Topic: Top End Cricket Bats are a Luxury for the amateur cricketer... (Read 14063 times)

fasteddie · « **Reply #75 on:** June 11, 2014, 01:17:50 PM »

Quote from: WillyorWonty on June 11, 2014, 12:58:41 PM

Surely the fact that the better the looks means the less faults means better performance?

I think that better wood is refelected in looks, I'm learning all the time about willow but I work with a lot of other woods and it's all graded of looks as faults effect use, knots etc in Beech and Oak boards for furniture.

I think B3 have given us an answer.
In one of the threads discussing a Crown bat, where the owner wasn't bowled over, they offered to replace it, no questions. They extend this to the Crown range.

That tells us that even with the scientific approach they use, a plank is still occasionally hiding behind a sexy body.

tim2000s · « **Reply #76 on:** June 11, 2014, 01:20:41 PM »

Quote from: WillyorWonty on June 11, 2014, 01:08:46 PM

The odd thing is that Sapwood in Oak is too soft to use, so surely Heartwood being better in Hardwoods means Heartwood in bats is better too?

However, heartwood in Willow seems to be stronger but more brittle, which wouldn't be such a good proposition.

Quote from: WillyorWonty on June 11, 2014, 01:08:46 PM

Butterfly stains are cosmetic, they are a different sub species of willow so how would this effect performance? However a knot is always harder and thus does not offer the spring needed to hit a ball. If knots were good then the effect could be replicated by over pressing a bat. We don't see this so I think we can discount the idea of knots no matter the size being good.

And yet according to Wrights, "It is attributed to pruning and frost damage, especially by hard pruning of larger branches that causes scarring in the timber. (Found in our own research and confirmed by the Forestry Commission). Although most of the public do not understand the butterfly stain, it adds strength to the finished bat, giving longer life of the bat with much less likely hood of the bats breaking."

This would suggest that it isn't solely cosmetic nor is it something found in a different sub-species? (Note: I am not an expert so I am asking a legitimate question.)

Quote from: WillyorWonty on June 11, 2014, 01:08:46 PM

I have 4 Beech boards that were going to a customer but now have been removed from his pile as they are perfect, 2.4M long and blemish free, the price for them has gone from �240M3 for the basic boards to �1000M3 as they will end up being either a top end table or benches made by a local furniture makers.

And finally, these perfect pieces are being sold at a higher price because they look best (and you are therefore making them Grade 1), not because you are determining that they perform better dynamically due to the way they look. You could make an equally performing table from the cheaper wood.

Dan W · « **Reply #77 on:** June 11, 2014, 01:30:53 PM »

Quote from: fasteddie on June 11, 2014, 01:14:45 PM

I'd add Salix in there, without doubt. No doubt there will be cat calls for my head and a few will scream and scream.
Salix are (as many of the other brands you've mentioned) laughing in their tea cups each time they sell a bat for their inflated prices. You could add Uzi to that. They run (what appears to be) a very similar MO as Hammer and charge a small mortgage for a bat with their stickers (where is the value?).

People place a value on AK being a better (be that what it may - more reliable or just better at maximising a piece of woods performance) bat maker/selector. Simple. I think it's quite apt he charges a premium. Ditto the value in the years AK spent under JM. I can't stand Salix because their shapes bore me to death, though I do appreciate they are probably the best big bat brand for consistent performance - a genuine connoisseurs bat, if you will. We'll call it a Rolex - it performs, yet is loved and in the stretches of the hoi polloi.

Sorry, but to say they run a similar MO to Hammer (if anything, the Panerai* of brands?) is way off IMO.

I never had Uzi down as an overly expensive brand though? Tbf he lead the charge in 'hand picking' bats and should be lauded (and valued) as such (to a degree).

*As a watch man, are Panerai's genuinely a laughing stock amongst watch nerds? I LOVE the look of them, and I know I shouldn't care what other people think, but is it really throwing silly money at something that really isn't that valuable and only make me look like a third division pro footballer?

fasteddie · « **Reply #78 on:** June 11, 2014, 01:54:05 PM »

A reasonable point.

Not sure I'd join the throng in not loving Paneri. Personally I love them!
I'd put them above Rolex. In fact, a very experienced high end watch retailer called my Rolex the 'Painter and Decorator's' watch, as lots of those tradesmen in Brighton (where I lived when I bought the darn thing) had them!
I'd call the Rolex brand the brand of the 3rd tier footballer. Just too obvious!

Salix. I accept the experience of AK but wouldn't pay the premium he places on it. And Yes, they profiles are lacking much.

Uzi? I'd expect someone who just adds stickers to try and do something to add value. Not sure hand picking is enough, IMO.

Back to Tim's point, do any of these add that huge value premium to justify their prices? I don't think so when you look at the rest of the market.

WillyorWonty · « **Reply #79 on:** June 11, 2014, 02:10:50 PM »

And finally, these perfect pieces are being sold at a higher price because they look best (and you are therefore making them Grade 1), not because you are determining that they perform better dynamically due to the way they look. You could make an equally performing table from the cheaper wood.
[/quote]

Yes in fact a board with no knots will be unlikely to split when dried, also it will be able to be worked however the maker wants it and will be a stronger longer lasting bit of furniture.

And as for heartwood, I understand that it is stronger, maybe a little more brittle but should have greater strength.

I'm not sure about what people call Butterfly, I've see all sorts of knots called it, but I guess as with everything the seller will dress his/her product as they see fit, in order to boost sales. You get all sorts of stain in wood, none really affect it other than cosmetically.

Author Topic: Top End Cricket Bats are a Luxury for the amateur cricketer... (Read 14063 times)

fasteddie

Re: Top End Cricket Bats are a Luxury for the amateur cricketer...

tim2000s

Re: Top End Cricket Bats are a Luxury for the amateur cricketer...

Dan W

Re: Top End Cricket Bats are a Luxury for the amateur cricketer...

fasteddie

Re: Top End Cricket Bats are a Luxury for the amateur cricketer...

WillyorWonty

Re: Top End Cricket Bats are a Luxury for the amateur cricketer...