Custom Bats Cricket Forum
Forum News and Suggestions => Old Advertisers => Admin Board => It's Just Cricket => Topic started by: ItsJustCricket on October 15, 2015, 02:29:03 PM
-
All,
As you have seen from my LinkedIn article, a lot has been made of the position that IJC have taken on the cricket industry. Some have called us hypocrites, some have praised our morality, but most of all, people are curious as to who we will be having on our shelves and bat racks for 2016. So in this post I'm going to reveal who has and who has not made it for 2016, giving some reasons, and how each brands decision was tied back to our original philosophy.
If you haven't read the excellent post Chris made in the other topic, the philosophy basically boils down to this. We believe that cricket companies should either manufacture their own bats, or at least have absolute control over the manufacturing process (whether in the UK or not is irrelevant), or if not, they should be honest and open about this. All bats should be able to be handpicked.
We know that from a business point of view this might not make us the most money, but that's not why I came into this business. I didn't come into this business to be a millionaire, I did it because I wanted to look forward to going into work, to enjoy what I did, and make our customers happy. I left a much higher paying job to start up IJC, and often make decisions which from a cold numbers point of view may seem mad. Often I turn down suggestions from Chris (the hard-nosed Tory capitalist of IJC), who wants to stock something which would probably make us a lot of money, but wouldn't tie in with these beliefs. He wanted to stock GM, by ordering say 20 bats, and then picking the best 15 or so and sending back the rest, but this doesn't tie in with our ethics, and so I happily turned down what is no doubt an excellent product, and absolutely some good profit, so I could be happy in the business I'm running.
So without further ado, the brands we are dropping for 2016 are -
CP - This is a brand who won't tell us where there bats are made from, and we have had suspicions for a while about where they are made, and so we simply cannot have them on our shelves. Very good bats, and sold well (especially the Plus Edition), but we can't preach one thing and practice the other!
New Balance - Perhaps the most controversial. NB now have two of the best three batsman in the world, and will no doubt sell incredibly well. They also are decent value for money, and sold very well for us in the £105 price range last season. They are honest that the bats are made in India, outsourced, but crucially, we cannot handpick the bats. This means we cannot, and no other shop can, guarantee the quality of the bats. Therefore, how can me or my team wax lyrical about these bats if we know in our heart we probably wouldn't have hand selected them? Again, Chris wanted them because he sees it from a business point of view, which would mean we could make more money, but that's not what this is all about for me. So NB bats go, shoes, bags etc will stay.
Mars Cricket - This is a company who offer sponsorships for any Tom, Dick or Harry, regardless of what level of cricket they play. They are also essentially just a "sticker" company, since they make no bats themselves, yet they advertise heavily based on the fact they are UK made, and even have UK stickers on them. Crucially, they say, "designed in UK", or "UK Company", which we feel to be deceptive, and is a major reason we have dropped them from the range.
Spartan - This one is more of a business decision. They've lost Prior, Clarke and Dhoni from the big stage, and Gayle is out injured and now only playing overseas predominantly. We feel this is a brand on the decline, and so have taken the decision to step away from Spartan.
PiriPiri - Again, this is a company who are simply based around their stickers. Not the hardest decision to move away from them. Much like Mars, they also have very little input into the design of the bat, using fairly generic shapes, and the finishing touches and attention to detail just isn't there.
Slazenger - Perhaps the most confusing, and some would say, dishonest of all. Watch my video on the V800, or the V12 Harrow, where there are stickers on the bat which say Made in England, but stickers on the barcode which say Made in India? How can we make sense of that? Further, the bargain bin Sports Direct association doesn't help the cause massively.
And now, the brands which we have decided to stock, and why.
Gray Nicolls - They are perfectly open about where their bats are made, and we have mentioned this in our Made in England vs Made in India video. Also, we handpick from well over 500 hundred bats when we go there, so we can ensure the quality!
Kookaburra - Very, very similar to GN. Open and honest, and we can handpick from numerous, and often unopened, crates.
Salix % HitsHard - An absolutely fantastic set up, one of my favourite days of the year is getting the train to visit Andrew and the team. No arguments here about the provenance or quality of the bats. They didn't sell amazingly well, but we feel they will be a lot better this year, and they tie in with our ethos absolutely brilliantly.
Phantom - Some would call Phantom a sticker brand. We would disagree. Aftab takes time to have a massive input into the shapes and designs of the bats, making them something different, and ensuring there is a coherent range. The attention to detail is also second to none, just look at the Hero junior bat. The embossed stickers, training tops, bat covers etc etc are something which sets them apart. Phantom have also been incredibly popular, and they, too, are open about where the bats are made. We also handpick from them, and the returns and aftercare service is one of the best around. Further, Aftab brings us a lot of his bats for us to sift through, and so the handpicking box is most definitely ticked!
Blank Bats - A forum favourite! They never stick on our shelves for very long, and they are similar to Phantom in many ways. Have never claimed to make their own bats, and are very honest about the provenance. One of their team is also based very locally to us and so we can get a good number of bats to trawl through and pick out the best.
Hell4Leather - Self explanatory really. Matt does it all himself, and we handpick too. Probably the easiest one to explain!
Millichamp and Hall - Very similar to H4L. Handpicking and made in house. I've seen them do it with my own eyes - they have all the machinery, including a press.
Newbery - We know where Newbery bats are all made, they are incredibly honest and open, and we have chatted to them in great length about the manufacturing process. When the Kudos2 pressing issue emerged, we could chat to the guys for a long time about the specifics of the pressing, which sets them apart from NB, or PiriPiri, or Spartan etc. They are all made from the very beginning in England, and we handpick each and every one from their rather beautiful Hove location. In all our years of our operation, Newbery have probably been the most consistently high quality and popular brand, with the most positive feedback from customers. Further, they let us design and shape (and very specific about the shape we were!) our own bat, right down to the grips for this coming season, the toe guards, the size of the back sticker etc etc, and so this is just further proof that they have control over the manufacturing process. We can also get bats turned around within a couple of days when we request for them to be made up, just further supporting evidence.
Chase - This one isn't absolutely 100% for certain, but is looking likely. Another brand who make their own bats and will welcome us to hand pick from them, they really do align with all our principals very well.
CA and SF - I've put these two in the same category for obvious reasons. They both make their own bats (irrelevant that this isn't in the UK), and they are incredibly high quality. We also have a UK distributor from who we pick our bats from. On average we pick about 5 from a selection of between 20-30 depending on the quality, and so the handpicking element is also clearly ticked here. Having these brands also adds some variety to the range, as some people prefer the Asian shapes and profiles.
Adidas - Perhaps the most surprising of the lot. We wanted to add Adidas, as we feel they will be popular moving forwards. The 2016 range is very attractive, and whilst not the cheapest, we do feel the quality is there. We have focused mainly on lower end bats, and Adidas have welcomed us to their warehouse to handpick with open arms. They, too, are honest about where the bats are made (Sondi), and so have made no attempt to deceive the customer.
So hopefully there you can see that my article was not just a publicity stunt, and that IJC has a clear philosophy and ethics behind it, which aren't just about making money. We aren't, however, overly self-indulgent, we still stock a wide range of prices, shapes, brands etc, allowing the customer a very good choice of bats. I doubt many other shops can speak with this authority over their vision and morality behind the ranges.
Most importantly, we can confidently say that every single bat on our shelves is handpicked. How many other shops can?
Paul
-
Well written paul, refreshing and honest. Almost like the first pint on a friday lunchtime!!. Nice to see some good debate and idea sharing off of these two threads and the ijc platinum one. Also nice to see chris trying to employ your handpicking trait on gm bats somehow.
-
Refrashing Interesting and unique struggling to come up with the name of another retailer who hand picks everyone of there bats.
-
Has the Salix range changed a great deal since last year since you stopped selling them? Unless i'm mistaken the Raw is the only change (happy to be corrected).
Of many of the brands on here that you did once stock, why did you if you dont mind me asking? CP, Mars seem particularly strange given the feedback given above!
-
Refrashing Interesting and unique struggling to come up with the name of another retailer who hand picks everyone of there bats.
There won't be any other retailers that hand pick every single bat, it's a bold move for sure and one you have to commend for, it does offer a unique USP in what is an extremely crowded market so you can't fault Paul there.
However, from a business point of view, to not stock what will arguably be 2 of the biggest selling brands this year is still unexplainable myself (albeit one probably refusing to sell to IJC anyway) - fair enough you want to stick to your original philosophy, but the opportunity cost to the company could easily run into the £000s. After all, if a customer, however loyal, has their heart set on a particular bat then they're likely to go elsewhere. Who's to say they'll ever return... repeat custom is a much easier way of making money than relying on new customers!!
Also, CP Cricket - why stock them in the first place if they never explained their origins to you? Surely that's 'against the original philosophy'?
-
Something about both CP and Piri Piri never quite sat right with me to be honest so I won't be too sad to see those leaving your shelves Paul! Excited to see the Salix and HitsHard offerings though!
-
Thank you for the kind words! Chris here filling in for Paul! In answer to the queries -
1) We think we may have made a mistake on Salix. We are man enough to admit it, and they fit perfectly with the vision we have going forwards, so we are excited to have them back.
2) In reply to @neoncricket - yes it may cost us money, but that is the whole point! We aren't just in it for the cash! You've neatly highlighted exactly what we are ourselves saying. This is about our lives, and enjoying it, and doing it in a moral and ethical way which we ourselves can be enthusiastic about. We will never be poor, and we don't want to be incredibly rich, we just want to enjoy it.
3) CP is an interesting one. We were led to believe certain things, which later, under investigation, turned out to perhaps be a little untrue. Hence Paul saying in his post that sometimes we get deceived too!
-
2) In reply to @neoncricket - yes it may cost us money, but that is the whole point! We aren't just in it for the cash! You've neatly highlighted exactly what we are ourselves saying. This is about our lives, and enjoying it, and doing it in a moral and ethical way which we ourselves can be enthusiastic about. We will never be poor, and we don't want to be incredibly rich, we just want to enjoy it.
Fair enough mate, I really do commend you two for sticking to the USP - like others have said, I'd be surprised if any other retailer will ever be able to say that they hand pick every single bat in stock so you'll always have that going for you!
-
Didn't you drop Salix because of Hits Hard only a couple of years ago? What changed?
-
We did drop them a couple of years ago because we felt that our own range was a little crowded, but as you can see, we have massively streamlined it so that now we have room in the range for another quality English brand!
-
Brilliant move! You might loose a few customers because of the brands you dropped but I am sure you will gain a lot more. Your prices have always been great and the confidence you will give your customers will be second to none.
-
Thanks Boston - this is the reason why we do it!
-
Good call with Salix - IMO they are the best brand out there. There are other brands that are top quality. But I do rate Salix bats and softs are pole sitters!
-
Think it's a great call dropping Spartan. Had a look at the 2016 Eoin Morgan range today at all rounder, and for 399 quid there were some absolute stinkers i wouldn't of payed 100 for!
-
Good call with Salix - IMO they are the best brand out there. There are other brands that are top quality. But I do rate Salix bats and softs are pole sitters!
coming from someone who has used more bats than the number of runs I scored this season, that is high praise indeed!
-
All,
As you have seen from my LinkedIn article, a lot has been made of the position that IJC have taken on the cricket industry. Some have called us hypocrites, some have praised our morality, but most of all, people are curious as to who we will be having on our shelves and bat racks for 2016. So in this post I'm going to reveal who has and who has not made it for 2016, giving some reasons, and how each brands decision was tied back to our original philosophy.
If you haven't read the excellent post Chris made in the other topic, the philosophy basically boils down to this. We believe that cricket companies should either manufacture their own bats, or at least have absolute control over the manufacturing process (whether in the UK or not is irrelevant), or if not, they should be honest and open about this. All bats should be able to be handpicked.
We know that from a business point of view this might not make us the most money, but that's not why I came into this business. I didn't come into this business to be a millionaire, I did it because I wanted to look forward to going into work, to enjoy what I did, and make our customers happy. I left a much higher paying job to start up IJC, and often make decisions which from a cold numbers point of view may seem mad. Often I turn down suggestions from Chris (the hard-nosed Tory capitalist of IJC), who wants to stock something which would probably make us a lot of money, but wouldn't tie in with these beliefs. He wanted to stock GM, by ordering say 20 bats, and then picking the best 15 or so and sending back the rest, but this doesn't tie in with our ethics, and so I happily turned down what is no doubt an excellent product, and absolutely some good profit, so I could be happy in the business I'm running.
So without further ado, the brands we are dropping for 2016 are -
CP - This is a brand who won't tell us where there bats are made from, and we have had suspicions for a while about where they are made, and so we simply cannot have them on our shelves. Very good bats, and sold well (especially the Plus Edition), but we can't preach one thing and practice the other!
New Balance - Perhaps the most controversial. NB now have two of the best three batsman in the world, and will no doubt sell incredibly well. They also are decent value for money, and sold very well for us in the £105 price range last season. They are honest that the bats are made in India, outsourced, but crucially, we cannot handpick the bats. This means we cannot, and no other shop can, guarantee the quality of the bats. Therefore, how can me or my team wax lyrical about these bats if we know in our heart we probably wouldn't have hand selected them? Again, Chris wanted them because he sees it from a business point of view, which would mean we could make more money, but that's not what this is all about for me. So NB bats go, shoes, bags etc will stay.
Mars Cricket - This is a company who offer sponsorships for any Tom, Dick or Harry, regardless of what level of cricket they play. They are also essentially just a "sticker" company, since they make no bats themselves, yet they advertise heavily based on the fact they are UK made, and even have UK stickers on them. Crucially, they say, "designed in UK", or "UK Company", which we feel to be deceptive, and is a major reason we have dropped them from the range.
Spartan - This one is more of a business decision. They've lost Prior, Clarke and Dhoni from the big stage, and Gayle is out injured and now only playing overseas predominantly. We feel this is a brand on the decline, and so have taken the decision to step away from Spartan.
PiriPiri - Again, this is a company who are simply based around their stickers. Not the hardest decision to move away from them. Much like Mars, they also have very little input into the design of the bat, using fairly generic shapes, and the finishing touches and attention to detail just isn't there.
Slazenger - Perhaps the most confusing, and some would say, dishonest of all. Watch my video on the V800, or the V12 Harrow, where there are stickers on the bat which say Made in England, but stickers on the barcode which say Made in India? How can we make sense of that? Further, the bargain bin Sports Direct association doesn't help the cause massively.
And now, the brands which we have decided to stock, and why.
Gray Nicolls - They are perfectly open about where their bats are made, and we have mentioned this in our Made in England vs Made in India video. Also, we handpick from well over 500 hundred bats when we go there, so we can ensure the quality!
Kookaburra - Very, very similar to GN. Open and honest, and we can handpick from numerous, and often unopened, crates.
Salix % HitsHard - An absolutely fantastic set up, one of my favourite days of the year is getting the train to visit Andrew and the team. No arguments here about the provenance or quality of the bats. They didn't sell amazingly well, but we feel they will be a lot better this year, and they tie in with our ethos absolutely brilliantly.
Phantom - Some would call Phantom a sticker brand. We would disagree. Aftab takes time to have a massive input into the shapes and designs of the bats, making them something different, and ensuring there is a coherent range. The attention to detail is also second to none, just look at the Hero junior bat. The embossed stickers, training tops, bat covers etc etc are something which sets them apart. Phantom have also been incredibly popular, and they, too, are open about where the bats are made. We also handpick from them, and the returns and aftercare service is one of the best around. Further, Aftab brings us a lot of his bats for us to sift through, and so the handpicking box is most definitely ticked!
Blank Bats - A forum favourite! They never stick on our shelves for very long, and they are similar to Phantom in many ways. Have never claimed to make their own bats, and are very honest about the provenance. One of their team is also based very locally to us and so we can get a good number of bats to trawl through and pick out the best.
Hell4Leather - Self explanatory really. Matt does it all himself, and we handpick too. Probably the easiest one to explain!
Millichamp and Hall - Very similar to H4L. Handpicking and made in house. I've seen them do it with my own eyes - they have all the machinery, including a press.
Newbery - We know where Newbery bats are all made, they are incredibly honest and open, and we have chatted to them in great length about the manufacturing process. When the Kudos2 pressing issue emerged, we could chat to the guys for a long time about the specifics of the pressing, which sets them apart from NB, or PiriPiri, or Spartan etc. They are all made from the very beginning in England, and we handpick each and every one from their rather beautiful Hove location. In all our years of our operation, Newbery have probably been the most consistently high quality and popular brand, with the most positive feedback from customers. Further, they let us design and shape (and very specific about the shape we were!) our own bat, right down to the grips for this coming season, the toe guards, the size of the back sticker etc etc, and so this is just further proof that they have control over the manufacturing process. We can also get bats turned around within a couple of days when we request for them to be made up, just further supporting evidence.
Chase - This one isn't absolutely 100% for certain, but is looking likely. Another brand who make their own bats and will welcome us to hand pick from them, they really do align with all our principals very well.
CA and SF - I've put these two in the same category for obvious reasons. They both make their own bats (irrelevant that this isn't in the UK), and they are incredibly high quality. We also have a UK distributor from who we pick our bats from. On average we pick about 5 from a selection of between 20-30 depending on the quality, and so the handpicking element is also clearly ticked here. Having these brands also adds some variety to the range, as some people prefer the Asian shapes and profiles.
Adidas - Perhaps the most surprising of the lot. We wanted to add Adidas, as we feel they will be popular moving forwards. The 2016 range is very attractive, and whilst not the cheapest, we do feel the quality is there. We have focused mainly on lower end bats, and Adidas have welcomed us to their warehouse to handpick with open arms. They, too, are honest about where the bats are made (Sondi), and so have made no attempt to deceive the customer.
So hopefully there you can see that my article was not just a publicity stunt, and that IJC has a clear philosophy and ethics behind it, which aren't just about making money. We aren't, however, overly self-indulgent, we still stock a wide range of prices, shapes, brands etc, allowing the customer a very good choice of bats. I doubt many other shops can speak with this authority over their vision and morality behind the ranges.
Most importantly, we can confidently say that every single bat on our shelves is handpicked. How many other shops can?
Paul
Hi Paul one thing I would say that you say how many other shops hand pick all their bats I pretty sure that Asad at Uzi sports so does vitas sports don't they
-
If phantom or even blank bats have a lot of input into the bats that are made for them I'd be very surprised. Good quality bats so should be stocked but it doesn't quite fit your business model. Blank bats are certainly worth bending the rules for, good bats and great lads.
Have you approached Aldred, fits the bill perfectly.
-
Simon, I know that Uzi stock GM and NB, neither of which can be handpicked. Likewise with GM and Vitas.
Many shops can claim to pick say 90% of their bats - but how many can claim to actually pick every single one?
Chris
-
If phantom or even blank bats have a lot of input into the bats that are made for them I'd be very surprised. Good quality bats so should be stocked but it doesn't quite fit your business model. Blank bats are certainly worth bending the rules for, good bats and great lads.
Have you approached Aldred, fits the bill perfectly.
Having dealt with both of them directly, we know that they do. We know for a fact that Phantom have a very strong involvement, for example they tweaked the shape of the Illusion so they could produce a fuller batch for IJC by request.
We've had Aldred before, and certainly would be open to having them again in the future, so never rule it out...
-
Im sorry, but shoot me down if im wrong, I understand a business there has to be a certain amount of pleasure made from it, and I'm glad that you are proud to be able say that you hand select everything and have that control over the stock you have in store, but what's the point in running business if your not in it for profit margins? as how is it then viable to be a business?
-
The point of the business, from Paul's point of view, is to enjoy it, whilst also making enough money to live off. We will still make a decent profit from the brands we've chosen (I hope!), and so we don't need to be in it to just relentlessly search for money!
Hopefully this is seen as a good thing!
-
Simon, I know that Uzi stock GM and NB, neither of which can be handpicked. Likewise with GM and Vitas.
Many shops can claim to pick say 90% of their bats - but how many can claim to actually pick every single one?
Chris
But surely with gm if vitas Asad did not believe that the bat was up to the grade they would return it no and get more in so really they are picking the bats they believe are up to the grade and with gm they are pretty dam good at keeping within the grade of each bat
-
Simon,
That may be the case, but that isn't actually hand picking, so they can't really claim that!
Chris
-
Simon,
That may be the case, but that isn't actually hand picking, so they can't really claim that!
Chris
Are you dropping ton of the list as well as I believe that they are great bats and pretty sure can be hand picked
-
Simon,
We haven't stocked Ton this year, as they didn't sell well for us, that's why they didn't feature on this list.
Chris
-
But surely with gm if vitas Asad did not believe that the bat was up to the grade they would return it no and get more in so really they are picking the bats they believe are up to the grade and with gm they are pretty dam good at keeping within the grade of each bat
Honestly haven't ever felt the need to send a GM back for not being up to standard. I'm sure GM would not only be happy to assist in rectifying, but would be mortified at the 'mistake'
It's an interesting approach this one Paul, gotta commend you for going down this route. For me hand-picking is very important from certain brands, GM really isn't one of them though.
Would love to say yes we hand-pick every bat we sell, of course it is impossible if we want to offer a relevant, varied range.
Surprised Adidas allow hand-picking, admittedly I've never asked as we've never ordered a bat from them. As an aside, I don't think they are Sondhi made anymore?
Also, regarding 100% hand-picking, going forward Kookaburra do not allow the hand-picking of their lower grades, there still needs to be some clarity over exactly which models are excluded but I assume you won't be ordering those?
CA and SF intrigues me, neither have official distributors in this country, certainly nothing on a par with the distributors of TON. I'm sure they are a bit more professional than a chap with some bats in the boot of his car (we've had a couple of those recently trying to flog us CA's!) but ultimately are carrying a fairly small amount of stock sent over from the subcontinent. Of course you are picking your preferred ones from this selection, but it isn't quite the same wealth of options as a visit to Gray Nics for example.
Not meant to be inflammatory, just a few points I'm wondering about as an interested spectator.
-
Honestly haven't ever felt the need to send a GM back for not being up to standard. I'm sure GM would not only be happy to assist in rectifying, but would be mortified at the 'mistake'
It's an interesting approach this one Paul, gotta commend you for going down this route. For me hand-picking is very important from certain brands, GM really isn't one of them though.
Would love to say yes we hand-pick every bat we sell, of course it is impossible if we want to offer a relevant, varied range.
Surprised Adidas allow hand-picking, admittedly I've never asked as we've never ordered a bat from them. As an aside, I don't think they are Sondhi made anymore?
Also, regarding 100% hand-picking, going forward Kookaburra do not allow the hand-picking of their lower grades, there still needs to be some clarity over exactly which models are excluded but I assume you won't be ordering those?
CA and SF intrigues me, neither have official distributors in this country, certainly nothing on a par with the distributors of TON. I'm sure they are a bit more professional than a chap with some bats in the boot of his car (we've had a couple of those recently trying to flog us CA's!) but ultimately are carrying a fairly small amount of stock sent over from the subcontinent. Of course you are picking your preferred ones from this selection, but it isn't quite the same wealth of options as a visit to Gray Nics for example.
Not meant to be inflammatory, just a few points I'm wondering about as an interested spectator.
Completely understand that about Kooks. We knew this and we will be making our Kookaburra bats reflect the availability of hand-picking in the Kooks range.
Adidas were very insistent on inviting us to handpick, they apparently have a very large, and decent set up. I was led to believe it was Sondhi but if I'm wrong then apologies - although the point still stands.
With CA and SF - our distributor generally brings 5 bats for every one that we take - which is clearly still a very good selection!
With regards to the GM one - that may be the case. We wouldn't be the biggest order, far from it, and so would likely be subject to having the leftovers. Not only that, but come the end of the season, manufacturers have a vested interest in getting rid of the old (technically current) stock, and so they have to send out whatever is left, which has not been seen as good enough previously during the year. Whereas, with handpicking, we can take the best of the best throughout the year. Perhaps you may not think it is worth it, but we absolutely buy into the handpicking and that is seen throughout our range.
-
Completely understand that about Kooks. We knew this and we will be making our Kookaburra bats reflect the availability of hand-picking in the Kooks range.
Adidas were very insistent on inviting us to handpick, they apparently have a very large, and decent set up. I was led to believe it was Sondhi but if I'm wrong then apologies - although the point still stands.
With CA and SF - our distributor generally brings 5 bats for every one that we take - which is clearly still a very good selection!
With regards to the GM one - that may be the case. We wouldn't be the biggest order, far from it, and so would likely be subject to having the leftovers. Not only that, but come the end of the season, manufacturers have a vested interest in getting rid of the old (technically current) stock, and so they have to send out whatever is left, which has not been seen as good enough previously during the year. Whereas, with handpicking, we can take the best of the best throughout the year. Perhaps you may not think it is worth it, but we absolutely buy into the handpicking and that is seen throughout our range.
My understanding is Adidas is Sareen made now, the rep who visited us in the Summer said so, certainly the softs smack of Sareen. Interesting to hear the wanted you to come, might be one to consider going forward.
Can't say I'm that pleased about the Kookaburra policy but I understand and respect it.
See, this is where i think you are looking at GM all wrong. It doesn't get to June or July and GM only have old stock that has been sat there for months like a brand who relies on 2 or 3 drops from India. They are CONSTANTLY making bats. Bats available in April and May were probably made in March, equally the bats we will receive in the coming weeks will be from a production run intended to satisfy pre Christmas stock orders. Their stockpile of willow is huge and they get deliveries regularly, meaning a constant turnover of comparable quality, not an end of season dip like i completely agree can happen with many other brands.
Not wanting to derail your thread and ram GM down anyones neck, just my opinion on the matter.
-
My understanding is Adidas is Sareen made now, the rep who visited us in the Summer said so, certainly the softs smack of Sareen. Interesting to hear the wanted you to come, might be one to consider going forward.
Can't say I'm that pleased about the Kookaburra policy but I understand and respect it.
See, this is where i think you are looking at GM all wrong. It doesn't get to June or July and GM only have old stock that has been sat there for months like a brand who relies on 2 or 3 drops from India. They are CONSTANTLY making bats. Bats available in April and May were probably made in March, equally the bats we will receive in the coming weeks will be from a production run intended to satisfy pre Christmas stock orders. Their stockpile of willow is huge and they get deliveries regularly, meaning a constant turnover of comparable quality, not an end of season dip like i completely agree can happen with many other brands.
Not wanting to derail your thread and ram GM down anyones neck, just my opinion on the matter.
Jake, as we acknowledged earlier in the posts, or certainly in the other thread, we believe GM to be high quality bats. But what happened if you wanted to send 15 or 20 of them back, as we often reject well over 30 when we are at GN? Simply cannot be done, and would definitely damage the relationship with GM and yourselves. I personally tried to persuade Paul to stock them on this basis, but he has emotional and moral reasons not to, and fair enough if you want to stick to commercial reasons - that's your prerogative and you will do well out of our decision I would suggest. Like I said, we know GM to be a great, great brand, and I like them very much, but they don't fit with our ethos, and surely in business that has to mean something? So whilst we respect your decision to stock them, I suspect we will stick to our guns on this one!
-
Good call, Paul! I like your list of brands. I own some of those brands and those bats are top notch.
-
Kudos to you, Chris and Paul for taking a stand. Good to see that you have a clear vision of what you want to be and are doing the things that fits in with that.
-
chris what ever happened to affinity? and for that matter ST cricket
-
I think it's a good stand from both a moral & potentially a business point of view. For a business to thrive it needs to have a USP, to be a 'point of difference'. Particularly with the bigger brands as they are so readily available it will be a crowded market. Every other cricket shop will stock GM, not every other shop will stock Blank Bats or H4L.
-
Sad to hear about Spartan as well - they seem to have major supply issues with their softs. Their mid-range stuff is pretty average at best, but their "limited edition" ranges are as good as any of the top kits going around.
With regard to New Balance, I don't feel that their bats stand out: there are only two options, and it's more about the branding than anything else with them. I just don't feel as if they take their cricket bats seriously enough.
-
Sad to hear about Spartan as well - they seem to have major supply issues with their softs. Their mid-range stuff is pretty average at best, but their "limited edition" ranges are as good as any of the top kits going around.
With regard to New Balance, I don't feel that their bats stand out: there are only two options, and it's more about the branding than anything else with them. I just don't feel as if they take their cricket bats seriously enough.
Yup New Balance have sprang onto the scene and obviously feel they can muscle there way in to make a few bucks which they seem to be achieving after signing the worlds top players, if they get supply chains working correctly I can them selling loads of gear. I think overall your here to help and make sure each customer that walks into your store and shops online gets the best quality gear possible which I applaud.
-
I think it's a good stand from both a moral & potentially a business point of view. For a business to thrive it needs to have a USP, to be a 'point of difference'. Particularly with the bigger brands as they are so readily available it will be a crowded market. Every other cricket shop will stock GM, not every other shop will stock Blank Bats or H4L.
just my opinion, but I think its a strange stance. Where are the morals, were IJC ripping customers off before this stance or offering 2nd rate goods? Ive not bought from IJC but plenty of members seem to have and had no issues, so I assume not. And not stocking 2 major brands for a custom base which i assume is wider than this forum and probably less nerdy/knowledgeable about bats seems a bad business call, id compare it to a an independent garage not stocking ford because of a 'morale' stance.
But its IJC's business and they can do what they want, just strikes me as strange business plan to advertise.
-
Personally I'd use that garage that refuses to stock ford...........
In a world were something, anything even so small can make you stand out from the crowd. I applaud ijc for there decision and choice. With there loyal customer base, and word of mouth this isn't going to turn customers away!
Infact if anyone spends a fortune on a dud, the promise of fully hand picking bats to ensure all are good can help you pick up a few new customers.!
I hope it works out for you boys.
As for GM, well I'd reckon every other cricket shop in Britain stocks them, so I'm sure it won't really harm either party that they can't come up with an agreement that works for both.
-
I personally think it is a good move. I would prefer to purchase a bat that has been fully vetted by a source I trust. My last 2 bats have come from IJC and they have both been very good bats. One Salix ( Perhaps I was one of a limited number that purchased one from IJC) and a Newbery Kudos.
I am sure when I need a new bat I will give the lads at IJC a shout.
-
I'm on my way over tonight, looking forward to a peruse!
-
Personally I'd use that garage that refuses to stock ford...........
On what grounds, are fords made by poorly paid 7 year olds working 18 hours days, are they funded by illegal means, do they make overpriced 2nd rate products? Why would you use another garage to buy a car just because one stocks fords?
But back to the main subject, I'm just not getting IJC's USP is, are they stocking only bespoke handmade bats...appears not, are they stocking only bats made by the name on the bats....don't thinks so, from what I've read there USP is they are stocking a lesser branded range than competitiors.
I'm not saying this is right or wrong, it's their business plan, just everyone's claiming a USP, I just don't get what it is.
-
Having owned a few fords, they suck. But it was more in jest. Thanks for the rant.
-
Having owned a few fords, they suck. But it was more in jest. Thanks for the rant.
My pleasure :)
-
On what grounds, are fords made by poorly paid 7 year olds working 18 hours days, are they funded by illegal means, do they make overpriced 2nd rate products? Why would you use another garage to buy a car just because one stocks fords?
But back to the main subject, I'm just not getting IJC's USP is, are they stocking only bespoke handmade bats...appears not, are they stocking only bats made by the name on the bats....don't thinks so, from what I've read there USP is they are stocking a lesser branded range than competitiors.
I'm not saying this is right or wrong, it's their business plan, just everyone's claiming a USP, I just don't get what it is.
The term "USP" is being used a lot here. Whilst this is obviously a consideration for us - especially in terms of the handpicking - we are more interested in promoting our philosophy and explaining the method to (what some people think is) our madness.
It really boils down to the fact that I got into this industry because I wanted to enjoy every working day. I still feel the same. I don't think this enjoyment would be the same if I am trying to sell bats that I don't necessarily like, which I haven't chosen myself, and push brands just because they are "flavour of the month" and may therefore make us a bob or two. I know some are wondering why we bothered with the likes of PiriPiri, Mars, CP etc. in the first place - we had our reasons at the time and even personal connections with those brands, which made them difficult to ignore - but every business must evolve and we now feel it is time to take a stand in what we really believe in, which is supporting the more genuine brands and bat makers.
Paul
-
The term "USP" is being used a lot here. Whilst this is obviously a consideration for us - especially in terms of the handpicking - we are more interested in promoting our philosophy and explaining the method to (what some people think is) our madness.
TBF Paul, I don't think it was you who was using USP, your business model is your own and power to you.
-
Having owned a few fords, they suck. But it was more in jest. Thanks for the rant.
I personally love Ford, I think they make very good cars that are reliable and offer good value for money.
Was I after a hot hatch would I buy one - no
Was I after a performance car - no
Does my MK6 Fiesta fit a cricket bag in the boot and get me from A to B - yes
Is it a practical daily driver that was good value for money - yes
It's all relative really, be it cars or bats. One man's junk is another man's treasure and all :)
Finally, do I wish I'd kept my old T Reg car and spent the money on cricket kit instead - certainly!
-
Paul/Chris - do you think the stance will push people away from buying through you but push people to deal directly with a custom bat maker instead? I know that not all of your brands offer a direct custom option (GN springs to mind unless you pay the ridiculous circa £1000 price) but for those that do i'm confused as to why you'd choose to go to a retailer when you could just contact them direct and get a bat made. All i can think of is it will be more expensive and is more aimed at the custom options. For example you can order bats direct from Salix although maybe only if you attend the workshop in person
-
Appreciate the thought process and hope you are able to stay in line with it as IJC grows. All the best @ItsJustCricket
-
Paul/Chris - do you think the stance will push people away from buying through you but push people to deal directly with a custom bat maker instead? I know that not all of your brands offer a direct custom option (GN springs to mind unless you pay the ridiculous circa £1000 price) but for those that do i'm confused as to why you'd choose to go to a retailer when you could just contact them direct and get a bat made. All i can think of is it will be more expensive and is more aimed at the custom options. For example you can order bats direct from Salix although maybe only if you attend the workshop in person
I suppose the majority of people shop for convenience and I fear that they don't know or care about custom bats or factory visits etc. I fully understand where IJC are going with this but if it were me I would worry about losing the "bread and butter" punter who just wants brand X rather than some of the more niche brands. But they must have done their research and if this is what works for them then I wish them well.
-
Paul/Chris - do you think the stance will push people away from buying through you but push people to deal directly with a custom bat maker instead? I know that not all of your brands offer a direct custom option (GN springs to mind unless you pay the ridiculous circa £1000 price) but for those that do i'm confused as to why you'd choose to go to a retailer when you could just contact them direct and get a bat made. All i can think of is it will be more expensive and is more aimed at the custom options. For example you can order bats direct from Salix although maybe only if you attend the workshop in person
In answer to this, not a lot of places actually allow you to get a custom made bat, unless you visit the workshop as you say, which can be very impractical. And as for going direct, simply put a lot of people don't want to pay an extra 50 odd quid for a service they can get from us absolutely free!
As regards to losing the generic customer, we usually find that through our expertise and experience, and YouTube channel, our customers trust our judgement. They will generally enquire on our website for say a GM, or NB bat, and then 9/10 once we have explained our reasoning they will then listen to our suggestions, which often turn out to be a better, or more suitable, bat for them! As for the 1/10 - we feel that this is an acceptable loss to ensure we have a strong brand identity and good customer relations!
A lot of people have mentioned that they fail to see a USP. We haven't talked about it much ourselves, but in answer to it directly, the USP is who we stock and why we stock it. Nowhere else will EVERY SINGLE BAT BE HANDPICKED. That seems to be fairly unique to us! Not many other places will willingly give up some good cash to ensure a philosophy of business and ethical stand is taken, that seems to be heading towards unique!
-
I think there are a lot of factors in play which makes the IJC business model stand up as I understand it. I think their location is one part of it, size of premises may be another, though I haven't visited their new place yet, but taken as a piece I do think that they cater for THEIR bread and butter customers, which are perhaps a bit different to others. Fair play to them for trying to explain their ethos.
-
Couple of notes:
1. Custom made bats are not all that they are cracked up to be. I have spent lot of $ on custom bats and there was always something off! I wish I had had just picked up M&H, CA etc. Performance wise, my off-the-shelf, albeit handpicked, bats are outperforming customs by miles.
2. I started following IJC because of their video reviews - just loved the honesty about the gear!!
-
....ensure a philosophy of business and ethical stand is taken, that seems to be heading towards unique!
I get that (at least to you) it is philosophical but im struggling to understand how its unethical for retailers to sell bats they havent handpicked? Or have i misunderstood?
-
I get that (at least to you) it is philosophical but im struggling to understand how its unethical for retailers to sell bats they havent handpicked? Or have i misunderstood?
I think you have misunderstood, Ian. The unethical part relates to the dishonesty, as discussed previously on here (and in my article). We think it's absolutely perfectly ethical to sell a non-handpicked bat and we have never claimed otherwise, it's just not what we want to do moving forward - no matter who the brand is and how popular their bats may be.
-
Couple of notes:
1. Custom made bats are not all that they are cracked up to be. I have spent lot of $ on custom bats and there was always something off! I wish I had had just picked up M&H, CA etc. Performance wise, my off-the-shelf, albeit handpicked, bats are outperforming customs by miles.
2. I started following IJC because of their video reviews - just loved the honesty about the gear!!
Was my point earlier.... My off the shelf bats have out performed custom bats i have bought and custom bats of others on my team. And i dont even know if they were made by a proper batmaker or some carpenter...
-
A lot of people have mentioned that they fail to see a USP. We haven't talked about it much ourselves, but in answer to it directly, the USP is who we stock and why we stock it. Nowhere else will EVERY SINGLE BAT BE HANDPICKED. That seems to be fairly unique to us! Not many other places will willingly give up some good cash to ensure a philosophy of business and ethical stand is taken, that seems to be heading towards unique!
Thats all good but a customer might go to another retailer because they hand pick and offer other non picked bats. Sometimes choice matters, it does in my industry and you cant always just stock the brands you trust as the market demands another brand. Your USP might become a liability over time but good luck with it.
Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk
-
Does this include junior bats as I thought a lot of companies buy their junior bats in from abroad I know you can still hand pick but does everyone know that they made elsewhere is that something that will be said
-
Personally and just my thoughts I struggle to see that hand picked really matters. For a couple of reasons
Firstly one mans jewel is another mans rubbish. By that I mean some like tight grain others wide grain, some heartwood others none, so when you handpick I guess firstly you pick on how the bat looks and aim to get good looking bats first and formost
Secondly in terms of performance in my opinion all bats once knocked in play roughly the same. It's very very unlikely now a days to get a plank from any of the reputable brands. By reputable I mean any that most have heard off. Iv used and owned more bats than most over 100 since joining this forum if photobucket pics are anything to go by and I struggle to think of do plank.
Please don't take this as a criticism Paul or Chris as in a lot of ways I admire the way you want to run the business I'm just expressing my views towards mass market and not the what I imagine in the forum is a small % of your sales per annum
-
For me what Paul is going to do reduces the risk of the bat being sub standard to zero knowing the bats are handpicked gives the confidence to buy in particular when purchasing online like others on here when buying blind from retailers I've recieved a plank.
-
Who is doing the hand picking for you Paul ?
-
Depends what you're buying I think, all the bats I've spent decent money on recently have been small brand custom affairs so could specify what I wanted. If I was buying a major brand bat (other than GM) there's obvious advantages to a shop that hand picks - for example the Grays in my local cricket shop are quote often pretty ropey, whereas the ones you see at forum sponsors that have been picked out look a lot better! Yes they'll probably play the same in the long run, but if I'm paying the same money I'll take the nicer looking one all day long.
-
Who is doing the hand picking for you Paul ?
Mostly myself. Chris helps me when he can too, especially at Newbery.
-
Good luck IJC. Some people will appreciate what you do others won't be bothered by it. It doesn't really matter as long as it's what you want to do. On a personal note I'm glad to see you stocking Salix and Chase, two quality brands that should sell very well for you.
-
Overseas buyers like myself appreciate the hand picking. I am really worried that I'll just get the dreggs when I purchase off the normal retailers. Have gotten 3 bats off Paul and they are all brilliant. Got 1 bat off a normal retailer and it was a plank, never again.
Sent from my D6503 using Tapatalk
-
Does this include junior bats as I thought a lot of companies buy their junior bats in from abroad I know you can still hand pick but does everyone know that they made elsewhere is that something that will be said
This is correct in some cases and, yes, the ones we deal with are very open about it if this is the case.
-
Chris here.
The way I see it - and the way we see it as a company, is that handpicking can never be a bad thing. It can only ever be a good thing. Let's say that a company would send absolute stunners anyway, well we will pick out those stunners, so by handpicking we are at an absolute minimum getting the same quality they would send us, but more realistically we are going to be getting better bats. Even if only one of 20 bats is of a better quality than the manufacturer would have sent us, surely the benefit to that one customer makes the handpicking worthwhile?
Hope that rambling makes sense, it's just that all I can see is an upside from handpicking, absolutely no downside, and therefore that's the reason why we do it!
-
What benefits do you think the 'we will only stock bats we have handpicked' stance bring you over 'we will only stock good quality bats from manufacturers we trust'?
-
We think that it brings a personal guarantee. It is accepted that not every bat a manufacturer makes is worthy of the grade that they place on it. Therefore, if a company makes a G1+ labelled bat that is actually like a G2 bat - which happens a lot, then they have a vested interest to sell that bat to a retailer. Therefore, they are more likely to sell it to a smaller account, who won't become too irate. Manufacturers don't always do this, but they have to sell bats, good or not as good, just the same, and so we don't want to be a company who just gets the left overs once the big companies have gone in and got the first pick.
However, by handpicking, we ensure that we don't get any of these bats. It is sheer logic that if we handpick the best ones, we are then going to get better bats for our customers? I don't see how that is disputable?
Chris
-
Not wishing to dispute that you'll generally ensure you get good bats by handpicking (as I've previously posted!), just wondering what makes you stick to it 100% when it presumeably wouldn't be too hard to simply return any bats you think are below par from manufacturers where handpicking isn't an option. Pride in your philosophy, or believing you won't get good enough quality bats through any other method?
-
Not wishing to dispute that you'll generally ensure you get good bats by handpicking (as I've previously posted!), just wondering what makes you stick to it 100% when it presumeably wouldn't be too hard to simply return any bats you think are below par from manufacturers where handpicking isn't an option. Pride in your philosophy, or believing you won't get good enough quality bats through any other method?
Sorry, misread!
I think a little bit of both. We often pick through 100 bats before we find even one, especially at the bigger brands like GN etc. This just wouldn't be feasible to do on a basis of them sending to us, it would only make relationships sour in the long run.
-
I think it's a very simple & honest policy Paul & Chris. I hope you have improved business with your philosophy, my best wishes.