Custom Bats Cricket Forum
General Cricket => Latest Matches => Ashes 2013/2014 => Topic started by: lexx on November 25, 2013, 02:47:09 PM
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Just thought i would post and see what people thought about the former England Captain and his recent comments about Trott and Bairstow recently? I was reading his comments on the BBC Webpage over the past few weeks and i just thought i am getting sick of his comments about England players.
He said about Bairstow "will be fine batting at number seven but I would worry immensely if he has to keep in a Test match," Vaughan told BBC Radio 5 and "I wouldn't put him in the top five keepers in England."
And what he said about Trott "Jonathan Trott's innings was as bad as any I have seen from an England number three," said Vaughan.
Today Vaughan has come out and said he regrets what he said about Trott but i am afraid its a bit late for that isnt it???
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easier to say sorry afterwards than to get it right first time.
You have to remember Vaughan is paid to make quote worthy statements and to be in the news - that is how he earns a living, so you wont get simple platitudes from him.
What he said about Trott was unfortunate, but that doesn't stop it from being true. It is just that the reasons for it are more explainable now.
I get really fed up with the bs between Botham, Warne and Vaughan - most of it I think is propaganda hot air and in winding me up it succeeds in what it is trying to do!!
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I think he is telling the truth. Not the best thing to do in the lead up to a test, but bairstow isn't in the top 5 keepers in the country, not with the likes of Foster, Reed, Davies, Prior, Mustard etc around.
His innings wasn't good. It was up there with the worst by an england number 3, however this was all said before anything had been made public about Trott and the troubles he's been having.
I'm sure alot of people will be coming out now and apologising for what they said about Trott. But they weren't to know at the time they said it.
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I get really fed up with the bs between Botham, Warne and Vaughan - most of it I think is propaganda hot air and in winding me up it succeeds in what it is trying to do!!
Being controversial sells - They all want to be in the media for what they say, being polite and sitting on the fence won't sell. Speaking BS generates interest and gets others asking questions to them.
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Totally agree mate,i am getting tired off all the rubbish in the press.I know the media press ex players for inflammatory comments and people like Both,Warnie dont need encouraging but i did think better of Vaughan.Its so unfortunate about Trott who i have total respect for in taking the hardest decision in admitting the problem he's having.I am sure and hope we see Trotty back soon and maybe MV will think twice before making comments in the future.
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Shane warne has made a career after being a player of talking rubbish and making headlines. I usually rate MV's opinion and whilst the comments were unfortunate about trott it was quite true.
I think the general standard of sports journalism in this country is very poor. Cricket journos and pundits used to cut of a higher cloth IMO but now are falling into the very same trap a lot of football journos find themselves in where they genuinely think they are a huge importance to England team affairs. I think many in the press feel try have the power and influence to really make or break a players future
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Totally agree mate,i am getting tired off all the rubbish in the press.I know the media press ex players for inflammatory comments and people like Both,Warnie dont need encouraging but i did think better of Vaughan.Its so unfortunate about Trott who i have total respect for in taking the hardest decision in admitting the problem he's having.I am sure and hope we see Trotty back soon and maybe MV will think twice before making comments in the future.
how was vaughan to know about trotts problems though. I will be the first to admit I shouted at the tv after he got out.... And to be fair it was a terrible innings, vaughan isn't a mind reader, he's paid to give his opinion on cricket.
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I think Vaughany is just unfortunate. Possibly the right thing to do, apologise with the benefit of hindsight, but he wasn't to know what was going on inside Trott's head. We now know Trott was suffering in silence - to us as outsiders. The fact remains that Trott batted poorly and got out in an uncharacteristic manner in both innings and didn't bat to his potential and Vaughan reported that and gave his opinion.
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Hindsight is always 20-20. They were two of the worst innings by an England number 3 ever. I don't think anyone would disagree with that. That there is a bigger reason for this is a different point and I don't think there is anything wrong with coming out and saying it at the time. With hindsight, clearly there is much more going on and Vaughan has realised this.
With regard to Bairstow, should he be kept hanging on the coat tails of the senior team, given his technical issues, or should he be working on improving with the Performance Squad, and getting both keeping and batting experience? If you've seen him keep, does he look like a replacement for Prior?
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Agree that Bairstow should be with the Performance squad and actually playing cricket. If they don't use Bresnan, which they may do anyway instead of Tremlett, I think they should give Ballance a go. He is a man in form, or has been throughout the summer.
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Cricket is heading quickly towards football standards. So win at all costs is the be all and end all, money talks more, players are just cash cows for,agents and they are not allowed to speak freely. The press are only interested in digging stuff up and a 'headline'. Ex players now just do the same rather than be content to offer valuable insights into the pro world, coaching techniques to the mere mortals etc etc
I've not been in cricket long but it's getting more like football all the time
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He called it as he saw it - as he is paid to do. Boycott is the same. Sometimes the truth is a little harsh, but our media is now set up so that people like Vaughan are expected to be as honest as they can. It's a fine line between being honest or provocative, however nothing he has said is outlandishly incorrect.
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I think the comments were fair enough at the time with the knowledge that he had. In some respects they might have been based on very uncharacteristic performances compared to the level that Trott has previously operated at, but obviously without all of the contributory information. He's paid to give his opinions and gave them. I would imagine that in some ways he is quite relieved, as he could unwittingly have made a huge gaffe with his comments.
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He's also an rabid England fan, and was probably enraged by a feeble individual and team performance, so the comments are in perspective.
He can't pull his punches in case he slightly offends a member of the England team - it doesn't usually bother the likes of Boycott, Marsh or Holding!
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Hindsight is a wonderful thing - but as someone who has suffered with depression myself, Trott will take solice in the fact that, using context, Vaughan has apologised for his part, if any, in the flair up in his depression.
I am glad he has people around him that, even though they want to criticise his recent performances, they realise that poor performance is not a critisism of the man - I wish we were all that lucky to have friends that understand mental health. Could have been alot worse if he had friends/a girlfriend like I used to.
I am sure he will come back, weather for England or not remains to be seen, and make a difference to cricket - Just like Tresco.
Vaughan and Warner's comments are purely unfortunate - and Trott has become a victim of the perceived 'War'.
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What does Vaughan know anyway? He only scored runs against players who are bad
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You bumped a two month old thread for that? Lol.
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Hmmm... Vaughan's most successful series was the 03 Ashes in Australia against the invincible Aussies with their legendary bowling attack including Warne and McGrath... Yeah, they were crap weren't they!?
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177 against McGrath and warne. Bad players......
(http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h76/smilley792/618F44A4-F4C2-4BC4-B0A3-152507E17845_zpsc7p10np3.png) (http://s61.photobucket.com/user/smilley792/media/618F44A4-F4C2-4BC4-B0A3-152507E17845_zpsc7p10np3.png.html)
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Vaughan had one good series...
Aside from the 2002/03 Ashes the only other time he scored 500+ runs in a series was against a pop gun Indian attack in 2002(English summer)
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Vaughan was not as good as people say he looked good in a very average England side, an average of 41 is okay by today's standards not outstanding. Hes now just become a rent a gob who says ridiculous things to stay in the public eye and relevant.
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What he did do was captain the team very well against Australia in 2005...
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What he did do was captain the team very well against Australia in 2005...
He got a group of players playing as a team, integrating new players and head strong ones and getting the best out of them individually and as a group.
Something flower can learn from :(
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He was a drop catch away from loosing the ashes. KP was in his first series so the ego was only just starting. Flintoff was in his prime as a bowler. Batters scored runs. Would not say he captained the side either good or bad. Did ok and was lucky with that drop catch and also other luck throughout that series.
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He was a drop catch away from loosing the ashes. KP was in his first series so the ego was only just starting. Flintoff was in his prime as a bowler. Batters scored runs. Would not say he captained the side either good or bad. Did ok and was lucky with that drop catch and also other luck throughout that series.
Few sides do well without the rub of the green to be honest.
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Few sides do well without the rub of the green to be honest.
Absolutely true. Sides can do well without 'ball tampering' which was since confessed by members of the 05 england team. Wasnt their only method of cheating in that series either...... icc should have investigated englands conduct in that series....
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Absolutely true. Sides can do well without 'ball tampering' which was since confessed by members of the 05 england team. Wasnt their only method of cheating in that series either...... icc should have investigated englands conduct in that series....
Hmmm. Watch out what you wish for. I suspect the ICC should probably have investigated most series of the last 30 years based on what was said about that one...
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He was a drop catch away from loosing the ashes. KP was in his first series so the ego was only just starting. Flintoff was in his prime as a bowler. Batters scored runs. Would not say he captained the side either good or bad. Did ok and was lucky with that drop catch and also other luck throughout that series.
Can agree with much of that Kieron, however, much like the London Olympics, many English players peaked for this particular series.
Flintoff had his greatest series...he was incredible in a way that we rarely saw before and never saw again afterwards.
Simon Jones was simply brilliant. Whatever the confessions of the mints making the ball reverse, Jones mastered it in the deadliest manner that has never been seen before or since. Incredible.
Strauss made two key centuries.
Harmison and Hoggard were both just past their best, but still contributed at key moments.
Trescothick was barnstorming in this series as he would rip into the new ball with relish. Genuinely sad that this fine player never scored an Ashes ton. Deserved one.
Pieterson arrived in style.
Vaughan made a great 166 in the middle of the series that ultimately prevented an Aussie victory.
The series was on a knife edge at all times and provided great entertainment.
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Vaughan won more tests as England captain than anyone else and got the best out of a good number of his players. Yes, his batting suffered for it, but he remains one of the most elegant of a recent generation and his calendar year of 2002 was simply superb.
His captaincy stats alone probably give him the right to say what he likes - I personally feel he needs to reel his neck in at times but opinions sell newspapers. He understandably wants to carve a career in the media and being slightly outspoken has made many a livelihood for ex-cricketers. I prefer the more measured approach, a la Atherton, Agnew, but each to their own.
Amongst the impetuous comments there are some excellent columns where his opinions on managing players and getting the best out of them are great insights into successful team dynamics and winning matches. He's young to the trade (of writing and commentating) so I'm prepared to give him some slack while he finds his most-suited style. certainly I feel he has a lot of knowledge that maybe Cook should be tapping into...
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michael vaughan what a shot (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a7d-If78gjI#)
He did give us this piece of cricket porn....