Custom Bats Cricket Forum
General Cricket => World Cricket => England => Topic started by: alexhilly1492 on March 01, 2019, 04:03:36 PM
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Signed with Kippax,
will use 2019 Problade Genesis range
seen on kippax facebook page
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I really want him to be as good as he was for that spell with England. 4 100s was it? Good luck to him, and congrats @Kippax !
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Breaking story!
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Remarkable how quickly Yorkshire were able to get out a statement defending the racist behaviour of Ballance compared to how long they have spent avoiding dealing with the culture of instructional racism within the Club
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There’s clearly issues that need resolving there which run thru the club.
Ballance has released his own statement as the press seemed to be camping on his doorstep.
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Remarkable how quickly Yorkshire were able to get out a statement defending the racist behaviour of Ballance compared to how long they have spent avoiding dealing with the culture of instructional racism within the Club
I wasn't aware that they had?
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Yikes.
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Was he naive or did he think he best cooperate as he knew of Azeem's complaints.
What I find more disturbing is that Ballance gave these answers to the inquiry. What of the players and people who didn't cooperate. What's missing? Either way it's a shambles.
Yorkshire have been arrogant and aloof. I feel sorry for all the hardworking decent people at the club who are going to have to deal with the fallout due to behaviour of others.
Sponsors are pulling out now... which will help them see the reality and severity of the situation they have helped create.
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Totally agree with the above. There’s no excuse for racism but if you read Ballance’s statement and believe it to be true…it’s not the worst thing to come out of the enquiry-those who did not co operate and the attempt to cover up the findings are worse.
Ballance has at least owned up
I suspect also now major sponsors are pulling out-the board will be disbanded-just like a Company getting new people in could bring confidence back.
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The problem YCCC have got is a lot of this dates back many years and, from an employment perspective, you will struggle to implement such disciplinary sanction easily in line with relevant policy and procedure. As this is historic behaviours, and Rafiq hasn't been employed by YCCC for near three years now, it all makes the employment side of things more difficult.
Reading snippets of the report (or the bits that have been reported), there is a number of issues at varying levels and I wonder what would be the fall-out if it was to be fully disclosed. Which "former" team mates and coaches would this impact? Could it go all the way to the top? All this could bring down more than just Yorkshire or a couple of players.
I, for one, am happy Ballance has openly admitted it and accepted responsibility. I would have liked the same from others.
As disciplinary action is designed for creating change in behaviour or actions, and if he has openly stated he is sorry and would have changed had Rafiq asked him not to, what would giving Ballance some disciplinary sanction (written warning or something) do that he hasn't already acknowledged. The only impact would either be a fine or having his contract ended, and I bet that there would be another county that would pick him straight up as "he has changed his ways" and he would not be impacted negatively. I am surprised Ballance has not highlighted the comments Rafiq allegedly stated toward him in the same way, about his birthplace and heritage.
The more significant reflections should be the county structure and engagement, which they have been doing, but maybe not enough. I would doubt this is purely YCCC who are weak in this area, but they are the ones highlighted and other counties should take serious note and reflect on their own set ups to make sure they are not caught out in future. It's also about the way it has been handled. I would note that 36 out of the 43 allegations have been unsubstantiated.
I think it would want to have done the board restructure under the radar, rather than in view of the cricketing world, but here they now are. Chairman to go, probably some of the coaches and executive team, all with nice little pay-offs and then to rebuild.
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Yikes.
I wasn't aware that Yorkshire had made a statement defending Ballance was what I meant. They haven't.
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The problem YCCC have got is a lot of this dates back many years and, from an employment perspective, you will struggle to implement such disciplinary sanction easily in line with relevant policy and procedure. As this is historic behaviours, and Rafiq hasn't been employed by YCCC for near three years now, it all makes the employment side of things more difficult.
Reading snippets of the report (or the bits that have been reported), there is a number of issues at varying levels and I wonder what would be the fall-out if it was to be fully disclosed. Which "former" team mates and coaches would this impact? Could it go all the way to the top? All this could bring down more than just Yorkshire or a couple of players.
I, for one, am happy Ballance has openly admitted it and accepted responsibility. I would have liked the same from others.
As disciplinary action is designed for creating change in behaviour or actions, and if he has openly stated he is sorry and would have changed had Rafiq asked him not to, what would giving Ballance some disciplinary sanction (written warning or something) do that he hasn't already acknowledged. The only impact would either be a fine or having his contract ended, and I bet that there would be another county that would pick him straight up as "he has changed his ways" and he would not be impacted negatively. I am surprised Ballance has not highlighted the comments Rafiq allegedly stated toward him in the same way, about his birthplace and heritage.
The more significant reflections should be the county structure and engagement, which they have been doing, but maybe not enough. I would doubt this is purely YCCC who are weak in this area, but they are the ones highlighted and other counties should take serious note and reflect on their own set ups to make sure they are not caught out in future. It's also about the way it has been handled. I would note that 36 out of the 43 allegations have been unsubstantiated.
I think it would want to have done the board restructure under the radar, rather than in view of the cricketing world, but here they now are. Chairman to go, probably some of the coaches and executive team, all with nice little pay-offs and then to rebuild.
Two points jump out to me.
36 of the 43 allegations were unsubstantiated. The law firm conducting the investigation recorded that they were unable to come to a conclusion on a large number of the allegations as a number of those who were material to the allegations refused to cooperate with the investigation.
As a practicing employment lawyer, I can reassure you that an employer will not struggle to take disciplinary action due to the fact that this behaviour goes back over a decade. On the other hand, senior leaders within an organisation who are fully aware of the extent of misconduct within its ranks may be reluctant to take appropriate action knowing that they will also face sanction once the ball starts rolling
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https://www.ecb.co.uk/news/2337251/ecb-board-statement-on-yorkshire-county-cricket-club (https://www.ecb.co.uk/news/2337251/ecb-board-statement-on-yorkshire-county-cricket-club)
ECB statement is out. Apparently Ballance is now not eligible for England selection!
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Yorkshire has been suspended from hosting England matches following the racism allegations made by former player Azeem Rafiq.
The England and Wales Cricket Board says the ban will last until the club has "clearly demonstrated that it can meet the standards expected".
Yorkshire's Gary Ballance, who has admitted using racist language towards ex-team-mate Rafiq, has been suspended indefinitely from England selection.
From BBC
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Two points jump out to me.
36 of the 43 allegations were unsubstantiated. The law firm conducting the investigation recorded that they were unable to come to a conclusion on a large number of the allegations as a number of those who were material to the allegations refused to cooperate with the investigation.
As a practicing employment lawyer, I can reassure you that an employer will not struggle to take disciplinary action due to the fact that this behaviour goes back over a decade. On the other hand, senior leaders within an organisation who are fully aware of the extent of misconduct within its ranks may be reluctant to take appropriate action knowing that they will also face sanction once the ball starts rolling
As a practicing employment lawyer, would you class the waiting of over 10 years to raise something reasonable? At the time, he wasn’t even employed, therefore the grievance policy wouldn’t even apply. Unless the county had something specific in their policy, they could have ignored his complaints, from an employment point of view.
The ECB ban seems a little pointless as I doubt he would have been in contention anytime soon.
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Rafiq has said it’s not the use of one word by a player that is the issue, it’s the wider issues.
There will be calls for a scapegoat and Ballance is in the firing line.
The real problems are deeper than one player being disciplined or even sacked.
I really hope Ballance keeps his job, he’s apologised for the words he used,at least he has been honest.
Unlike those that frustrated or did not cooperate with the report.
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Well Balance was highly unlikely to have ever been selected by England again anyway but at least he has come forward and stated he made a mistake, I have no doubt that a lot of this was meant in jest and that Rafik no doubt also used terms and language that would be deemed inappropriate. However there in my opinion are varying forms of “not appropriate” and the P word is one that I struggle to understand being used in jest.
The bigger issue is how on earth Yorkshire CCC can just brush all this off and take basically no responsibility what’s so ever, the measures instigated by the ECB basically mean the whole board and those that run the club needs to go and so they all should, Yorkshire can’t survive without the money from international matches and will very quickly become like all other non test match counties and to make the matter worse which brand is going to be associated with them if the board remain in place.
Also expect Mr Ballance to be using non branded kit if he continues to play professional cricket as I would not want anyone associated with this kind of back story using my brand kit, can’t imagine Kippax wanting this either.
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Nike have pulled out now….they are ending their kit deal with Yorkshire
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I have no sympathy whatsoever. I know of a local club to me that folded rather than deal with issues... and up the chain it was swept under the carpet. That was 5 years ago.
There's clearly some issues at grass roots.
Feel for all decent folks involved... but I'm leaving towards top down..
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The land is shifting pretty quick on this and how’s it been dealt with.
With the latest withdrawal of international matches plus sponsors leaving immeadiatley you wonder if York’s CC can financially survive?
If they cannot does that mean a handout from the ECB and therefore a new make up of the club…with the ECB actually appointing people to restructure
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I have no sympathy whatsoever. I know of a local club to me that folded rather than deal with issues... and up the chain it was swept under the carpet. That was 5 years ago.
There's clearly some issues at grass roots.
Feel for all decent folks involved... but I'm leaving towards top down..
I think a lot of us think exactly the same.
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Not seen a statement from Kippax yet. But when it comes it's sure to be poorly capitalised.
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Not seen a statement from Kippax yet. But when it comes it's sure to be poorly capitalised.
Unfortunate that this is being discussed under the Kippax section when it should really have been a new thread...
But yes plain bats maybe on order...
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After giving this much thought..
Yorkshire should be forced to hold the PSL and be the home ground for Pakistan... with none of the proceeds going to them..
* I'll grab my coat on the way out..* :D
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Blimey,this is unravelling fast. Vaughan has his say:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/59170256 (https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/59170256)
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Unfortunate that this is being discussed under the Kippax section when it should really have been a new thread...
But yes plain bats maybe on order...
And I think that is why ultimately sponsors pull out. Association with something that they don't wish to be associated with.
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As a practicing employment lawyer, would you class the waiting of over 10 years to raise something reasonable? At the time, he wasn’t even employed, therefore the grievance policy wouldn’t even apply. Unless the county had something specific in their policy, they could have ignored his complaints, from an employment point of view.
The ECB ban seems a little pointless as I doubt he would have been in contention anytime soon.
If a client came to me saying that there were reports of institutionalised racism within their organisation and asked for advice as to whether they should i. Investigate those reports without delay and take appropriate action against anyone found to have acted inappropriately or ii. Ignore the matter because it didn't fall under the grievance policy and hope that it all goes away, I would be advising them to take the first course of action
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After giving this much thought..
Yorkshire should be forced to hold the PSL and be the home ground for Pakistan... with none of the proceeds going to them..
* I'll grab my coat on the way out..* :D
No, they shouldn't.
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If a client came to me saying that there were reports of institutionalised racism within their organisation and asked for advice as to whether they should i. Investigate those reports without delay and take appropriate action against anyone found to have acted inappropriately or ii. Ignore the matter because it didn't fall under the grievance policy and hope that it all goes away, I would be advising them to take the first course of action
With a very long sentence, presumably. ;)
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Double standards from ECB here - What Ballance and Ollie Robinson said may have been similar. Couple games ban for one, lifetime England ban for the other.
Partly to do with talent/lack of fast bowlers perhaps but certainly doesn't make it right
One holds hands up and admits faults, other doesn't but will be in the Ashes!
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Double standards from ECB here - What Ballance and Ollie Robinson said may have been similar. Couple games ban for one, lifetime England ban for the other.
Partly to do with talent/lack of fast bowlers perhaps but certainly doesn't make it right
One holds hands up and admits faults, other doesn't but will be in the Ashes!
The circumstances are significantly different though. One posted some idiotic tweets, another used racial slurs directly to an Asian teammate. One was barely an adult, the other - going by the timeline - was a grown man who had been a professional cricketer for a good long while.
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The circumstances are significantly different though. One posted some idiotic tweets, another used racial slurs directly to an Asian teammate. One was barely an adult, the other - going by the timeline - was a grown man who had been a professional cricketer for a good long while.
I don't think that makes any difference. He was 20 therefore he didn't know it was bad?? It wasn't just racist things Robinson said either
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Imagine the storm they'd be if players from other counties started coming forward? It's not totally out of the question, is it?
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I don't think that makes any difference. He was 20 therefore he didn't know it was bad?? It wasn't just racist things Robinson said either
I think it's quite a lot more common for 18/19/20 year olds to make serious errors of judgement about what is acceptable than it is for someone in their late 20s, yep.
I would also say the most pertinent difference is that Robinson posted tweets that he presumably thought were poor taste but private and not directly addressed to anyone. Ballance was actively directing racial slurs to Rafiq's face.
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Michael Vaughan also being accused by Rana after denying it yesterday.
I see a few more players getting outed
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If a client came to me saying that there were reports of institutionalised racism within their organisation and asked for advice as to whether they should i. Investigate those reports without delay and take appropriate action against anyone found to have acted inappropriately or ii. Ignore the matter because it didn't fall under the grievance policy and hope that it all goes away, I would be advising them to take the first course of action
Which I haven't said the contrary, I believe things should be looked at and investigated. I just said it was hard to make disciplinary sanctions stick to very historic issues outside of employment policies as, if you do go outside policy, you have a possible case on the opposite side.