Topic: England v Ireland Test (Read 5794 times)

Bats_Entertainment · « **Reply #15 on:** May 16, 2023, 03:57:20 PM »

Blame Derby and Leicestershire. And people in small boats.

ppccopener · « **Reply #16 on:** May 16, 2023, 04:19:59 PM »

We have a history of shafting keepers but this could be the worst of the lot.

I won�t be watching and I�m a die hard fan. Bairstow has to play agreed but this is just mad.

Perhaps we should take the old Aussie selection format�pick the best 11 players and then set the batting order

Ifs never that straightforward of course but with Stokes saying Foakes is the worlds best keeper they are now saying Crawley is a better player.

I know it�s difficult but are we really saying Root or Pope cannot step up so Brook stays where he is and JB comes back�

golders · « **Reply #17 on:** May 16, 2023, 04:36:40 PM »

Crawley�s a lucky boy, and Foakes a very very unlucky boy- he�s been treated rather shoddily throughout by England tbh. I thought either Stokes or Brook could step up, and Bairstow to carry on at 5 as before- can�t see him making the same impact as a batter at 7 with a longish tail after him. Hope it all works out.
Feel for Archer too- he is great to watch and hope he can recover to continue his career.

LEACHY48 · « **Reply #18 on:** May 16, 2023, 06:12:16 PM »

Quote from: Buzz on May 16, 2023, 02:27:31 PM

Have split this as it isn't chat about the champo.

Still an absolute disgrace mind you.

Apparently the view was that opening is a specialist position so they couldn't move someone up to replace Crawley meaning it was a choice of one or the other.

Having come back from a triple fracture of his leg and carrying some extra timber, I just don't see picking Bairstow as keeper is a good option.

Also worth noting he has been brilliant as a slip when he hasn't kept.

Neither of these things should be under estimated.

I still think that Brook has the technical ability to open and score more runs than Crawley.

Which puts Bairstow in his natural position.

Foakes offers so much to this team, ditching him is ridiculous.

It's such a specialist position that not even golden boy Crawley opened for his county in red ball cricket when he was selected as an opener initially. Seems like a logical argument from the ECB to me. Lol

alba caerulea · « **Reply #19 on:** May 16, 2023, 06:42:22 PM »

I may be in the minority and I don't necessarily agree with it but Im not surprised

The coach who was an ultra attacking batsman wicketkeeper as a player has picked the ultra attacking batsman wicketkeeper

The supremo has ensured his pet project from Kent also keeps his place despite meagre returns overall. Might sound harsh but in a results based business (or is it anymore under stokes and mccullum?) he has been very fortunate to get such a long run.

Shocker for Foakes really, I do feel for him.

ppccopener · « **Reply #20 on:** May 16, 2023, 06:56:55 PM »

Bairstow has not been the ultra attacking keeper bat who has changed any games.

It�s without the gloves at 5 he has been a success over the last 12 months

And he has been outstanding in that period

alba caerulea · « **Reply #21 on:** May 16, 2023, 07:01:06 PM »

Quote from: ppccopener on May 16, 2023, 06:56:55 PM

Bairstow has not been the ultra attacking keeper bat who has changed any games.

It�s without the gloves at 5 he has been a success over the last 12 months

And he has been outstanding in that period

Do you think hes going to go into his shell now hes been given the gloves?

procricket · « **Reply #22 on:** May 16, 2023, 07:26:31 PM »

Quote from: Manormanic on May 16, 2023, 11:22:37 AM

The argument is simple, as you rightly say. I also fear those espousing it may be as well!

I agree, Bairstow is the better batsman. Foakes is the better keeper. But to limit consideration in this way is awfully reductive. Yes, Bairstow might average x more than Foakes (or more accurately might play one truly match altering innings in a Summer) but the dismissals Foakes will make that Jonny won't more than offset that. Especially if its Labuschagne, early doors on a shirtfront. And the damage to Bairstow's ageing, not entirely svelte body of keeping damages his long term availability across three formats.

Indeed, the argument should not even be between the two - it should be a question of who the best XI players are - and I think consensus would be that both come into that category, and one Zac Crawley does not. Maybe that means Foakes is told to try opening and just give it his best shot (lets face it, he can't do worse than the new Liebenburg!), maybe it means someone else is.

Gerhard!!!! Only a certain age !!! Think you final point is the most pertinent and a better argument. Jack Russell missed out so much for the Alex Stewert new age batter/keeper�

Would Foakes hold a place purely as a batsman !

ppccopener · « **Reply #23 on:** May 16, 2023, 07:40:20 PM »

Quote from: alba caerulea on May 16, 2023, 07:01:06 PM

Do you think hes going to go into his shell now hes been given the gloves?

I think where possible players should stay in the position they have done well in, not always possible agreed.

He won�t go into his shell but had untold opportunities previously and did not better than Buttler.

Bairstow has had his best year last year without the gloves. So I would leave him there.

It�s a bonkers deceision dropping Foakes the only logical explanation is Key and Crawleys dad are best mates.

alba caerulea · « **Reply #24 on:** May 16, 2023, 07:52:47 PM »

Quote from: ppccopener on May 16, 2023, 07:40:20 PM

I think where possible players should stay in the position they have done well in, not always possible agreed.

He won�t go into his shell but had untold opportunities previously and did not better than Buttler.

Bairstow has had his best year last year without the gloves. So I would leave him there.

It�s a bonkers deceision dropping Foakes the only logical explanation is Key and Crawleys dad are best mates.

Don't think the Buttler point is relevant or even correct. But granted Bairstow didnt hit the heights of last years batting when he was keeping previously.

If your argument is that players should stay in the position they've done well in you haven't solved the problem. You've got Bairstow and Brook both batting at 5. Where is your other opener coming from?

Im a fan of Foakes myself so Im not arguing against his selection but Its easier to find the problem than the solution in this case.

Buzz · « **Reply #25 on:** May 16, 2023, 07:58:40 PM »

Bairstow can't open. So one of Brook, Root, Pope or Stokes would have to do it.
Root is at 4 and it would be mad to change that.
Pope doesn't have the technique for 3 let alone to open, he should be 4 or 5 too.
So one of Brook or Stokes. Either could do it for me. But as Duckett is a leftie, so I would go with Brook.

ppccopener · « **Reply #26 on:** May 16, 2023, 08:07:14 PM »

Quote from: alba caerulea on May 16, 2023, 07:52:47 PM

Don't think the Buttler point is relevant or even correct. But granted Bairstow didnt hit the heights of last years batting when he was keeping previously.

If your argument is that players should stay in the position they've done well in you haven't solved the problem. You've got Bairstow and Brook both batting at 5. Where is your other opener coming from?

Im a fan of Foakes myself so Im not arguing against his selection but Its easier to find the problem than the solution in this case.

Of course it�s relevant, both are batsman keepers who played over a lengthy period and did no better with the bat than Foakes has. At top level the pair of them are average at best.

If you can�t bat everyone where they should something gives. Someone has to move up the order. Pope or Brook or Stokes.

Not ideal granted but the alternative is the specialist opener�and that�s a very loose term�says in when he is not good enough.

Someone else opens, someone moves up. Crawley dropped so there is a space for Bairstow.

Purist90 · « **Reply #27 on:** May 16, 2023, 08:16:00 PM »

I feel the squad announcement has nothing to do with the Ashes team. It�s an England squad to face a test match against Ireland.
It may as well be San Marino. It�s a fitness test, a confidence booster and a team build exercise for those that need it.
I also thought it should include some promising youngsters a chance to experience the England squad in case of injuries or covid (yes it�s still a thing) later mid Ashes.
Root and Bairstow have a history of opening in onedayers so I would open them against Ireland as 1 might need to step up to the task mid ashes. And this match is the equivalent of a ODI standard at best as far I�m concerned. I think Foakes is wasted in this fixture with nothing to prove and would be better challenged playing for Surrey in time to peak for the Ashes. Bairstow is merely getting some glove time as a backup option I should think.
So that is my positive BazBall thinking ahead of a Micky Mouse summer. Cannot wait to watch grass grow instead of test cricket in August. Madness. Bairstow with a licence to thrill to open, rather than Crawley for me.

alba caerulea · « **Reply #28 on:** May 16, 2023, 08:16:36 PM »

Buttler isn't available for selection as far as Im aware so pretty pointless to mention him atall.

For me Bairstow isnt even worth mentioning either. He was always being selected. He hasnt gone and kept for Yorkshire by chance. Orchestrated months ago. As I said, I wasnt surprised.

I think its pretty clear and obvious no-one else wants to open. The same drum can only be banged so many times. Stokes may have done it in the ultimate self sacrifice but I think that would really look like a panic move.

Quote from: Buzz on May 16, 2023, 07:58:40 PM

Bairstow can't open. So one of Brook, Root, Pope or Stokes would have to do it.
Root is at 4 and it would be mad to change that.
Pope doesn't have the technique for 3 let alone to open, he should be 4 or 5 too.
So one of Brook or Stokes. Either could do it for me. But as Duckett is a leftie, so I would go with Brook.

Does it matter about left or right handed openers considering Australia open with Hazlewood and Starc? Starc made the last left handed (specialist) opener look pretty silly.

SD · « **Reply #29 on:** May 16, 2023, 09:01:40 PM »

Right call in my view. Bairstow's batting under Stokes has been as game changing as anything any England batsman has been able to produce. Good sides have to make tough calls between good players

Decision was probably made easier by the fact that Foakes' keeping hasn't been great for England. His catch success rate has been lower than Bairstow's

Author Topic: England v Ireland Test (Read 5794 times)

Bats_Entertainment

Re: Bairstow in for Foakes

ppccopener

Re: Bairstow in for Foakes

golders

Re: Bairstow in for Foakes

LEACHY48

Re: Bairstow in for Foakes

alba caerulea

Re: Bairstow in for Foakes

ppccopener

Re: Bairstow in for Foakes

alba caerulea

Re: Bairstow in for Foakes

procricket

Re: Re: County Championship 2023

ppccopener

Re: Bairstow in for Foakes

alba caerulea

Re: Bairstow in for Foakes

Buzz

Re: Bairstow in for Foakes

ppccopener

Re: Bairstow in for Foakes

Purist90

Re: Bairstow in for Foakes

alba caerulea

Re: Bairstow in for Foakes

SD

Re: Bairstow in for Foakes