Custom Bats Cricket Forum
General Cricket => Cricket Training, Fitness and Injuries => Topic started by: felix on March 28, 2017, 04:54:25 AM
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At long last, I've finally managed to book myself 2 one-to-one coaching sessions at Eversley this week and next. If I feel I'm getting something out of them I'll probably do a couple more, I always said to myself I'd be better off spend £200 on coaching than on a new bat :). I wish I could have done this earlier in the off-season as just a few weeks before the season feels like a bad time to be tinkering with my game. But it was now or never. Quite excited, I've never had any proper coaching in all my decades in the game.
So my question to you all out there is, do you have any suggestions with the benefit of experience as to how to extract the most benefit out of my sessions? Given I'm much nearer the end of my batting career than the start I don't want to completely deconstruct my game, but I'd like to be able to strengthen a few of my worst weaknesses.
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I'm thinking of doing the same next Australian season. I have 3 things I'd like to achieve in the off-season:
- Improve my play against spin bowling
- Learn how to play the sweep (probably refer to point #1 but never been able to play the shot before)
- Improve my play straight down the ground (very much a square of the wicket player)
I suppose as long as you have clear plans on what you want out of it, then it can only improve you. Also make sure you see the same person every time and not different people. If you listed to 3-4 coaches/teammates, everyone has a different opinion and getting too much advice can hinder you more than help.
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I suppose as long as you have clear plans on what you want out of it, then it can only improve you. Also make sure you see the same person every time and not different people. If you listed to 3-4 coaches/teammates, everyone has a different opinion and getting too much advice can hinder you more than help.
I've got a good idea of the areas of my batting that most need improving - especially that I'm c**p off my legs and also have big problems turning my score over when there's no pace on the ball, so I'd be asking for help with these. It's one thing knowing your faults but fixing them is another thing altogether. I'm not sure if I'll get the same person each time, I hope so (unless the 1st session is a disaster), but yes you're right that it's easy to have your head cluttered with too many ideas.
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@felix - don't give the coach too much to work on. I would suggest he has a look at your basic set up first, to see if there is anything restricting your play. Once that is sorted, I would get him working on the 1 or 2 most pressing areas.
The time I worked with Dave Procricket, he recognised my sheer ineptitude off my legs and he went over and over the problem with me until it began to sink in - I'm still crap, but he diagnosed the problem and gave me some drills and a method to keep practising, even when netting with mates.
That's the sort of thing I reckon you want to come out of it with.
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Let the coach do there job is main thing
I would say to him where I think I'm weak then get him to assess for himself
key for me with to get out of 1 on 1 is not new shots but to help with technical points like balance and head position then go from there
if you have a stable base with good head position the rest can come
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All good suggestions. I don't doubt that I've got a fundamental set-up issue at the heart of my main 2 problems. I think I have a serious problem with overbalancing, not just when I'm trying to play off my legs, but I think it also afflicts me worse against slow bowling when I tend to lose my shape worse than when the ball's coming on. At its worse this has led to me digging embarrassing divots when trying to drive down the ground because I think my head's collapsing to the off side far too much.
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I've watched a lot of high level coaches this winter and their approach is fairly consistent. Check set-up, pick-up and grip. One of the easiest fixes is to make sure that you hold the bat up high at the beginning of your stance. It will help your head movements and reduce errors. Then look at what you do well, what you do OK'ish and what you do badly. Understand your best shots and use them as your bread and butter scoring opportunities. Work on the OK'ish stuff to make it better. If you're at the back end of your career you could consider what shots cause you most problems and just stop playing them.
Re problems with teh spinners one of the main problems is a planted front foot. If you get stuck on the front peg then you can end up playing the ball around your front pad, falling over or over extending, all of which will cause problems.
Final point is to focus on how you can get off strike. Where are your "get up the other end" opportunities. If you can get these shots working then you'll improve your strike rate, bat for longer and, hopefully, have more fun.
Best of luck.
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One important thing is talking to your coach just generally about your game. I had built up a lot of ideas of how to play in my head that weren't helpful to me at all. Once I had a chat about them I realised I was thinking about stuff in completely the wrong way.
If your coach is able to bowl spin at you, it is a big help. My coach is a decent off spinner but can also bowl leggies and googlies which really helps when learning how to pick them and where you look to score off them.
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If he's any good he won't do much this close to the new season, you don't want to be going out to bat with lots of new ideas rattling around in your head. Work on something simple you can repeat a lot in a short time and then start afresh almost as soon as the season ends when you've got the time to bed it in.
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Whatever the coach helps you with make sure you continue practicing it before the next session. Even if its just shadow batting the new technique at home.
See far too many people pay or spend time with coaches, learn a new technique, try it for the next 30 mins in the session with the coach and then never do it again until next in nets or a game and then wonder why "I've had coaching on this but still cant do it".
Practice, practice, practice
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If he's any good he won't do much this close to the new season, you don't want to be going out to bat with lots of new ideas rattling around in your head. Work on something simple you can repeat a lot in a short time and then start afresh almost as soon as the season ends when you've got the time to bed it in.
Yes that's the big thing that worries me, I wanted to do this last autumn but other non-cricket stuff got in the way, so I'm really hoping that I can gain something from a bit of tinkering rather than completely deconstructing my game.
Whatever the coach helps you with make sure you continue practicing it before the next session. Even if its just shadow batting the new technique at home.
See far too many people pay or spend time with coaches, learn a new technique, try it for the next 30 mins in the session with the coach and then never do it again until next in nets or a game and then wonder why "I've had coaching on this but still cant do it".
Practice, practice, practice
I know, I know, easier said than done though, our club nets aren't very good unfortunately. So the bedroom mirror it is ;)
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Had my first coaching session this afternoon and found it a really positive experience. It was with Leon, a personable young guy who I didn't recognise from any of the CBF net sessions, however we obviously wear our allegiance like a badge of honour as the first thing he asked was "are you from Custom Bats Forum?". I guess a pair of B&S pads, and brandishing 2 "boutique" bats, a Charlie French and H4L, marks you out as a bit "different" :)
So, I had an hour with the bowling machine on a steady 60mph and video camera. First I discussed with him what I thought were my main weaknesses (the being rubbish off my legs and falling over too much). I faced a few balls and he could see me counterbalancing by sliding my back foot across after several shots, so he moved my guard over from 2 legs to having my toes on the line of middle as he thought I was having to move too far across to cover off stump and maybe falling over in the process. Seemed to help a little, but then he spotted, when he stopped feeding the machine at the last moment, that my head was starting to fall over at the point of delivery, and I think this is the root cause of a lot of my problems. After a while he got me moving my head more forwards than across, and I was managing to stay much stiller with my back foot rooted when playing forward after a while. By the end of the session, with a bit of help with the way I was pointing my front foot (it was still pointing to cover rather than to the bowler) I was even playing proper on drives like I haven't for ages, and my balance was feeling a lot better.
So a lot of progress for a first session, and a few check points to figure out for myself - hold the shot for a few seconds and see if I can keep still. I think they are things I could easily carry into the season, though whether there'll be a miraculous transformation in my performance is too early to say. Looking forward to another session with Leon next week.
Oh by the way @tom line , the Charlie French feels Superb, think I've found my match bat for the start of he season.
Waiting for him to send edited video, I'll post it when I can...
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I've posted a few clips from my session, quality not great unfortunately and I could have cut out a bit more of the bits between balls, guess I should prepare myself for the critical gaze of the forum ;)
First one was a bit of a warm up before I had any advice. At least felt in my comfort zone with a few cover drives though I think I can see that by taking a guard of 2 legs without a trigger movement, I'm having to take quite a bit move to cover off stump which probably has made my balance worse.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBtQ6uJb-Sc&t=6s (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBtQ6uJb-Sc&t=6s)
Next, part way through the session, having moved my guard over, when I was desperately trying to stop my head falling over and not counterbalance by moving my back foot across the crease. Not very successfully at this point as can be seen.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YaDPawRSsmI&t=1s (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YaDPawRSsmI&t=1s)
Finally at the end of the session I think I started to get the hang of my front foot position and where my toe should point when trying to on drive and was pleased with the results given it's such a weak part of my game. Think my balance was getting better too. I wondered if the 2 I hit the best at 0:35 and 1:05 I was aiming too square but coach was happy with them as they were so much on the line of leg stump, tho after that he was trying to get me to aim at mid on.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PtuGqZzqVqY (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PtuGqZzqVqY)
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Some nice shots there!
I just wanna ask you if your hands feel comfortable holding the bat? It might just be me but it looks like your bottom hand is too far round on the handle. This might be another reason why you struggle playing off your legs.
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Good stuff buddy, for me watching those 3 videos, I'd think about just getting that foot in position quicker. Alot of the 4th stump stuff in first 2 videos, you got in position ok, but feet could be quicker, allowing you then more time to work the bat through the line and harder. Just looked a tiny bit late with the bat around 4th stump. Anything wider was better and the bat did more work. Maybe hitting loads of gentle throw downs, focusing on speeding the feet up getting into position. It will all come together nicely with lots of repetition and confidence.
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Some interesting thoughts there guys. Mind you I'm puzzled about the comments about my grip. I always thought it was pretty orthodox, my v's are between the splice and outside edge, and I've always been really conscious about the diamond and getting my right elbow away from my side. I watched @Buzz 's video again and I think I'm doing all that. Mind you I also deliberately try no to open the bat face too much on my back lift, a few years ago I wondered if by opening it, it was causing some of my problems, so reverted to what I do now. Lots of very good players do this (think I first really noticed it on Kallis) so it can't be such a bad thing. Mind you watching the vids again I can see why you said it, my bottom hand doesn't look far enough round... a mental check point for the future I think.
All that said, I'm conscious that I look stiff and tense in my stance. I've tried the balancing on the balls of my feet thing before and it didn't feel comfortable... and it was interesting that ramps said in that video that gatting tended to do the opposite to stop himself falling over, and IIRC I think I felt even more badly balanced when I tried it.
@cricketbadger I can see what you mean about my footwork looking a bit slow, gotta say I'm not sure how easily I can fix that and wonder if that's more to do with being 52 and not a natural athlete :(
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Had another very encouraging coaching session on Friday. Sent the first half building on the work we did towards the end of the last session around my balance and front foot position when playing through the on side. We did some drills with underarm throw downs to try and get my toe pointing back to the bowler or even mid on. Have to say it felt pretty unnatural and going back to the bowling machine I think I managed to get it pointing to straightish mid off, but that's progress. Most of all though, my balance felt miles better and I was middling most balls even if I wasn't playing a lot of big shots. That's a transformation compared with a session on the bowling machine at one of the CBF nets last autumn.
For the second half I wanted to work on my back foot attacking shots for slow short of a length balls outside off stump. When the ball's coming on I think I'm a decent cutter but always been rubbish at forcing the ball through cover/extra cover when there's not enough pace on the ball for the cut to be effective. So he wound the speed down to 55 like a proper dibbly-dobbly bowler. A first I was trying to cut, mostly pretty weakly, but with a bit of a tweak, getting me to bring my front foot back in line with my back foot to give me a stronger base I found I was able to hit some pretty good back foot drives, way better than I can usually manage.
Here's a longish video, as ever comments welcome...
https://youtu.be/FlzAZxGcU1M
There's a few shots through square leg in the first minute or two which I wondered if I'd played too square but the balls were missing leg and I think my balance was ok. Still fell over a few times (e.g. 1:40) but not too often. The set from 3:05 was after doing the underarm drills on my foot position. At 6:15 we started work on the back foot and up to 9:35 there's lots of pretty weak square cuts before he gave me any advice, mostly due to the lack of pace (I think). After this he had me working on punching the ball more and I was pretty happy with this last set, felt like I was timing them well.
By the way, I talked to him about my bottom hand grip after the suggestions here. He thought it could possibly come round a little but he suggested not changing it, he didn't think it was causing me any real problems.
This is the last session I'm going to do for now. I've come away from the 2 sessions with a few mental check points I can use which hopefully mean I can make theses improvements stick. I think any more now would clutter my mind too much at this time of year, but I'd definitely do this again one day, definitely worth the price of some new kit :)
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Good stuff Felix there's a definite improvement on the CBF nets we were at. I think it's good to get some coaching sessions even thou personally I've never had any and am not a big fan of too many technical components creeping in (I'm not clever enough to think of two things at once!)
Of course.....I say that knowing full well I spent a year trying to correct the over balancing problem you had and are working on now. I did this myself and I'm still working on it. now when I practice all I'm think of is balance because that's my Achilles heel.
If I had gone to a proper coach it may of benefitted me, but I choose to do it myself.
@DorsetDan mentions the ramps videos on you tube I spent ages watching these myself and they def helped. I tried to copy the open stance and left foot pointing between mid on and the far stumps to give myself balance. Right foot comes across too
There's a def improvement in your leg side play so the proper coaching is working,that's great.
Someone who plays a good standard told me(as was mentioned in another post) batting is mainly set up stance and grip. I firmly believe this.
Key for you is to take the coaching into games as old faults do creep in if you bat for a long time. You've seen timing improves with the right advice to start with from the coach.
i think the videos might help others too.
Keep it up. :)
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By the way, I talked to him about my bottom hand grip after the suggestions here. He thought it could possibly come round a little but he suggested not changing it, he didn't think it was causing me any real problems.
That's fair enough! If he thought it was working for you then no real need to change it! Some good shots in there! Looking good.
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Thanks Carlo, yes I was remembering the CBF session where you were loading the bowling machine aiming at middle and leg and pretty much every ball was hitting me on the pads, I was pretty despairing after that. I no longer felt I could work out fixes for my faults by myself. True enough most of my faults seem to have stemmed from set up. I really hope I can keep a clear enough head and carry over my mental check points into match play, we'll see, of course there's a world of difference between a bowling machine on a flat deck and match conditions.
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First up get your coach to take a look at YOU batting and let HIM make the suggestions re areas to work on then add your own input if needed ( but any coach worth there money should identify areas that need improving ) and between you devise a coaching action plan preferably written .
Good luck
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First up get your coach to take a look at YOU batting and let HIM make the suggestions re areas to work on then add your own input if needed ( but any coach worth there money should identify areas that need improving ) and between you devise a coaching action plan preferably written .
Good luck
All good suggestions, however most of us are sufficiently self-aware to know where our weaknesses lie, and I think that you need to have some input into a coaching session yourself to get the most benefit from it. Where I think the coach helps is spotting the root cause for those faults and identifying the methods to fixing them.
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All good suggestions, however most of us are sufficiently self-aware to know where our weaknesses lie, and I think that you need to have some input into a coaching session yourself to get the most benefit from it. Where I think the coach helps is spotting the root cause for those faults and identifying the methods to fixing them.
And explaining the postivies and negatives to a method is important. Just saying 'do this' without explaining the pros and cons and the thinking behind why isn't helpful and doesn't allow the player to think for themselves.. players need to understand this to make informed decisions when it matters.. or you end up like a rabbit in the headlights when under pressure etc
Sounds like you enjoyed it which is always the key thing !
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All good suggestions, however most of us are sufficiently self-aware to know where our weaknesses lie, and I think that you need to have some input into a coaching session yourself to get the most benefit from it. Where I think the coach helps is spotting the root cause for those faults and identifying the methods to fixing them.
Yes....exactly. It has to be this way because responsibility for your game lies with you(us). i personally choose to work it out myself and fully aware having played for thirty years I will have to continue working on it.
Really basic advice I have found is best to keep the game as simple as possible. The set up, grip and stance are basics we can get right.
Reading this thread actually having said what I've said about doing it myself.....I'm probably more open now to having some proper coaching sessions than ever before....
Certainly something to think about.
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And explaining the postivies and negatives to a method is important. Just saying 'do this' without explaining the pros and cons and the thinking behind why isn't helpful and doesn't allow the player to think for themselves.. players need to understand this to make informed decisions when it matters.. or you end up like a rabbit in the headlights when under pressure
Precisely. I think I learned why the tips I was given should (and did) work for me. For example I should have figured out for myself why the direction of my front foot when playing to leg is so important, and hadn't worked out that this was simply stopping me getting my bat through the line, but I know now.
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Precisely. I think I learned why the tips I was given should (and did) work for me. For example I should have figured out for myself why the direction of my front foot when playing to leg is so important, and hadn't worked out that this was simply stopping me getting my bat through the line, but I know now.
Some of the stuff 'coaches' coach at club level is truely shocking so I wouldn't be so harsh on yourself to know.
The amount of youth who come and say their club coaches are teaching x or y and it's scarily bad technically.
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Id love to have a bit of coaching
I'm sure there's shedloads I could improve on
Never too old,,old dog new tricks etc
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Id love to have a bit of coaching
I'm sure there's shedloads I could improve on
Never too old,,old dog new tricks etc
Well what's stopping you? If I can do it at the ripe old age of 52 and 10 months anyone can ;) I put off doing it for ages and now just wish I'd done it sooner
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Yes....exactly. It has to be this way because responsibility for your game lies with you(us). i personally choose to work it out myself and fully aware having played for thirty years I will have to continue working on it.
Really basic advice I have found is best to keep the game as simple as possible. The set up, grip and stance are basics we can get right.
Reading this thread actually having said what I've said about doing it myself.....I'm probably more open now to having some proper coaching sessions than ever before....
Certainly something to think about.
Can't beat keeping it simple head still eyes level watch the ball out of the bowlers hand keep your shape hit ball.
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Well what's stopping you? If I can do it at the ripe old age of 52 and 10 months anyone can ;) I put off doing it for ages and now just wish I'd done it sooner
52 you still have years left if my club is anything to go by that's the average age of our players.
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Well what's stopping you? If I can do it at the ripe old age of 52 and 10 months anyone can ;) I put off doing it for ages and now just wish I'd done it sooner
Oh yeah absolutely, one of those things that can only improve your game.