something derogatory and he's dropped, with little proof at all.
I think there is plenty of proof or they wouldn't be doing it. Kp knew he had gone too far hence his begging and in my opinion embarrassing YouTube video. Think broad and swann's behaviour no way comparable to what kp said in press conference followed by these text messages. The Ecb have taken the tougher decision and i applaud them and agree wholeheartedly. No man is bigger than team. Better players than kp don't behave or have behaved like him.
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But a Daily Mail journalist alleges that KP text a SA player something derogatory and he's dropped, with little proof at all.
If the ECB don't know the content of these alleged text messages or indeed if those messages were actually sent then the ECB have effectively said that KP is guilty until proven innocent. The South African management have said that the messages weren't sent to the players quoted in the article but they have acknowledged that messages were sent.
Reading and listening to the ECB statements it sounds as though KP needs to come out and publicly acknowledge that the text messages, if there were any, were not critical of Flower or Strauss before KP will be selected again and the ECB even delayed naming the squad to allow KP the opportunity to do so.
The whole sorry saga has been handled extremely poorly and I don't think the text messages can be the real reason KP has been dropped, if the alleged text messages are the reason for the dropping then KP isn't the only one with an ego......
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I think there is plenty of proof or they wouldn't be doing it. Kp knew he had gone too far hence his begging and in my opinion embarrassing YouTube video. Think broad and swann's behaviour no way comparable to what kp said in press conference followed by these text messages. The Ecb have taken the tougher decision and i applaud them and agree wholeheartedly. No man is bigger than team. Better players than kp don't behave or have behaved like him.
'he has failed to confirm that he did not send derogatory texts about Andrew Strauss and Andy Flower to South Africa players during the Headingley Test.
It was an allegation, according to England's managing director, Hugh Morris, that unless unproven undermined "a unity of purpose and trust.'
The allegation must be unproven (i.e it hasn't been proven, but they want him to prove he didn't) or at least that's how I read it.
Edit: I suppose reading this again - it may mean they've seen the texts, but don't have the phone records to 100% prove it's him. With him failing to refute them they're 99% certain.
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Doesn't this more then remind everyone of the Peter Moores saga? One man believing everything should run around him... I Know someone mentioned Warne, but I'd argue he was a far more consistent performer than kp has been?
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Lets be honest here, we all have or have had team mates who we think aren't up to the standard, and have told our friends or other people that opinion, its not a crime to do so. For me, all 11 being best friends isn't important, and it does not, in my experience, usually doesn't happen. You don't have to like them all, nor even respect them, as long as you treat them in a proffessional manner and get on with the game. This has probably not been a secret within the dressing room for months, so why make a big deal of it now?
All KP wants to do is win, and if he believes some of his team mates are hindering those ambitions, why shouldn't he discuss this amongst friends (despite the "friends" being a little innappropriate)
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I don't buy that.
If it is proven he did send the texts, do you KP fans really believe he should be allowed to continue in the team?
I don't care if he is the best batsman, I would have dropped him, I can't see that they could play as a unit with his divisive influence in there.
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Completely agree.
For me the most amazing thing about all this is the fact that one of the best batsmen of his generation, winner of 3 ashes series, t20 winner and player of the tournament, redefined batting, shot making etc, can still come across as such an unlikeable, selfish brat
Whoever is advising him really should have been ditched a long time ago.
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I've been a big fan of KP for years but he's really crossed a line here. The video was just propaganda as he knew he was going to be dropped.
It's a big call from England an shows some bravery. I have a horrible feeling it could be the end for KP or Strauss/flower. If England win then I dont see w way back for KP, however should they lose there is alot of pressure transformed to Strauss/flower (not just for dropping KP but looking back at a years test cricket England have hardly replicated previous form) plus thu won't be number 1 in the world. After all this aggro, could either of them jack it in? Especially if they have to pick KP again - interesting times ahead
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Excuse typos, damn fat fingers on my phone :-)
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Such a pity that a test series of this size has been over shadowed by KP and the ECB... Well here is hoping that England are not at the races this weekend and SA can get the win... :D :D :D
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Parody account annouced by Piers Morgan as @bailsthebadger
You'll see I called that on the 11th August - and that PiersMorgan followed me today. Coincidence?
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Parody account annouced by Piers Morgan as @bailsthebadger
You'll see I called that on the 11th August - and that PiersMorgan followed me today. Coincidence?
I think Liam mentioned he was followed by Piers as well...
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http://www.facebook.com/blackcatcricket
Shameless plug for a poll we've set up on our page on this issue...
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• Richard Bailey, a cricket fan from Nottingham, claimed responsibility last night for the “KP Genius” parody Twitter account that is said to have upset Kevin Pietersen. “When I saw it was potentially causing harm and upsetting folk, I shut it down,” Bailey said. “I would like to apologise to anyone ... involved with England Cricket who I may have put in an awkward or embarrassing position.”
Although this twitter account does seem an drop in the ocean to everything else that is going on...
The Saffa's should get the Sir Alex Fergerson Mind Games Award for the pressure they have added to this situation.
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The KP genius account was created by Bailey and on the same night there are pics on Twitter of Bailey and Stuart Broad socialising
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supporting SA for this test. hope we get skittled for sod all. disgraceful from ecb
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What i don't get is...
England players acuse KP of sending texts, he can't prove he didn't, he gets dropped
KP accuses england players of being behind twitter accounts, they can't prove otherwise, why aren't the rest of the england team dropped?
what ever happened to innocent until proven guilty?
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As I understand it it's because he didn't deny doing it, which kind of damns him anyway. The England players did all deny the twitter thing.
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What i don't get is...
England players acuse KP of sending texts, he can't prove he didn't, he gets dropped
KP accuses england players of being behind twitter accounts, they can't prove otherwise, why aren't the rest of the england team dropped?
what ever happened to innocent until proven guilty?
ecb havent even seen the texts or even checked if there were texts sent.
its a joke.
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Then why does Pietersen not simply sign the statement saying there was no texts?
The ball was in his court to apologise and move on. He chose not to - enjoy the IPL Kev!
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i dont often agree with piers morgan, but this is extremely well put.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/cricket/19253591
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I got in contact with Piers last night, and let him know the source of the tweets. Kinda feel like this has gone a little too far now though!
This is the best write up on Pietersen I've seen thus far: http://theoldbatsman.blogspot.co.uk/2012/08/kp-and-art-of-war.html
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If the twitter account was done by a mate of Stuart Broad – it suggests that KP and Broad don’t get on and it is not a surprise that KP gets bored with Strauss’ captaincy in the field, which is the sit back and wait style rather than the proactive Michael Clarke style – which I am sure KP would prefer. To be honest I have been shouting at the TV on occasions with Strauss’ captaincy so I can’t blame him.
The text message thing is weird – I don’t really get what the issue is with texting a mate on the opposition – it is a little unprofessional to text “Banter” taking the "michael" out of your captain – but hardly a sacking offence, but KP is at fault for this, he has clearly been badmouthing the Eng setup to them and the Saffas have then leaked that, who can blame them.
I wonder if KP has lost all respect for Strauss and Flower (as well as some of the other players) – and when that happens, you get friction as he won’t be interested in their views or will be derogatory about their performances.
When a team is performing then there are fewer of these issues, but when the (other) batsmen are not scoring runs and the bowlers are not taking wickets, the issues snowball. All the batsmen were terrible in the winter, most have been comparatively poor this summer, the bowlers have been brilliant over the winter, but subsequently poor – I suspect believing their own self importance. This team are used to winning and used to steam rolling their opposition at home, the Saffa’s are the only team to have come here and been demonstratively better in all aspects of the game than the Aussies before 2005 – so it isn’t a surprise there are some team unity issues.
Worth noting that KP is happy to speak through Matt Prior - the only batsman who has been consitent during the last few months...
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Think the implication is that Prior chased up KP to sort the matter out as he had finally had enough, not sure it was Pietersens choice. Interesting that it was Prior - probably the ultimate team man going on his run outs and dismissals in setting the pace.
There was also a suggestion that the texts were advising SA how to get Strauss out, regardless of how true that is there must come a point when a South African born player texting the South African team derogatory things about his skipper pauses before pressing send.
This especially after the criticism of him during the warm up when he was palling up to the saffas, not to mention the non speaking to Taylor.
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any accusation that KP doesnt give 100% for england is just crap tbh
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Nobody has said that though? It's entirely possible to give 100% playing wise yet still be a negative influence.
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There was also a suggestion that the texts were advising SA how to get Strauss out............
Not sure if this would be true!! They are already getting Strauss out very well without any help or advice! So this suggestion sounds rubbish. More likely they were joking about how easy it has been to get him out so far!!!!! ???
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Yeah agreed Pete, but as I say any kind of text relating to any kind of captaincy issue is at the very least a terrible act of judgement.
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Just to add that it wasn't my suggestion - I believe it was reported in that bastion of truth that is the Daily Mail(!)
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I knew it wasn't you fella! I figured it was one of our fair minded tabloids!! :(
It is just funny that they suggested that the texts were about how to get Strauss out! ;)
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Whole thing has gone far too far. Broad is clearly been providing info to that guy for the twitter parody, but they seem very fond of him. Bresnan made some ludicrous comments earlier that we may even be stronger with bairstow which is a complete joke.
I wonder if kp could go and play for the saffers now, i would incourage him to. Does anyone know if it is possible?
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After Bresnan's comments i'm awaiting South Africa dropping Smith/Kallis/Amla/De Villiers as teams are according to him better without their best players
I hate to say it but I hope the England team get absoloutly crushed in this test match and have to grovel to get KP to come back and play and the dressing room has to apologise to him
What a complete joke
I wish there was a social media revolt and no one turned up for this test match to watch it in protest
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my view is that ECB have tried to use the situation to muscle-in KP to withdraw his retirement from ODIs and T20s. Apart from this I don't see any benefit.
If this is the case then it proves the point that Eng need KP in the shorter version and as evident will go to any length and use all possible tactics to get him back playing the shorter version.
In a nutshell, shameful few days for ECB and KP, disgraceful way to sort out differences and very biased approach from ECB in handling the allegations and KP's actions - true ECB policy - horses for courses - diff yardsticks for diff players.
there is not a single player in the English system who can come close to KP in confidence, talent and will to fight back.
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As previously KP versus the ECB, only this time over when he wants to play and who should be in the team rather than who should be coach.
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After Bresnan's comments i'm awaiting South Africa dropping Smith/Kallis/Amla/De Villiers as teams are according to him better without their best players
I hate to say it but I hope the England team get absoloutly crushed in this test match and have to grovel to get KP to come back and play and the dressing room has to apologise to him
What a complete joke
I wish there was a social media revolt and no one turned up for this test match to watch it in protest
Thats not exactly what he said was it though? He tried to downplay the situation by saying that another player could come in and make the team as good or better. I don't think for a moment that Bresnan meant it like that, and would publically come out and say it if that was the truth.
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Personally I think the ECB were a bit naughty putting Bresnan up anyway - should have been Strauss or Flower taking the questions today.
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Whole thing has gone far too far. Broad is clearly been providing info to that guy for the twitter parody, but they seem very fond of him. Bresnan made some ludicrous comments earlier that we may even be stronger with bairstow which is a complete joke.
I wonder if kp could go and play for the saffers now, i would incourage him to. Does anyone know if it is possible?
I don't think KP could play for SA.. Under South African law once you accept citizenship for another country you loose you SA citizenship.... And even if he could he would never be selected... SA does not want this garbage on there door step..
Who knows this little situation might galvanize England... After all if the issue is KP in the dressing room then this test should be a cracker without him...
Bring on Thursday :)
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"It's one of those things where a talented player is being replaced by another," said Bresnan.
"So why should we miss a certain individual because he's unavailable for selection?"
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After Bresnan's comments i'm awaiting South Africa dropping Smith/Kallis/Amla/De Villiers as teams are according to him better without their best players
I hate to say it but I hope the England team get absoloutly crushed in this test match and have to grovel to get KP to come back and play and the dressing room has to apologise to him
What a complete joke
I wish there was a social media revolt and no one turned up for this test match to watch it in protest
ill drink to that!
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From Sky
Kevin Pietersen is believed to be in talks with the ECB over his England future after apparently apologising for sending texts to members of the South African team during the second Test.
The controversial batsman is alleged to have criticised some of his England team-mates in the texts, the content of which he refused to disclose to the ECB.
The selectors subsequently dropped Pietersen for this week's third and final Test at Lord's despite his stunning century in the draw at Headingley.
It is also believed that the ECB refused a request from Surrey for Pietersen to feature in their County Championship clash with Middlesex starting on Wednesday.
But the 32-year-old is reportedly in discussions with ECB officials which could lead to him being restored to the Twenty20 squad ahead of England's defence of the ICC World Twenty20 in September.
Pietersen announced his retirement from all limited-overs international cricket earlier this year, but he has since stated his desire to return to the one-day arena.
Former England captain and Surrey director Alec Stewart claimed that Pietersen has "apologised and would like to be involved" in all international cricket.
The ECB refused to comment on the reports, but they are expected to release a statement on Pietersen's future on Wednesday.
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Just watched the interview given by Strauss on sky and to say at times he looked a bit uncomfortable would be a fair comment but a more balanced opinion was given by him compared to Swann and Bresnan.
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Bresnan is stealing a living at Test level funny when you see him talk about no KP
I guess there a few of the boys network around Bresnan is not test class simple as that.
look at his last 5 tests he is lucky to get a run
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It's funny that the "number 1 " ranked team in the world continuously change their team all the time
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we have met our match the best side in a period of ordinary world test match cricket is South Africa.
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We could do with KP now!
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The whole KP farce seems to have gone very quiet now that Bairstow has been making some runs. Good choice by England to leave him out and well done to JB for standing up and making runs regardless of what happens in the rest of the match
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Don't think JB making runs has anything to do with it. It's gone quiet because ultimately the main thing is that England win this game.
It'll be back in the press at the end of this test.
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KP will be working for ESPN Star during the World Twenty20.
Does anyone else think he would be better served keeping a really low profile and not getting involved??
The best thing KP could do now is sack his advisors and get more sensible managers - then again, he might not listen to someone sensible.
http://www.espncricinfo.com/icc-world-twenty20-2012/content/current/story/579138.html
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KP will be working for ESPN Star during the World Twenty20.
Does anyone else think he would be better served keeping a really low profile and not getting involved??
The best thing KP could do now is sack his advisors and get more sensible managers - then again, he might not listen to someone sensible.
Whats espn star buzz ?
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he seems to have shane warne(who wants a punch up to resolve) and piers morgan
could'nt think of 2 worse people to advise KP. however,KP,fantastic player thou he is, has brought this on himself and is probably finished-there is always someone to take your place.
there might be some mileage in a 'clique' in the England dressing room that he is not part of but it's clear he does not do 'team england' only 'team kp'
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Who gets the last laugh? I bet KP will be a similar amount of money over those 2 weeks than some of the Team England players will make over the next year.
That's where the problem lies for the ECB. These issues will continue to bubble whilst they don't acknowledge the IPL and the English players need to earn money.
Must be infuriating being one of the best players in the world, yet seeing average New Zealand players earn 10x as much as you.
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Who are these average NZ players that are earning 10 times more than KP?
The endorsements that KP does must net him more than 95% of the world cricketers so why should he complain.
Greed seems to make KP want to earn more than anyone alse and that alone is sad for a man who is worth millions yet still wants more. He will lose some endorsements dues to this saga and his popularity will have taken a massive beating.
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NZ probably wasn't a great example, and 10 times was an exaggeration. But in general there's cricketers like Dan Christian and Johann Botha earning $500,000+ USD for a couple of weeks cricket. Then there's the SLPL and Big Bash, which pay on a slightly smaller (but still ludicrously large) scale.
A central contract with England is worth around only £350,000 for a years cricket. Pietersen is 32 with only 4/5 years left in him - who can blame a man for wanting to earn the money which will set his family up for life?
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Brendon Mcullum
Nathan Mcullum
Ross Taylor
to name but a few who will get to play the whole IPL and come back with probably more cash
to some people £20,000 is a good wage
to some £50,000 is good
to some it isn't
everything in life in all relative
you live to what life brings you and like someone earning £20,000 will want to earn £30,000
Someone like KP earning £1m will want to earn £2m
Who can blame someone for wanting the best life they can possibly give themselves?
No matter how much you earn you always want to earn more
No one would bat an eye lid if Bill Gates went down a different route in trying to earn more money so why do cricketers get different treatment?
Complete joke. You take what life gives you and KP as the opportunity to take more. I for one completely understand it.
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you are both right if money is the sole motivation in life.
if you look at chris gayle,out of the west indies side because of disputes with the WI board-he is the most in demand 2020 player and has now patched up his differences with them and is playing test cricket again.
why did chris gayle not just take the money and forget wearing the west indies shirt???
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i think there are double standards. . as Michael Holding says. . .no one disciplined Swann for slagging off KP in his book.
The man is a genius . . .look at his record and he puts bums on seats.
England will be a weaker team without him, imo Strauss is past his sell by date. Offload him.
The more money that is put into cricket the more this will happen. it happened in the packer era too. where players chose packer over country. The IPL and its counterpart T20 leagues are here to stay.
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I'm not saying money is the sole motivation in life what i'm saying is that the ECB should understand the reasons for KP doing what he's done and should schedule test cricket around the IPL etc
This will become much easier when (hopefully!) they remove ODI's completely and just have test cricket at T20's
A tour for me should consist of 3-5 test matches and 10 T20 matches with 2 T20 matches being played on the same day back to back
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looks like they are discussing it on the radio.the truth is leaking out slowly
1. Simon Hughes, BBC Test Match Special
"Most of the England players can't stand Pietersen. Some of them still give him the time of day but if you look at the team that has just played in the last Test against South Africa, the majority don't really like him."
you dont have to like someone to play in the same team of course,god knows weve all done it. ive read Swanns book and dont see what he said being anything like what is being splashed about.he said he was a bad captain,that's about all
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KP, Gayle and Afridi have all had issues with their respective boards and all are big names in the shorter game.
Forget what is paid just from the board its the endorsements and advertising that make the big bucks.
Amidst that is the pride you get from representing your country.
I love watching KP the player bat but has any other respectable cricketer slagged off their captain and team mates to the opposition? Has anyone ever caused so much unrest within the England team?
England will miss his batting but not much more. Swann, Broad, Bresnan have got away when they should have been disciplined for their respective comments against KP. KP is an arrogant and self centered and just happens to be a very good cricketer and feels that he is above the law.
Swann incidently is a comic who happens to be a very decent offspinner. His attitude has been dealt with in the past and forming a clique within the team was always going to cause problems for someone like KP who will always bite when mocked.
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you are both right if money is the sole motivation in life.
if you look at chris gayle,out of the west indies side because of disputes with the WI board-he is the most in demand 2020 player and has now patched up his differences with them and is playing test cricket again.
why did chris gayle not just take the money and forget wearing the west indies shirt???
There's a balance between representing your country and earning money. And through their disputes, WICB and CG have reached that. They allow their players to go off and play the T20 game, Gayle and many of the WI players played IPL and he was also due to play SLPL.
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One thing about this doesn't quite ring true though......IF KP is really only interested in money then why has he made himself available for ALL England cricket? Unless of course he's saying one thing and meaning another.....But KP doesn't do that? Does he? ;) Maybe the ECB think that if they let him back now it will be the start of more problems....?
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Forget what is paid just from the board its the endorsements and advertising that make the big bucks.
Amidst that is the pride you get from representing your country.
Endorsements for UK based players really aren't that much. There isn't the interest.
However if you go to the one of the World's fastest growing economies, where cricket is a religion and where players are worshipped - then yes then you're in the big bucks...
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i think there are double standards. . as Michael Holding says. . .no one disciplined Swann for slagging off KP in his book.
The man is a genius . . .look at his record and he puts bums on seats.
England will be a weaker team without him, imo Strauss is past his sell by date. Offload him.
The more money that is put into cricket the more this will happen. it happened in the packer era too. where players chose packer over country. The IPL and its counterpart T20 leagues are here to stay.
Great point about swann and his book and broad and his mate
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Now kp has attacked an ayrtek wearer surely Cbf will finally turn against him!
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/cricket/international/england/9501026/Kevin-Pietersen-in-trouble-again-as-talks-with-England-captain-Andrew-Strauss-held-up.html#
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What is said in the heat of the battle in the changing room should stay there, players should be able to criticise, pass judgement and help each other improve without fear of it being leaked to the press.
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Surely it all depends what is said though. If it was a constructive comment or a criticism that was warranted then fair enough. The fact however, that JT was on debut, just played a decent little innings and put on 140 odd with KP, would suggest that it was fairly unwarranted!
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Is this KP here, being seen trying to strangle James Taylor?
http://blogs.espncricinfo.com/shotselection/archives/2012/08/_philip_brown.php
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who is leaking this stuff? they should be fired first.
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i think england can do without KP,great player thou he is but I would doubt there is a real problem with the skipper and kp,straussy does not seem to type to hold grudges.
the truth will out soon thou but some of our newspapers have an agenda to bury KP,this may be because as a high earner and gifted player he can do what they could'nt.newspaper like the mail and telegraph do seem to have a very one sided bias.
for all KP has done wrong there seems a witch hunt against him.
for my money England will try to find a way back for KP and offer an olive branch to a gifted but disruptive player
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who is leaking this stuff? they should be fired first.
this is the big issue for me - KP may have behaved like a complete pr*** but it does smack of everyone ganging up on him when there are so many leaks and so much that reeksof double standards.
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Andy Flower was right there are issues of trust and mutual respect but that appears to go both ways.
KP has clearly been a bit of a prat and needed a dressing down, however it also appears that there is an agenda within part of the England camp and certain sections of the media to continue the mud slinging, otherwise why are we only hearing about the James Taylor comments now? The James Taylor story was first run by The People, now I don't read The People so I can't say if it is a big cricket paper in the print version but it would seem an odd source for a "big" cricket story as their website shows only sporadic articles about cricket.
An example of funny goings on in the media - on twitter this morning John Etheridge of the Sun sent a tweet with the alleged comment that KP made to James Taylor "You're the worst player I've seen for England", only to be quickly shot down by Steve James as apparently the alleged comment wasn't made directly by KP to James Taylor, John Etheridge has since deleted the Tweet.
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This is the danger with todays multimedia reporting, you never really know if whats alledged is true.just logged on to jon agnews twitter and he says no press have access to the dressing room.the stories come from the players.i guess some players leak info themselves.either kp is hated in that dressing room or there is an unhealthy clique developing.or maybe a bit of both.
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Is this KP here, being seen trying to strangle James Taylor?
[url]http://blogs.espncricinfo.com/shotselection/archives/2012/08/_philip_brown.php[/url]
No Tom - it was KP looking for other avenues of employment as he may have periods of unemployment between the IPLs! So he looks to be trying his hand as a ventriloquist! ;)
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I think some english players are trying their best to keep KP out by leaking stuff or spreading rumours...if it happened in the dressing room then it should stay there...
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there does seem to be a clique of Anderson, Cook, Swann, Broad, Bell with perhaps Bresnan and Finn as their underlings who have a disproportionate level of influence there...
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I think half the players should be ashamed of themselves
Half of them need to sort it out becausev there a real school play ground feeling
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Bring back KP. End of.
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there does seem to be a clique of Anderson, Cook, Swann, Broad, Bell with perhaps Bresnan and Finn as their underlings who have a disproportionate level of influence there...
How do you know all this?
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This all sounds completely skewed. People are pointing the fingers at all sorts of other players as being as bad as KP. I would suggest however that spats / arguments / criticisms must go on between this tight-knit bunch of players all the time.
Yet none of these are ever leaked. Referring you back to the phrase 'tight-knit' there must now be a reason why KP's comments and behaviour is constantly being leaked.
A person could come to the conclusion that he is universally disliked, disruptive and counter-productive to team spirit?
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And wins crickets matches too more than possibly the other tight nit lot
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I'm with Fattus on this one. There is too much mud flying around about KP for at least some of it not to be true. He might well be the best player we've got but if no one else in the side likes him, and having him in the side has an adverse impact on the other players performances then it's fairly obvious that he shouldn't be anywhere near the team. The best teams are more than a sum of their parts and in this case I think KP is a minus!
I'm not saying that he should never play for England again but I think a long rest in the winter then give him a call for the first two tests of next summer and see how much he really wants to play for England instead of playing the whole IPL....
-
And wins crickets matches too more than possibly the other tight nit lot
I think we should agree to disagree David - and as a symbol of our respectful agreement, I think you should let me use your Scoop!
-
that will come back new then Dave lol and KP forever im afraid Brucie and should your bottom ever come north i have a scoop for you to try but only under my well trained eye ( actually thats not strictly true but they are mine now ).
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Being liked or tight knit doesn't win you games. But having world class players does. Warne was despised. Bradman had enemies in his own side. But they got on with it, and the team was stronger for it.
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So he must be really bad then, if this team of really tight-knit players can't work with him!
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So he must be really bad then, if this team of really tight-knit players can't work with him!
Or these bunch of tight nits spoiled brats and have figured out why have him if they dont have to...KP might be horrible to deal with but this will set a precedence for the rest of the players as well, days when you looked at Pakistan or India and laughed abt infighting and politics are over and now are coming to England...
You get selected based on your skill as a player and not to make friends, you need to be able to work with the team and same applies to the team...
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Jonathan Agnew tweeted the link for this article yesterday. I don't know how reputable the People is as a paper (http://www.people.co.uk/sport/other/cricket/2012/08/26/headingley-bust-up-sealed-kevin-pietersen-s-fate-102039-23921406/), but he apparently singled out Taylor for criticisim.
Kevin Pietersen stunned his England team-mates with a dressing-room tirade at the Headingley Test - even singling out debutant James Taylor for criticism.
The disgraced batsman has been frozen out of the England set-up since revelations that he sent text messages critical of skipper Andrew Strauss to members of the South African team.
But People Sport can reveal England's players were angered by Pietersen boasting of his importance to the team after he ended the third day of the second Test at Leeds on 149 not out. He then stunned team-mates by making derogatory remarks about 22-year-old rookie Taylor, who had just played a fine patient innings of 34 in a 147-run partnership with Pietersen.
That caused one senior player to snap at Pietersen and confront him. And it is believed this was the moment Pietersen's England team-mates finally lost their cool with the South Africa-born star. The flashpoint came on the night KP made his infamous 'it's tough being me' press conference, when he cast doubt on his England future. The tourists completed a 2-0 victory in the three-Test series by winning the final match at Lord's on Monday, with Pietersen axed.
Despite announcing an about-turn and declaring himself available for all forms of international cricket in a bizarre video on the internet two weeks ago, Pietersen was left out of England's one-day and Twenty20 squads this week.
The decision not to select the 32-year-old followed the texting incident, in which Pietersen allegedly called Strauss a 'dumb c***' in Afrikaans slang.
He later dismissed the controversial episode as 'banter between close friends', but Strauss said he felt 'let down' by his team-mate's actions.
Peace Pietersen is still seeking peace talks with Strauss when the Test skipper returns from holiday this week, but has not impressed ECB bosses by accepting a lucrative commentary deal with ESPN STAR Sports for next month's Twenty20 World Cup in Sri Lanka.
The fall-out from any criticisms Pietersen might make of his England team-mates would aggravate the situation further.
KP is unlikely to be handed a new ECB central contract next month and may never play for England again, with fellow players fuming at his dressing-room conduct.
Coach Andy Flower admitted this week the texts sent to South African players Dale Steyn and AB de Villiers were far from the only reason behind Pietersen's axeing.
And his outburst in the dressing room is said to be at the heart of the dispute.
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Statistically England do better without KP in limited over cricket - just saying!
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Statistically England do better without KP in limited over cricket - just saying!
I wish I could have any confidence that the same would be true in tests...
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I don't think he's missed more than 2 or 3 since his debut so it wouldn't be relevant really.
Not a massive believer in stats to be honest, just think it's interesting that he is perhaps not as important as people believe.
Recent T20 finals day winners kind of prove that its not all about superstar players, otherwise Somerset walk away with everything instead of the likes of Leicester, Hants etc
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I think that argument is more relevant at County level though, and even then, Hampshire are hardly devoid of stars given they had Katich, McKenzie, Mascarenhas, Ervine, Briggs and Carberry (all internationals) as well as the very highly thought of James Vince and Jimmy Adams, both of whom have been in the EPP.
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Just scored a hundred for surrey
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England fans should ask for there money back they pay to watch englands best
Think if this was football and we left out errrr ok not a good example
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2 press conferences tomorrow.
One at Lord's with Hugh Morris.
One a Derby with Giles Clarke.
Something big I presume. KP related? Or Strauss stepping down?
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Bring kp back
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More chance of KP replacing Strauss as captain, lol
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No Central Contract for Pieterson
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he's now free to play a full season in the IPL which is what he wants.
central contracts are issued for those who England think will play a big part over the next year.
great player KP but hopefully Morgan and Bairstow step up
delighted for Onions he must be the unluckiest bowler not to play for us in the last year.High class bowler whose career was nearly over(back injury)
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Flowers text to kp
please come back you can text whoever you want and say what you want. you have been commenting on it, look as us we are picking out of form players in the hope that they will fill your void.
ps you look good behind the camera but more long range camera when you are at the crease
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I saw this on my Twitter feed today: "Andy Flower tells @aggerscricket there will be a press conference re KP 'within the next 36 hours'."
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all sorted, Kp will be back after Christmas, won't be in the big bash, big will be at the champions trophy for his ipl team.
announcement postponed until after the team has left SL
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I think England was more concerned about KP rather than World Cup even. Sad really..
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Maybe the selectors and the management but not the team itself....they're happier without him ;)
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in which case they should find 10 other players who will play with him.
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Maybe the selectors and the management but not the team itself....they're happier without him ;)
Half the so called team are no better than him Anderson book the parady and Bresnan tv interview.
Ask the fans who fork out money to watch who they want to see
Pick your best team I say
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Press conference today with KP and ECB @ 11:30
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And he's back.... another of the worst kept secrets ever!
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The statement said Pietersen had not retained the text messages, but gave a "binding assurance that, to the best of his recollection", they did not "convey any messages which were derogatory about the England captain, the England team director, the ECB or employees of the ECB".
To the best of his recollection? Lol smacks of desperation!
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Surely the England squad need him after the shambolic effort in the T20s?
My view is yes he may be the biggest (No Swearing Please) in the squad but equally, he's the best batsmen, a good fielder, and he can bowl part time offies, massive play in the squad.
Broad and Swann are equally as bigger (No Swearing Please) holes!
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The only reason they've bought him back in is so he can't be used as an excuse when we lose in India!
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The king is back long live the king best English batsman of our generation
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All eyes on KP again, just how he likes it!
Swan and Broad will have to play ball again.
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Haha, I love the way the ECB's principles are inversely proportional to the thrashing they receive.
Get thrashed, allow blokes in who were otherwise excluded by principle.
When your on top, go on moral form.
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The king is back long live the king best English batsman of our generation
I thought he was South African :)
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so it was the saffas after all...
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07.10.12
Updated 18.27
Cricket
Kevin Pietersen text
controversy 'provoked' by
South Africa – ECB chief
• 'We should be above' falling
for such tactics, says David
Collier
• South African board denies
'anyone tried to rile KP'
South Africa players allegedly
provoked the text controversy
by sending messages to Kevin
Pietersen. Photograph: Paul
Gilham/Getty Images
Press Association
The Guardian, Sun 7 Oct 2012
13.19 BST
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South Africa's players
"provoked the situation"
which led to Kevin Pietersen's
exclusion from the England
team, according to the England
and Wales Cricket Board chief
executive, David Collier.
Pietersen was left out of the
final Test between the two
nations in the summer and
was then omitted from the
World Twenty20 squad
following allegations that he
sent text messages to members
of the South Africa team
during the second Test at
Headingley.
The 32-year-old apologised for
sending the messages last week
and signed a four-month
contract with the ECB after
the two sides agreed "a process
for his re-integration into the
England team".
Collier has shone further light
on what went on with the
texts, saying that Pietersen
was replying to messages sent
by the opposition which he felt
were unnecessary.
"That's our understanding," he
told BBC Radio Five Live. "I
have not seen those messages
and no one has kept those
messages. That's why it takes
some time.
"It is a very thin line between
fair and unfair. These were
responses to messages from
certain members of the South
Africa team and I would not
condone an England player
doing it if it was the other
way around, and I certainly
think they [South Africa]
provoked the situation."
However, Collier believes
Pietersen and the England
team should have handled the
incident better.
"There was definitely a policy
that was happening but we
shouldn't blame the South
Africans, we should be above
that," he said.
"I think there was a tactic
which was used. I think that is
sadly some of the ways of
modern sport. But, as I say, we
have plenty of people who are
strong in the dressing room
who provide very good
leadership who can deal with
those situations."
Asked about the content of the
messages, Collier added: "Those
messages were of a nature that
Kevin, with definite hindsight,
would have refuted straight
away and moved on. It is
trying to undermine another
team and another team ethic.
"There would probably be
mixed feelings [for South
Africa]. Certain feelings to say
that maybe it worked, [there]
might be other feelings that we
actually might have disrupted
a player and we would have
been unhappy had it been one
of ours."
Cricket South Africa described
the messages as "banter" when
the story first emerged in
August and a representative
has refuted Collier's claims,
saying: "That is rubbish. That
is not the case at all. No one
was trying to rile KP."
Collier says talks are ongoing
between Pietersen and the
England management and it
will be up to the team
director, Andy Flower, to
decide when he feels the
batsman should return to the
squad.
"When Andy Flower says to
me, 'I am ready to select this
player,' I would trust his
judgment every single time. If
the team director says he is
ready, that is good enough for
me.
"It takes two seconds to
destroy a building and it takes
a long time to build. It is the
same with trust, therefore we
have to have face-to-face
meetings.
"We have an Ashes series and
we don't want a divided
dressing room. We want to
make sure we can move
collectively."
Collier hinted that Pietersen
will meet various members of
the England team in order to
mend fences.
"People can't build
relationships without meetings
– that is the starting point," he
said. "They will happen this
month and [the ECB chairman]
Giles Clarke met Kevin earlier
this week.
"That meeting was described
by both sides as cordial –
direct but cordial.
"It is important to be honest
and say our concerns and
allow Kevin to say what his
concerns were."
-
Kp has been selected for the India tour.
-
That re-integration period lasted long then!