Custom Bats Cricket Forum
Equipment => Bats => Topic started by: uknsaunders on February 23, 2016, 01:54:00 PM
-
Cynical hat on here, is Pickup being used to sell heavier clefts? More and more I'm seeing the line being trotted out, "it's all about pickup, don't look at the weight". Is it though? No matter how well a bat picks up, it still weighs what it weighs. If you can't hit a 100 balls with it properly then no matter how it picks up, it's too heavy. Pickup can to some extent hide the true weight but only by the odd oz.
I think the forum follows fashions, we all get a light bat, then get a heavy one, get a low middle and then a high middle. However, are we currently buying into pickup a bit more than we should in search of bigger bats?
-
Pick up over dead weight works in a shop swinging it about for 30secinds.
What happens 30 overs in when your arms are dead from the extra 2 oz your not used to?
-
I do think there are plenty of lines trotted out just to sell bats, the same goes for fad's that get pushed out way, but if weight is nearer the pivot then their less force required to lift it so it's not all BS.
-
I'd make a selection of bats, within my deadweight range - about 2.9-2.10 and a bit. Then I'd pick the one with best pickup. Downside is that I never plan to buy blind again. And it can take a while - ask @Uzi Sports ...
-
Know your bat wieght get the middle high equals a nice light pickup and feel
-
Pick up over dead weight works in a shop swinging it about for 30secinds.
What happens 30 overs in when your arms are dead from the extra 2 oz your not used to?
Totally agree. An extreme example but went from 2'12 to a 3'4 bat that picked up well. Scored runs with it and woke up the following morning with my arm in agony.
-
Know your bat wieght get the middle high equals a nice light pickup and feel
Agree, know your limits and caveat the upper limit with a high middle/good pickup bat.
-
I think it is important to have a rough idea of what the bat weighs. Have a range you like - for me it is 2lbs9 to 11 - then it is about the middle position and performance
get those right and then chose the one with a pick up that makes me feel like I am goign to score runs with the bat (always in gloves)
The idea that you can have a 2lbs 13+ bat which "feels" 2lbs 9 - which you can actually use is unrealistic. But then I get tennis elbow if the bat is too heavy...
You do get heavy bats which pick up amazingly well - but they are still unusable if you are used to lighter bats.
-
Cynical hat on here, is Pickup being used to sell heavier clefts? More and more I'm seeing the line being trotted out, "it's all about pickup, don't look at the weight". Is it though? No matter how well a bat picks up, it still weighs what it weighs. If you can't hit a 100 balls with it properly then no matter how it picks up, it's too heavy. Pickup can to some extent hide the true weight but only by the odd oz.
I think the forum follows fashions, we all get a light bat, then get a heavy one, get a low middle and then a high middle. However, are we currently buying into pickup a bit more than we should in search of bigger bats?
I am with you @uknsaunders I don't care about what people say how well a bat picks up if it is not in my weight range. Only time pick-up is important to me is if the bat falls in the weight I use/like. Then it comes down to what I want to use the bat for.
-
I think you'd have to go really quite substantially heavier to have a big effect on fatigue, personally the concern is more how it will affect your swing and timing. I've got bats from 2lb8 to 2lb13 with all variety of middle positions that feel roughly the same in the stance, but you don't actually do a lot of batting in that position!
Also, I can't be the only person that thinks 'picks up well' and 'picks up light' are different things?
-
Thank God Nick! I thought this was a thread about your dating history!
-
The idea that you can have a 2lbs 13+ bat which "feels" 2lbs 9 - which you can actually use is unrealistic.
This.
-
Thank God Nick! I thought this was a thread about your dating history!
That's the only reason you viewed this thread ;)
-
I think you'd have to go really quite substantially heavier to have a big effect on fatigue, personally the concern is more how it will affect your swing and timing. I've got bats from 2lb8 to 2lb13 with all variety of middle positions that feel roughly the same in the stance, but you don't actually do a lot of batting in that position!
Also, I can't be the only person that thinks 'picks up well' and 'picks up light' are different things?
Not sure you have to go that much heavier to see fatigue, but your swing and timing would be the first things to be impacted. I had one bat that felt fine but after a while my backlift got lower and I was literally picking it off the floor towards the end of a long knock. It was only a 2-3oz difference but it crept up on you in the middle.
How would you define pick up well and pick up light?
-
Not sure you have to go that much heavier to see fatigue, but your swing and timing would be the first things to be impacted. I had one bat that felt fine but after a while my backlift got lower and I was literally picking it off the floor towards the end of a long knock. It was only a 2-3oz difference but it crept up on you in the middle.
How would you define pick up well and pick up light?
Will vary a lot person to person of course, but I've switched back to an old bat that was 3oz heavier than my usual for a few innings or net sessions and had no problems with fatigue.
Picks up light is self-explanatory, picks up well is more of a personal thing. For me it's about the balance, it can't feel either too light or too heavy - a bat should feel its' weight.
It's an instrument for hitting things after all, in theory you want a concentrated mass as far away from your hands as possible to get the weight behind the ball and max leverage (basically like a big hammer), but to make it usable for the variety of shots and long period of time necessary in cricket you need to find your compromise between that and the extreme of the mass being as close to your hands as possible to make it easier to swing. That compromise is of course at very different points for different people.
-
I think few ozs makes no difference as far as dead weight is concerned. Thats like carrying some extra change in your pocket which you dont feel at all you have on you.
Batting puts lot of strain on wrist and forearms because we grip the bat where the object feels the heaviest (straight object will feel heavier than dead weight when picker from either end). It can cause pain/fatigue if those few extra ounces are added to wrong part of the bat such as the toe.So i doubt a bat few ounces heavy should cause more fatigue if the weight distribution is right.
What i have noticed is the handle plays a big part as well. Especially in the nets, if I use a cheap bat with with cheap handle,t he hands get tired and sore quickly compared to a high quality bat with good handle which has reduces the vibration.
-
I have mentioned this to Paul Aldred who is a great advocate of pick up over dead weight. Great when defending and driving but surely excess dead weight will affect cutting and hooking detrementally?
-
If I had a dollar for every time someone has picked up one of my bats proclaimed "I can use that" and then proceeded to look good for a few overs and either get out or tire and score less and less. Before calling for a lighter bat.
Iff have.... Well 3 dollars.
And 2 time sit was the same guy.
Granted they went from 2.10s to 2.14s but all three times they visually tired quickly.
No guessing. Watched first hand!
-
I think there is one bat in particular that a number of members have used on here that absolutely describes this issue. The Ravi Bopara Icon from a few Batoffs ago.
It had the most amazing pick up but weighed 3lb 2oz or something. I tried batting with it and was late on everything. Absolutely everything. They were all straight drives so should have been easy to hit.
So yes, weight makes huge difference. A heavy bat with a good pick up is still a heavy bat.
-
Couldn't agree more. A heavy bat that picks up well will catch up with you during a long innings.
Getting a bat in your weight range that picks up well, thats happy days.
-
The most over rated factor in bats' marketing is balance. I never had any luck with balanced bats. My best performing bats are not balanced; they feel bottom heavy.
-
Everytime I use a bat heavier than dead weight of 2-8 or 2-9 my timing and swing are always mess up.
-
Its funny how every 2 lb 10 bat now "feels like 2 lb 8". Which begs the question - do they really feel like 2 lb 8, or are we using really crappy 2 lb 8 bats as the benchmark!!
-
I have mentioned this to Paul Aldred who is a great advocate of pick up over dead weight. Great when defending and driving but surely excess dead weight will affect cutting and hooking detrementally?
Yes it does you lose your timing
-
Last season I went from 2.8, which I'd used for years to a 2.12 and had the best, most consistent season I've ever had. Factor coaching and numerous net sessions into that as significant factors, but I found the heavier bat played to my strengths (driving), my clips off leg improved greatly and I didn't find my cutting diminished with a heavier bat. Maybe I was being slightly later on the ball, which probably helped my game, but I think it allowed me to play straighter and with more control. I stress again that I had regular net sessions and coaching which undoubtedly helped.
I had a couple of occasions where I batted through almost 40 overs and didn't feel any strain physically at the time or afterwards. So, conversely, maybe I've been using bats that have been too light for most of my playing days?
-
I started with a 2-8 bat and it did not do anything for me. A series of events led to a 2-12 net bat and it was the best thing that ever happened to me. 2-8 is such an over rated bat weight for a club cricketer!
-
I had a 2.6 last year which I used in a couple of net sessions. Lovely bat, but my technique was all over the place. Sold it on here. Now I'm picking up bats at Vitas and finding the heavier ones far more comfortable than the lighter ones.
That said, I'm not facing upwards of 70 mph too often...
-
I have always been use to 2.6/2.7 bats. But this year I got a 2.10 - SG player's edition. It felt heavy in my hands and after a hour of net practice, my arms were dead. Then I added a second grip (2.12 with extra grip, toe guard, oiling & sheet) hoping to improve the pickup which it did but I had the same issue after another net practice. Shot timing was good but 30mins later I was too tired so timing went out pretty soon after. The edges and toe give a lot of vibration which probably contributes to the fatigue.
Then I got a Spartan MC edition Small Mens weighing in at 2.7. Felt a little bottom heavy but still lighter than the SG. Ping wasn't as good but my arms weren't tired after a 1hr net session. I still wasn't completely happy. High vibration and shocks can be felt in the handle.
Then came the Laver & Wood. Weighing in at 2.12, C-10 handle, extra grip, oiling, toe guard and sheet. I took it to net practice yesterday. Almost 2 hours and no fatigue in the arms (I batted the whole 2 hrs). Now, maybe it was the previous SG bat which gave my arms the workout to play with heavier bats? So, I went back to the SG but the pickup/feel difference just felt wrong. To the point where I am thinking of selling the SG. Absolutely zero vibration, even from the toe and edges from the Laver.
The point being, two bats weighing in almost the same but with different pickup/feel and handle (Bottom Oval on the Laver) I think make a huge difference. The other interesting thing I noticed was the swing. With the SG, I feel as though I need to put an effort to swing the bat whereas on the Laver, its very effortless. I just have to time the shots and that's all. This contributes to saving energy too. The Spartan feels light on the swing too, even lighter than the Laver but the lack of ping and high vibration on it makes it more suitable for indoor.
YMMV. In my opinion is that we should worry less about the dead weight, instead get a bat that feels right and that's well made along with a good handle. Along with the pickup, how it also feels on the swing is something I would look for.
-
With the SG, I feel as though I need to put an effort to swing the bat whereas on the Laver, its very effortless. I just have to time the shots and that's all. This contributes to saving energy too.
This is very true of Lavers. Those who have picked up and played with my Lavers for the very first time have expressed similar views of the bat. The bat speed they generate is something else. They are 2 ozs heavier than what I had had ordered. :D I wouldn't say that bats are "balanced" but there is a snap to the bat speed.
-
This is very true of Lavers. Those who have picked up and played with my Lavers for the very first time have expressed similar views of the bat. The bat speed they generate is something else. They are 2 ozs heavier than what I had had ordered. :D I wouldn't say that bats are "balanced" but there is a snap to the bat speed
Which handle do you have on yours? I have the C10 handle and I thought maybe its to do with that, what do you think?
-
It depends on the shape too. I have bats with both CarboCane and C-Ten handles and they perform brilliantly. One of the CarboCane was designed by James based on my batting style and it generates a lot of bat speed.
-
Which handle do you have on yours? I have the C10 handle and I thought maybe its to do with that, what do you think?
Carbo cane will not impact bat speed. It's only a tiny bit lighter than normal cane. C10 is interesting - it adds about an ounce, but at the very top.
So a 2lb 8 bat with c10 is actually a 2lb 7 bat (if it had a regular handle)
-
So a 2lb 8 bat with c10 is actually a 2lb 7 bat (if it had a regular handle)
Oh very interesting. I knew the C10 was heavier but not an ounce heavier! Thanks.
-
It is an interesting topic.
I have quite a number of slightly heavier bats which I am not planning to use in the collection and to be honest, almost all of them are just too heavy and upset the little timing I have!
These include a 2'13 H4L, a 2'14 BB, a couple of 3lb pingers, etc, etc! And I would have absolutely agreed with what people say until I got a 2'12.5 H4L Devil which I can time the pants off! I am ideally a 2'10 man but happy to use most bats between 2'9 and 2'11 range.
But this Devil just picks up so well (although I won't make any wild claims about it picking up like a 2'8!!) Maybe it's the balance, maybe it's the profile, or maybe it's the fact that it pings like a rocket with little effort and the middle is extremely generous? Whatever the case, it "feels" very comfortable when I am using it.
I know Si has used it, and possibly Cam? But I will bring it with me to Dummer tomorrow and would be really interested to get the honest opinion of Mr.F Cattus, as I know he is brutally honest! Plus would value the opinions of anyone else who is coming to Dummer tomorrow? Or it may be that it is simply well suited to my dodgy batting style? :(