Is this acceptable?
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cobweb1510

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Is this acceptable?
« on: December 09, 2022, 10:10:34 PM »

Hi all,

Apologies for being slightly circumspect with some details here. This is to protect the business that I have a good long term relationship with, and I might be fretting about nothing. They also haven't had any opportunity to redress the issue if it actually is one. This might turn out to be longer than necessary as I want to be clear with all info.

My 13 year old son is growing fast. He is 5'8" tall, and shooting up. I decided Christmas was a good opportunity to buy him his first SH adult sized bat (plus other kit). I know he's still a touch small (5'9" is recommended by the various charts), but he'll have hit that before the start of the season by the looks of it!

Ollie has a middling bat with a handle he loves the feel of, but I didn't really know how to describe, so we decided a trip to the workshop to speak with the bat-maker was the best idea. Besides, we both like a visit.

When we got there we showed him the handle and got that sorted; and Ollie was told to try a few of the bats that were in stock to see which felt the way he wanted. Oliver was swinging one around and said he really liked the feel of it, but did he have one that was a bit heavier? The (very dour) bat-maker looked at him, and said that one's 2-12, I think it's more than heavy enough! (This story was funny at the time and is relevant!). There was no information about the weights of the bats whilst Ollie was trying them, so I don't think he was trying to buy the "macho" biggest bat- it was his his genuine feel from the bat.

We ultimately agreed on a bat balanced like the one he's tried, and somewhere around 2-11. Given the bat makers response to Ollie earlier, I didn't think he would go over, but might go lighter. I did confirm all the details in writing.

Because I don't play, I didn't pick up the bat at any point- there was no need. Also Oliver seemed to have learnt enough about his game to recognise what felt good to him and was confident enough to discuss it clearly.

The bat turned up a couple of days ago, and (as they always are) it's a thing of beauty. I did think it felt very chunky- but it's an adults bat. No problem. But it niggled. And niggled. So today I put it on the kitchen scales and it weighed 2-13 3/8

I'm assuming the scales are accurate.

This seems to be really heavy- especially for a 13 year old- albeit a pretty big strong one who will keep growing.

The final relevant piece of information is back to the handle- Ollie wanted it much thicker than normal- oval at the bottom and round at the top. This will have added some weight compared to the makers "standard" handle pattern.

I haven't spoken to either Oliver or the bat-maker- since I don't know if there's a problem here at all, and I would prefer Ollie not to see his Christmas present early.

I should also say I have absolutely no reason to think the bat maker won't give me exceptional post sale service, I just want to make sure if I do ask for something then it's fair and reasonable to us both.

So my questions:

1)
a) Is the bat too heavy for him- given his in shop comments and observations? (This might have to come down to feel on Christmas day)
b) The bat will have to last a number of years, so if it is marginally heavy it's probably fine for him to grow into- right?
2)
a) Is a bat that's 2oz over a discussed weight acceptable?
b) If the extra weight is due to the heavier handle I requested, does this change the last answer?
3)
a) If the bat is both too heavy, and it's unacceptable to be that weight, can 2oz be removed from a bat? (I've seen weight reduction services by some people)
b) If so, should I expect the bat maker to do it for free?
c) If not, should I ask for a replacement bat?

Apologies for what feels like a lot of questions- but one sort of leads on to others!
« Last Edit: December 09, 2022, 10:14:37 PM by cobweb1510 »
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Jimbo

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Re: Is this acceptable?
« Reply #1 on: December 09, 2022, 10:43:35 PM »

Did you agree on a naked weight or fully dressed? That would account for a 2oz difference when you add grip, stickers, scuff, etc.

2oz is a fair bit to remove but for a skilled batmaker that is certainly not an impossibility. If your lad liked a 2'12 bat though you could have it reduced an ounce and maintain the shape and balance.

I'd recommend a polite chat with your batmaker, particularly if you're a repeat customer then I don't think it's unreasonable to request an adjustment for no additional cost.
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alba caerulea

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Re: Is this acceptable?
« Reply #2 on: December 09, 2022, 10:53:00 PM »

Even the original weight requested seems crazy for a 13 year old to be able to control over any length of time. How much does the middling bat weigh?

And if you agreed 2.11 as finished dressed weight and it came in 2.5oz over then no that is not acceptable in my opinion and I'd probably be asking for a full refund. Thats quite a way out. Whats the point of a custom if you dont get what you asked for?

I dont necessarily think your point about growing into a bat is a great idea either. I appreciate that financially it would be better to not have to buy new bats regularly for a growing child but if he is late on the pull shot and cant control his downswing for 2 years until he gets stronger its not going to do his game much good.
« Last Edit: December 09, 2022, 10:54:36 PM by alba caerulea »
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SOULMAN1012

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Re: Is this acceptable?
« Reply #3 on: December 10, 2022, 01:02:28 AM »

Why do I have a feeling about the bat maker!

2.13 is far to heavy for a 13 year old in my opinion especially his first SH ( I’m assuming he is currently using a Harrow or high will be 2lb 4oz to 2lb 6oz normally) here.

2.5 is a lot of wood to remove and even then 2.11 is a lot of dead weight for a 13 year now matter how tall the muscle won’t be there to play vertical shots in my view

Speak to the bat maker and at best get a new bat as requested originally or a weight reduction but at that amount of weight to remove there will be changes to specs such as edge and spine height
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billyb

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Re: Is this acceptable?
« Reply #4 on: December 10, 2022, 02:27:58 AM »

2lb 13oz would be regarded as too heavy by most adults!

In a first adult SH bat, you really don't want a kid to be using more than 2lb 8/9oz tops. They need a very light bat. I'm not really sure if that helps, but I'd recommend just getting him a new bat and saving or returning the new handmade one if possible.
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Kai

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Re: Is this acceptable?
« Reply #5 on: December 10, 2022, 08:23:36 AM »

Mate, Id say have a chat with the bat maker and see how it goes. Personally Id say 2-13 is way too heavy for a 13 year old, it could even cause an injury with wrist or shoulder wielding something like that.
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jonny77

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Re: Is this acceptable?
« Reply #6 on: December 10, 2022, 08:38:13 AM »

Playing devil's advocate, maybe he sent the wrong bat out by mistake and some blokes just recieved a 2lbs 10oz bat with a thick oval handle! 😆

Seriously tho, this isn't acceptable imo. I wouldn't send a bat out that much heavier at all. I would only send one marginally heavier than requested if i thought it felt good and was discussed with there customer first. This would be on the proviso that I'd remove weight FOC if required.

I wouldn't suggest he'd 'grow into it' and would speak to the batmaker to resolve it. If it was me, I'd take it back top reduce the weight, but more likely make another.

On a positive note, the bats ate obviously balanced nicely if he thought the 2lbs 11oz bat picked up nicely. I do subscribe to some extent the idea of feel over scale weight, but not so much with juniors.
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Bungle

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Re: Is this acceptable?
« Reply #7 on: December 10, 2022, 08:41:25 AM »

Definitely should go back to the batmaker and ask for something else. I agree with billyb, 2.9 is more suitable of a weight but if your lad likes the feel of a 2.11 then that is fair enough. It's quite easy to play a few shots in practice but how will it feel with the full kit on and being out in the middle for over an hour? 2.11 is pushing it and 2.13 most definitely will not work.
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ppccopener

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Re: Is this acceptable?
« Reply #8 on: December 10, 2022, 09:28:23 AM »

Your not alone this problem comes up time and again, as a 13 year old I wanted the bat Viv used which was too heavy. The sports shop told me and my mum and in the end you guessed it I could hardly use it, it’s was too heavy.

2 13 for a 13 year old is way too heavy, it might be alright walking out to bat but as others have said after an hour it’s too cumbersome.

Bite the billet and return it for another or buy a new one.
A bat too heavy will restrict his progress.

As others have said around 2lb 9 is ideal, another grip and tape could be added if he wants it a touch heavier.
You will be doing him a big favour.

Some batmakers, perhaps this one in particular, needs to think of young players development with regards to equipment.
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thegowerwaft

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Re: Is this acceptable?
« Reply #9 on: December 10, 2022, 10:44:50 AM »

At a similar age, I thought I was Gooch and got a ss turbo. Great bat, brilliant ping but far too heavy. Felt fine for about five overs but then was too cumbersome. Really suffered in adult cricket where my timing was out. Swapped to a much lighter GN and was hitting everything cleanly from the off. The perils of a few swings in a shop rather than a cold spring weekend or an, increasingly, warm July afternoon.

As others have said, probably worth talking to the bat maker to see what can be done. Good luck!
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SD

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Re: Is this acceptable?
« Reply #10 on: December 10, 2022, 01:48:35 PM »

Sounds like an Aldred special.  Someone really should start a crowd funding page to buy him a working pair of scales.

I would concur with the consensus that the bat is far too heavy for a 13 year old and is going to be detrimental to his batting to use something that a lot of adults would consider too heavy
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golders

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Re: Is this acceptable?
« Reply #11 on: December 10, 2022, 01:54:22 PM »

Sounds like an Aldred special.  Someone really should start a crowd funding page to buy him a working pair of scales.

I would concur with the consensus that the bat is far too heavy for a 13 year old and is going to be detrimental to his batting to use something that a lot of adults would consider too heavy

Don’t want to derail this into an Alfred thread but it’s almost like he refuses to make anything under 2’12.

I’m sure if you liaise with the bat maker they will sort it for you. If the bat maker knew the bat was being made for a 14 year old lad then I’m a tad shocked.
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cobweb1510

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Re: Is this acceptable?
« Reply #12 on: December 10, 2022, 02:05:40 PM »

Thanks to everyone that has taken the time to reply.

I've had a couple of DMs asking about the bat maker. I'm not going to "Name and shame" simply because I don't think it's fair- especially at this point. I haven't spoken with him about it, so he has had no chance to respond. As Johnny pointed out- it could be something as simple as the wrong bat being posted! Also I am comfortable with people making a mistake if it is rectified. However, looking at the posts whilst I was writing this, I will say it's NOT Aldred!

I'm going to have a chat with him and see what his response is.

To the comments re. naked/dressed weight- I wasn't that specific in my language; however the 2-12 Oliver was trying was finished so I think we were all clear on what we were discussing.

I've been reading people's comments re. a more suitable weight with interest. So I decided to stick his current Harrow on the scales. Again I am assuming the scales are accurate, but the Harrow (used for a year) is 2'8 1/4". It sounds like he's been using heavy bats all along- despite me making an effort to always ensure he was using the right size at every step (although for some reason I clearly remember his batting coach commenting on the light weight of Ollie's bat last year).
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Jimbo

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Re: Is this acceptable?
« Reply #13 on: December 10, 2022, 04:18:52 PM »

Depends where the weight is, if it's a big thick grip, chunky handle and plenty of volume in the top of the bat it would pick up like a kids toy.
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Thamesvalley

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Re: Is this acceptable?
« Reply #14 on: December 10, 2022, 04:22:23 PM »

Doubt a kids toy is a fair comparison
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