Custom Bats Cricket Forum
Companies => Off-the-shelf companies => Black Cat Cricket => Topic started by: m4ttc on March 31, 2010, 08:24:11 PM
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Looking to buy another Joker this time for a mate. He's a big bloke and very strong and wants to give a 3lb Joker go this season.
Just waiting to hear from Charlie to finalise that order and 3lb is possible.
I will of course post pics when it arrives
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If 2lb 8oz is huge, Could you imagine what the 3lb bat would look like???
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Cant wait to see this badboy!!
Thinking I might have to join the Joker club
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The clan gets larger!
First net with mine tonight - can't wait!
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3lb?? Thats goig to have similar edges to a telegrapph pole!!
I predict CARNAGE! :o
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The clan gets larger!
First net with mine tonight - can't wait!
I am sure I speak for us all when I say we want a full review about how it plays and if being a bit thinner makes any difference
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Well, I'll be going a bit steady as its the bats first time (no-one likes it rough first time) but I will give a full account of how it goes, and weather the size matters.
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yeah nobody likes it rough first up, and hopefully size wont matter, Ive been telling my missus that for a while
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Any news or pictures on the 3lb joker?
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Still waiting for it mate
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Looking forward to seeing it, as I'm really considering getting a Joker for my next bat. Anyone know if you can get down to Blackcat to feel the bats out, rather than just order via the web?
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I'm sure that Charlie has a couple of Jokers thhat you could see.
But I believe that they are made to order as the numbers would never be the same as the larger guys....although that's a shame as these babies will go like a train! And heaven only knows what a 3lb monster would do!! :o
Be a bowler......NAH THANKS!!
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We're trying to find an XL cleft that fits Matt's requirements...
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We're trying to find an XL cleft that fits Matt's requirements...
quality! This bat is gonna be huge. Once I'm sorted buying my first house you'll be getting a email-you offer any money off for premium members on here for buying a joker
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Not for the Joker, it's cheap enough already!
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No worries, no harm in asking
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how much are the jokers ?
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150 for G3, 180-200 for G1...
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i still think £150 for a grade 3 is a bit steep. £120-£130 would be more resaonable
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I suspect Charlie will drop the price immediatly then.
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i still think £150 for a grade 3 is a bit steep. £120-£130 would be more resaonable
Why is £150 for grade 3 steep? look around. GN/GM/Slaz/Adidas all do the same, in fact more expensive. Charlie is offering a fairly unique style of bat, compared to your bog standard mainstream companies, in the same grade of willow, for less. I don't understand why the price would be more reasonable anyway, the quality of bat is all the same, it's just aesthetics! As far as I'm aware anyway. You also have to remember that prices go up with the market. Bats will be more expensive at the moment anyway because of the need for smaller companies such as Black Cat to survive. If you can find another company offering a product similar to the joker, a higher grade willow, and a similar/cheaper price, then buy it! ;)
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GM sell grade 2 for £140.....
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GM sell grade 2 for £140.....
I think Tumo was making the point of a similar product! A G2 GM is not the same as a G3 Joker!
For a start the Joker is more of a power bat with a middle almost the size of the entire blade! The GM is a different creature!
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It's the same in any business the small independants will have to charge more than the bigger companies and probably with smaller profit margins. If you went to a small clothes shop you'd pay more for your jeans than at primark! I for one am happy to support small independant British companies
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Disagree with that Ken. Smaller cricket companies have no player costs, very few storage costs and less overheads. And as they often sell direct (cutting out the retailer) their profit margins are almost twice as big.
Though £150 is about standard for the RRP of a G3. When Charlie is in retailers they'll sell for £120ish as retailers discount about 20%.
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But you could also state that the bigger companies buy and sell in the thousands so are able to get a lower start price etc, but I take on board your point and accept your talking from a position of greater experience than I. But I presume ( and i'm happy to be corrected) that although the bigger boys pay out lots in players fees etc they intern get more of their goods bought. So taking on board what you have said I would think that any small bat maker would have to sell a lot (even at a possible greater profit margain) to get anywhere near even the second tier of cricket equipment companies.
Having bought my last 2 bats from small companies I know that's the way I am heading in the future
* when I say second tier I mean as in brand size not comparitive performace of their goods. I.e big brand that is world know with lots of players -GM compared to Salix for example another fantastic brand just not as in the public eye
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Most of our G3s are very generously graded, and would be a G2 if sold by a 'big brand'.
All the G3s go as well as any bat, and that's before you make them to a Joker shape.
I personally think a G3 Joker is the biggest bargain in cricket...
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A grade 2 cleft sold is around 29 pounds am I not correct
Charlie you own your own willow ???? Are the clefts cut diffrently from the tree to get the bigger allowed shape the joker seems to offer.
Sorry for my question
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I'd be suprised if you could get anywhere near that profile from a standard cleft......but im sure he's not going to divulge all of his secrets, but then again it could be our lucky day :)
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You could look at it the other way and say if he graded bats on performance then in theory you could get many g2 or g3 bats which would cost you £180.00 as they totally perform. Lots of examples out there of very very respected batmakers that make their bats in this format and they play very very well. I would much rather buy a bat graded on performance than on cosmetics.
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It intereting I had a chat today with 3 prominant willow men today about density of wood and it was a intereting insight to it all 3 talked about a lack of what he said was real low density clefts but a lot of people drying them out unnaturally.
Bit off topic and in no way Charlie am I saying this is you and the people who I know who have the joker have all said the same thing top quality bats.
It just seems we might have 90 per cent of so called low density clefts on this forum
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Rich - is someone offered you a bat with 20 straight ruler grains, no blemishes but you were told it would perform well, then someone hands you some doggy looking velum cleft and says this will play fantastically, i still think heart will rule over head and most people wil choose the better looking cleft....you might be one of the few strong willed people who would say no, but i know i would pick the good looking willow because i'm shallow and it's all about cosmetics :)
Pro - i think there is a difference between density and moisture content, easy to dry out willow to get the weight down, but it's needle in a haystack to get the low density clefts :)
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Big time diffrence it just seems odd there seems to be so many low density cleft k ocking around after the chats I had today
Charlie must say well done bud I know people I know are talking of your joker and in a very good light
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It intereting I had a chat today with 3 prominant willow men today about density of wood and it was a intereting insight to it all 3 talked about a lack of what he said was real low density clefts but a lot of people drying them out unnaturally.
Bit off topic and in no way Charlie am I saying this is you and the people who I know who have the joker have all said the same thing top quality bats.
It just seems we might have 90 per cent of so called low density clefts on this forum
You are selling bats nowadays enlighted us with some words of wisdom of how it all works, as opposed to saying I've heard from 3 willow merchants, I think this is what happens and no offence but what I've been told
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Not going in to it but I not selling for profit but for love of the game Andy. Just I ran a experiment with a bat put it in airing cupboard for 6 weeks and guess what 4 oz lighter but still pings just as well I know it will not last as long but all this stuff about pro clefts well performance yes durability not a chance. And what I was told is private just thought I'd share it with you. Naturally light clefts without treatment are in big demand but I e pect you know more than me I no batmaker and do not claim to be either just getting more info everyday which surely can not be a bad thing
what I would like to know is there any way of doing a moisture test on a bat as somepeople can hide a dried out bat with a good finish
sorry Charlie this is your page mate
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SillyShilly it would depend on who was telling me, if i had previous dealings and experience with the person telling me the things you mention i would trust them for sure. Lets just say James Laver or Julian Millichamp or Marty Graham or Nick Nixon or many others I've personally dealt with offer me a bat which meets my criteria then id pay up and id not care about 798 grains with 100mm edges.
Ive been around the game of cricket for many many years and spoken to a lot of different people and had bats made from many many people and i no which ones i trust and i have others i don't care for so i base all my decisions around that. I'm also more than willing to try new people and brands like i did with the Joker without seeing anything at all about the bat and had no idea what it would be like but i like to try new brands and products.
I personally pay no attention to peoples comments on anything if they have not bought or used the the brand or products although plenty do comment in this way. I think people who know me would tell you I'm very much my own man and I'm not one to fall in line even if its expected, i have my own opinions and views and that's what i use to purchase goods. If I'm buying a bat across the Internet without picking it up then i look for 8 or 9 grains with no heart wood as over many many years that's what has worked for me.
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Old git you gonna let me have a hit with it rich when I next in wrong turn country
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I will if you can get in again bud as we limit access to a select few.
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the Jokers aren't made from over dried willow, or from special naturally low-density willow.
One day I'll get a Joker made up from a nice low-density bit of wood and put some pics up here. I have a feeling it may not fit in most cricket bags though...
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Charlie I was not implying that mate sorry for the clogging would be a big bat Charlie
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Not going in to it but I not selling for profit but for love of the game Andy. Just I ran a experiment with a bat put it in airing cupboard for 6 weeks and guess what 4 oz lighter but still pings just as well I know it will not last as long but all this stuff about pro clefts well performance yes durability not a chance. And what I was told is private just thought I'd share it with you. Naturally light clefts without treatment are in big demand but I e pect you know more than me I no batmaker and do not claim to be either just getting more info everyday which surely can not be a bad thing
what I would like to know is there any way of doing a moisture test on a bat as somepeople can hide a dried out bat with a good finish
sorry Charlie this is your page mate
Please go into further detail as you implied on a thread that you think things are dubious, that implication deserves more information so please englighten us. Lets get rid of this bat maker crap you keep on spouting off about me and in laymans terms tell me, or are you implying, are you pretening or in the real world do you know what you are talking about. State something other then hearsay or I've heard this and I know a bat maker whose told me and tell me something sensible not something that is half hearted or quite frankly crap.... Like 1400lbs of pressure for 1st few runs and then 2000lbs pressure for the next few runs as that is just stupid.
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SillyShilly it would depend on who was telling me, if i had previous dealings and experience with the person telling me the things you mention i would trust them for sure. Lets just say James Laver or Julian Millichamp or Marty Graham or Nick Nixon or many others I've personally dealt with offer me a bat which meets my criteria then id pay up and id not care about 798 grains with 100mm edges.
Ive been around the game of cricket for many many years and spoken to a lot of different people and had bats made from many many people and i no which ones i trust and i have others i don't care for so i base all my decisions around that. I'm also more than willing to try new people and brands like i did with the Joker without seeing anything at all about the bat and had no idea what it would be like but i like to try new brands and products.
I personally pay no attention to peoples comments on anything if they have not bought or used the the brand or products although plenty do comment in this way. I think people who know me would tell you I'm very much my own man and I'm not one to fall in line even if its expected, i have my own opinions and views and that's what i use to purchase goods. If I'm buying a bat across the Internet without picking it up then i look for 8 or 9 grains with no heart wood as over many many years that's what has worked for me.
Can I ask you question then if you know so much why haven't you or arent you any better off in the cricket game then you are at the moment.
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Finally and to finish off my rant the guy that makes the Bats for BlackCat isn't cheating on the willow, isn't cheating on the pressing he's just a bloody good bat maker with good materials
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I don't understand your question, if you know so much why haven't you or aren't you any better off in the cricket game then you are at the moment. If you can clarify what you mean then i will try and answer. And if the above was aimed at me I've made little mention regarding the joker apart from I'm very happy.
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Love it hear say stuff no just information off somebody who I suspect knows a little more than you but no need to get into this Andy you know what you know and fair play but as I have always said the cricketi g world is a big place and whilst you might be a font of all you know on here but the bigger picture your just a guy selling bats sceince or no science
who said he was cheating Andy???????
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I don't understand your question, if you know so much why haven't you or aren't you any better off in the cricket game then you are at the moment. If you can clarify what you mean then i will try and answer. And if the above was aimed at me I've made little mention regarding the joker apart from I'm very happy.
You generally say, I will give you an honest review, I've dealt with great bat makers like Nixon, MG and JM, which you add to most of you comments. With a side ordering of I've been in industry and seen it all. My question, I suppose is, why do you feel the need to comment on any thread and why do you feel need to buy and review any bat if you've been there and done that!
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Love it hear say stuff no just information off somebody who I suspect knows a little more than you but no need to get into this Andy you know what you know and fair play but as I have always said the cricketi g world is a big place and whilst you might be a font of all you know on here but the bigger picture your just a guy selling bats sceince or no science
who said he was cheating Andy???????
name and shame then Procricket, I never said I was better then anyone else you just assumed it, like I said enlightend us with your wisdom or snippets of info you may have heard. Like you always say if you are going to call the kettle black call it black dont just imply the kettle is black. By the way is saying 1400lbs for the 1st few runs and 2000lbs for the next few runs theoretical science not real world experience, engineering & sports is slightly different
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Simply because i have and i can however i don't buy and review every bat or brand, H4L Bulldog Lekka Redback to name a few I've not tried and made no comment about. I make comments on topics i wish to as i guess you do and i could ask the same question why do you post on every topic etc ? perhaps because you have something to say which is the general idea of a forum.
And yes I've been around the industry for many years and I've seen a lot but not everything hence why I'm still trying new things and new brands and i will continue to offer my opinion on things even if you don't like it.
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Simply because i have and i can however i don't buy and review every bat or brand, H4L Bulldog Lekka Redback to name a few I've not tried and made no comment about. I make comments on topics i wish to as i guess you do and i could ask the same question why do you post on every topic etc ? perhaps because you have something to say which is the general idea of a forum.
Waston, you know what fair enough, I've probably misread a load of your comments and as you say I try to only comment on threads I know something about so I've been a bit misguided in my posts this evening, so my apologises
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Not getting into this but a bat is a bat plain and simple put spin as much as you like win awards well done sell your bats good for you but I will not name anybody as I like my cards were they are.
Cricket bats to me are a simple thing there 1 of 3 things bad,average,good I have been on a fact finding search to find out a few things and I think I have found enough now to base my opinions on now
think it time we got off Charles topic now but I should have started with somewere else but read my bad English and at no point did I say anybody was doubious or using unnatural methods
As I previously said all the people I have talked to have rated the joker and think it is a tremendous bat. So I might have to treat myself to one if bloody rich let's me have a hit with it first.
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Not getting into this but a bat is a bat plain and simple put spin as much as you like win awards well done sell your bats good for you but I will not name anybody as I like my cards were they are.
Cricket bats to me are a simple thing there 1 of 3 things bad,average,good I have been on a fact finding search to find out a few things and I think I have found enough now to base my opinions on now
think it time we got off Charles topic now but I should have started with somewere else but read my bad English and at no point did I say anybody was doubious or using unnatural methods
As I previously said all the people I have talked to have rated the joker and think it is a tremendous bat. So I might have to treat myself to one if bloody rich let's me have a hit with it first.
We can ask this thread to get deleted and started again on a new3lb joker thread. You started to imply that something was dubious to start off with so not sure why you are asking to remove it now
ok, back onto the bat maker awards thing which you seem to be hung up on, the thing for me isnt about awards or recognition, yep I admit I sent a bat off and it did well and it is good to get that recognition. I know why it did well, I know about all the bats I make and that is why I do / did it, to justify all the "crap" I talk about and because I am comfortable with my knowledge, I dont allude or imply. If you cant answer a questions or debate a proposition without saying lets change the subject I would suggest you do not post an opinion in the first place
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Well fair enough if you take it that way nobody said deleated did they just passing on some info I have found
But ok your right you must be
And at no stage did I say anything was doubious about any bats just we seems to have our fair share on the forum of low d clefts.
I agree it should have started on a different topic than Charlie joker but I never said he did this or that
Charlie sorry for invading your topic
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Well fair enough if you take it that way nobody said deleated did they just passing on some info I have found
But ok your right you must be
Yep I must be, I've said to Rich, "fine, fair enough" nothing you've written yet has made me say that to yourself.
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If you cannot name a source for your "facts", most of which are so laughable that even a moron would be able to see through them then don't moan when people who actually have involvement in equipment question them. I really feel embarrassed when reading these "quotes", get a life and either speak to people and quote them or stay away, I've had enough of reading this fantasy crap.
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as everyone seems to be slightly off topic :) i may aswell ask talisman when he is next gonna see tom, and did he get my payment??!!
But back to the jokers...... A low density one would be mad, do they do clefts big enough???? What would you imagine edge size on a 2lb 8 one of those to be black cat??
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But back to the jokers...... A low density one would be mad, do they do clefts big enough???? What would you imagine edge size on a 2lb 8 one of those to be black cat??
Well, mine is 2.9 & has 43mm edges so a 2.8 would have around 41mm perhaps?
If one were to be made out of one of these magical mystical 'pro' clefts I keep hearing about, could we guess around a 12%-20% size increase maybe?? Just guesswork I know, but SillyShilly made a very big bat out of a pro cleft, and that was a 'normal' width/length blade!
I think we should pester BlackCat to make this happen!
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Yeah it would be insanely big, looking at 55mm edges??
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Possibly, but a great middle I would've thought.
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Mike if you have a problem please pm me it is not me who has been setting up a fantasy brand called talisman for over 2 years
mike like I have said if you have a problem please get in touch.
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any pictures?
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Greg
I have unfortunately yet to receive the 3lb Joker.
I will post full details outlining my experiences later when I am home from work. I need plenty of time to do it.
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Where do I begin
I decided to order a second Joker for a mate after he saw my 2.8 Joker that I got around mid March.
He asked me for a G1 3lb Joker which I ordered from Charlie at Black Cat Cricket on 1st April at the price of £185.00.
I went away for Easter and returned to the new Joker delivered! Unfortunately, the bat was not what I expected. It was 2.12 oz to start off with but more concerning, it was very poor willow (G3/4) you can in pictures and that it had sticky marks on the face of the bat. It was very poor especially compared to my first Joker.
Charlie asked me to return it which I did and he refunded the postage. This was April 9th. There was some story about recycling a BAS bat and it being sent in error
I am now still awaiting the delivery of the bat and have been fobbed off with the following in the 4 weeks since then:
"shouldnt be too long, the bat just needs finishing..20 minute job" - 3 weeks ago
"The bat maker is off sick and there is no one to finish it" - 2 weeks ago
" Your bat was posted to you last Thursday (29th April)" - Last week
I have sent daily emails to Charlie over the last week asking for updates but he isnt even replying now.
Ive been dealing with cricket suppliers for almost 30 years and I have never received such poor service. The season is now almost a month old and my mate still hasnt got a bat.
Sorry to give such a negative review of my experience. You will see from my previous posts that I have been nothing but positive about my first Joker and the dealings with Charlie/Black Cat who I know are a site sponsor.
I now have to take steps to try and get a refund
Sticky on face
(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af353/m4ttc/Matts%20Web%20Share%202010/61333c2a.jpg)
Blemishes in 'G1' Willow
(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af353/m4ttc/Matts%20Web%20Share%202010/e66f230b.jpg)
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thats a shocker and awful sevice i would like to hear blackcats view on this.
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They could be 'graded on performance' lmao.
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Matt-
As expressed in my email just now, there has been a monumental cock-up, for which we have to take full responsibility, even though we feel let down by the courier service. We had supply issues, but have got a reasonable stock built up now, the bat was pretty popular and some of the heavier weights in particular sold out fairly quick.
As explained at the time, the previous bat you were sent was the wrong bat, simple; it wasn't meant to go to you, it was for a friend of mine, and was sent to you in error.
As I said, we've had a lot of happy customers, on and off this forum, and this has been a low point for us and can only apologise and rectify it quickly.
Cheers
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Sounds to me like someone should be getting a cheap joker! Hope it all gets resolved quickly and we see the pictures of the proper bat.