Visit To IJC
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Simmy

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Re: Visit To IJC
« Reply #15 on: January 25, 2013, 03:08:44 PM »

anything over 200 quid for a g1+ bat is ridiculous lol 
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Ciaran

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Re: Visit To IJC
« Reply #16 on: January 25, 2013, 03:21:47 PM »

Bit of a mad thing to say! Your looking about £150 for the making of a good g1 so anything under 200 I'd say is pretty cheap
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Buzz

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Re: Visit To IJC
« Reply #17 on: January 25, 2013, 03:31:44 PM »

anything over 200 quid for a g1+ bat is ridiculous lol 

This is nuts - especially when you consider that there is 20% VAT for retailers to pay and the expences of running a shop. You cannot compare buying a bat from Ryan (which will be lovely) to buying a bat from Paul (also lovely). The overheads are different and to some extent the market is different.

Not many people are lucky enough to have a mate who makes bats as well as Ryan.
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PedalsMcgrew

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Re: Visit To IJC
« Reply #18 on: January 25, 2013, 03:39:10 PM »

Over £200 is the point at which, no matter what bat I have bought, I suffer pangs of guilt over the cost. At under £200 then mentally I feel like I'm getting a bargain!

I've paid way more than £200 for a bat plenty of times and I'm sure I will do again but it's a magic figure in my head above which I feel like I'm doing something naughty!  :D
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Chad

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Re: Visit To IJC
« Reply #19 on: January 25, 2013, 03:45:54 PM »

Over £200 is the point at which, no matter what bat I have bought, I suffer pangs of guilt over the cost. At under £200 then mentally I feel like I'm getting a bargain!

I've paid way more than £200 for a bat plenty of times and I'm sure I will do again but it's a magic figure in my head above which I feel like I'm doing something naughty!  :D

This. :D I think I have bought 3 bats so far over 200. The thrill is great, the after-feeling, not so much... :-[ I feel that a bat is worth what you are prepared to pay for it, sometimes you want to pay more, and at other times, less. I guess it is up to the individual as well to be honest!
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procricket

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Re: Visit To IJC
« Reply #20 on: January 25, 2013, 03:56:49 PM »

I think simmy is not far off the truth though and it took me a long time to realise.

Yes I get a certain discount at a very good bat maker but I try others and lets be honest
Kippax get the pick of there willow which they supply,many and they sell there top bat in the 200 pound category

So why pay any more 200 pound is perfectly responsible for a top class bat.
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Aswani Cricket

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Re: Visit To IJC
« Reply #21 on: January 25, 2013, 04:48:16 PM »

How much would it cost to make that bat, just in raw materials?  The £200 bat I mean.
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ItsJustCricket

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Re: Visit To IJC
« Reply #22 on: January 25, 2013, 04:50:25 PM »

This is nuts - especially when you consider that there is 20% VAT for retailers to pay and the expences of running a shop. You cannot compare buying a bat from Ryan (which will be lovely) to buying a bat from Paul (also lovely). The overheads are different and to some extent the market is different.

Not many people are lucky enough to have a mate who makes bats as well as Ryan.

Thanks for that, Buzz - it's easy to forget these things.  Retailers' bats are always going to be more expensive for the reasons you mentioned, and if we have any interest in staying in business, this is the way it will always be.  To put it into perspective, I would never sell a G1+ bat for under £200 - so I guess there's a bit if a difference of opinion here!

trypewriter

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Re: Visit To IJC
« Reply #23 on: January 25, 2013, 04:51:45 PM »

How much would it cost to make that bat, just in raw materials?  The £200 bat I mean.

I think that's a bit misleading - maybe like asking Picasso how much his raw materials cost.
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ajmw89

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Re: Visit To IJC
« Reply #24 on: January 25, 2013, 04:52:40 PM »

The raw materials would be about £90-100.  Factor in say 4 hours work at £10 an hour, you'd be looking at a cost of £130-140 per bat

procricket

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Re: Visit To IJC
« Reply #25 on: January 25, 2013, 04:54:26 PM »

At cost a bat fully made can range from 100-160I guess that's a round figure a certain CNc machine will be chugging them out for

I have seen trade prices but it all about what the buyer is willing to buy.

Cleft handle and makers time flat 80 quid not including overheads

« Last Edit: January 25, 2013, 04:58:33 PM by procricket »
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Buzz

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Re: Visit To IJC
« Reply #26 on: January 25, 2013, 04:59:14 PM »

The raw materials would be about £90-100.  Factor in say 4 hours work at £10 an hour, you'd be looking at a cost of £130-140 per bat

Herein lies the issue - Ryan might charge £10 per hour but there is no way Andrew Kember would charge that much.

If you work at a consulting or leagal firm - you pay one fee for the juniors and a very different number for the Partners. If you put in a similar multiple for the guarenteed performace from a bat made by a "master craftsman" that is what you are paying your money for.

Hence why it is justifiable for Salix, Newbery, Screaming Cat, Laver and others to charge the prices they do.

How fast someone can climb the ladder is a different question.
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procricket

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Re: Visit To IJC
« Reply #27 on: January 25, 2013, 05:01:14 PM »

Hold on I have many a bat form master bat makers within your list they have not all be all that and certainly not worth there money some have some haven't

There certainly are no guarantees with any batmaker that it will be worth it there no full proof method with bats

And reading the juniors and seniors part they all have that but do not charge different if the apprentice makes it
« Last Edit: January 25, 2013, 05:06:35 PM by procricket »
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Aswani Cricket

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Re: Visit To IJC
« Reply #28 on: January 25, 2013, 05:12:39 PM »

I think that's a bit misleading - maybe like asking Picasso how much his raw materials cost.

I was just trying to build up to what the entire bat would cost to make, to then put a reasonable value on it if you were either a batmaker or a retailer.

That cost will be different depending on whether you were:
1. a willow merchant + bat maker from scratch
2. a bat maker from scratch who buys in clefts
3. a bat maker who buys in part mades
4. a finisher
5. a sticker-upper
and so on

The cost of time, as Buzz says, will again be different, depending on what stage of the bat making ladder you're on.

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Beachcricket

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Re: Visit To IJC
« Reply #29 on: January 25, 2013, 05:15:52 PM »

What I find amazing is that mass produced bats command a higher price than hand made bats from smaller bat makers. This is a reverse of what you'd usually expect in my opinion, custom furniture is more expensive than Ikea's furniture and rightfully so.

The small hand makers have to try and persuade people to try them instead of mass produced and part of the way in which you persuade someone is with price. True hand makers with the incredible skill that is making a good cricket bat should command a decent price. To me it's logical that a small brand making roughly 200-300 bats will be able to focus on their product greater than larger manufacturers that make 1000's and as a result quality will be more consistent. Yes they are aiming at different markets but they're all vying for the same customers, cricketers.

Some of these words make it sound like it's easy to make cricket bats and I know you don't mean to but it's this perception that annoys me. I've struggled for 15 years teaching myself to make bats, it's difficult to balance and fine tune a cricket bat, to work with the willow and make something beautiful and functional. I love bat making. I made £1 an hour last year making bats for people, I lost money. I see fly by nights pop up and think they can custom make and they're propagating the financial disparity that exists between hand made and mass made by cheapening Pod Shaving. Most people on here appreciate that there are small bat makers but I think we're ignoring the luxury these talented individuals are affording people by charging £240 for their work.

Sorry to anyone offended, I don't mean to but I'm passionate about Pod Shaving and I hope people who take it up want to learn the craft and not make loads of money.
I'll get down from the soapbox now.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2013, 05:30:40 PM by Beachcricket »
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