Custom Bats Cricket Forum
General Cricket => World Cricket => England => Topic started by: alexhilly1492 on November 08, 2016, 10:18:40 AM
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Following on from the India vs eng thread and not to clutter, who do we think will take over and why?
Root - senior member of the squad now and seems to be the chosen one being v/c already
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If Cook stands down after the India series I'll eat my hat!
I have a feeling the media took a quote (more than likely out of context), then added 2 and 2 to get 7,345.8
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If Cook stands down after the India series I'll eat my hat!
I have a feeling the media took a quote (more than likely out of context), then added 2 and 2 to get 7,345.8
I agree I see him wanting to avenge the 5-0 whitewash done under then call it a day!
This is more hypothetical than anything, I should probably have been clearer!
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im going to throw this out there
Ben Stokes
Or is he the vice captain everyone wants but not the actual captain?
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Ben Stokes isn't such a bad idea. It would need to be someone who is guaranteed place in the team and there aren't too many of those.
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I've heard more than one recently former England player say Root should never be made captain in a million years as he's just not got the personality for it. Swann said it recently and I'm sure I've heard it before a couple of times. Stokes also to my mind hasn't got the personality for it's he's far too aggressive. You need someone a bit cooler and more calculating that that. I could see him making a real hash of it. It's pretty well documented that firey all rounders a good captain do not make and England have tried twice to not much success. Bairstow does seem like a cool customer these days but captaincy, wicket keeping and batting is lot to take on board isn't it. I really can't see a stand out candidate in the team actually.
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Ben Stokes isn't such a bad idea. It would need to be someone who is guaranteed place in the team and there aren't too many of those.
your right there are not, we have had a few changes.
but in a year's time it could look different.
Captaincy over the years has changed hasn't it? we no longer need someone like Brearley...not good enough as a player, one of the best captains we have ever had.
Jos Butler seemed to do a good job in the one dayers by leading by example.
If anyone had said Butler as captain you wouldn't automatically think of him.
Don't say much by all accounts, so it's Captaincy by a different way.
Whatever anyone thinks of Cook....he is a leader in the team by example. Perhaps not one of our best but the old style captain has gone.
Nasser is thought personally was fantastic, took on the difficult characters to make England harder to beat and never backed down
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a batting bairstow probably makes the most sense
gets buttler in at 7, bairstows at 5. he's worked out his own game, isnt the most talented so has to think through things and he seems a tough character. Also at 5 he can be in the side without being the most critical person to the team
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Poor, poor James Taylor
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I dont think there are many stand out candidates right now. Root seems to be the obvious choice but i'm not so sure captaincy and being the teams best/most talented batsman is something he needs right now.
Personally think Cook will stick it out until next Winter down under. With the focus on white ball cricket in 2017 with the champions trophy whoever would take over before an Ashes winter wouldnt have much time to get real experience and forge a team before then
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They couldn't go for Stokes surely. On top of what people have said about his aggression, he's too injury prone. He'd miss far too many games through injury to be England test captain
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I agree I see him wanting to avenge the 5-0 whitewash done under then call it a day!
Lol - I had it down as something he was arching to avoid!
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stokes is a good call from a playing prospective but it will be Root.
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Poor, poor James Taylor
Yup! he would have been the ideal man! shoe in at 5 in the order and had experience all be it at county level!
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Looking at the squad for India...
Ignore Hameed, Duckett, Batty, Rashid, Ansari as newbies to the team and not yet suitable.
Ballance, Finn, Wood are not nailed on in the team, so they are also "no's"
Root, Bairstow, Stokes, Woakes, Broad, Anderson seem nailed on to play, so one of them.
Root looks the favourite, Bairstow couple struggle with all three, Woakes is still a bit new.
Well, that really leaves Ali, Broad or Anderson. Anderson isn't going to be around for that long I am guessing, so is Broad the stop-gap before the long-term next captain? What about Mo? He's been around a while, doing ok with bat and ball. Maybe he could do it? Would be interesting to see what his captaincy skills/knowledge is like.
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Woakes, like YJB he has been away and improved his game and has come on massively also seems to be quite level headed (no histrionics when bowling) and seems to be able to adapt himself to the game situation well.
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Only one choice and that's Joe Root. He's the only batsman with an average of 50+, he's easily the best player in the team and most importantly he's the one player who consistently can do world class things.
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Only one choice and that's Joe Root. He's the only batsman with an average of 50+, he's easily the best player in the team and most importantly he's the one player who consistently can do world class things.
Exactly why he shouldn't be burdened with the captaincy. Just let the lad bat and bat and bat!!
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Exactly why he shouldn't be burdened with the captaincy. Just let the lad bat and bat and bat!!
The likes of Kohli, Williamson and smith average more as captain. Who's to say Root wouldn't be the same?
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Stokes as Captian!
A) Way too early in the piece, will ruin him a la Botham 1981
B) He has true 'ginger' temperament and may not make it through his first press conference.
Very, very bad idea.
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it really depends on when Cook stands down - series to come are -
South Africa - Home Summer 2017
West Indies - Home Summer 2017
Australia - Away Winter 2017/2018
Who knows what the team looks like then but i reckon it will be Root although it is a gamble as Captaincy will make his batting go one way or the other - as an alternative i would definitely offer up Mo - i think he is a very intelligent, well spoken cricketer, who could definitely do a job, if things with Root go pear shaped.
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No way in the world Moeen Ali should ever be considered as captain. He's a bits and pieces player and only ever a poor series away from the axe
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Only one choice and that's Joe Root. He's the only batsman with an average of 50+, he's easily the best player in the team and most importantly he's the one player who consistently can do world class things.
I don't understand why that makes anyone a good candidate for captaincy. Thats an old trap to fall into making your best player the captain and its nearly always ended badly for England. Yes you have to lead from the front and be a v. good player but if you're not a man manager with genuine insight into the people you play with or don't have a particularly incisive cricket brain how is hitting hundreds with a high average going to help you organise your team on and off the field? Root needs to be left alone to just keep doing those things on his own terms without shouldering a responsibility he's not really cut out for.
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Only one choice and that's Joe Root. He's the only batsman with an average of 50+, he's easily the best player in the team and most importantly he's the one player who consistently can do world class things.
That Stokes lad ain't half bad ether, mind you...
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I don't understand why that makes anyone a good candidate for captaincy. Thats an old trap to fall into making your best player the captain and its nearly always ended badly for England. Yes you have to lead from the front and be a v. good player but if you're not a man manager with genuine insight into the people you play with or don't have a particularly incisive cricket brain how is hitting hundreds with a high average going to help you organise your team on and off the field? Root needs to be left alone to just keep doing those things on his own terms without shouldering a responsibility he's not really cut out for.
Be it junior cricket or a Test Match, I don't like this idea.
The "best player" is more often than not an average (at best) captain.
On the flip side of that, I'm sh*t but people seem to enjoy playing under me as captain for some strange reason. Captaincy is down to communication skills and man management, rather than cricketing ability, I feel.
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Stokes as Captian!
A) Way too early in the piece, will ruin him a la Botham 1981
B) He has true 'ginger' temperament and may not make it through his first press conference.
Very, very bad idea.
oh stop being a spoilsport, don tell me after a hot day bowling flat out on a dead track in Colombo when the oppo are 500-2 you would not like to hear the following post day interview:
knighty: ''So Ben, England have had a bad day bowlers not looking very threatening today, what's it like bowling in 45 degree heat?''
Stokes: '' i'm going to re-arrange your face'
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oh stop being a spoilsport, don tell me after a hot day bowling flat out on a dead track in Colombo when the oppo are 500-2 you would not like to hear the following post day interview:
knighty: ''So Ben, England have had a bad day bowlers not looking very threatening today, what's it like bowling in 45 degree heat?''
Stokes: '' i'm going to re-arrange your face'
I like to think he's handle himself well in such an interview, and his friendly Northern tenancies would come out...
"Aye, we was f*cking dreadful lad. Get that microphone out me face, I'm off for a pint o' gravy"
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No way in the world Moeen Ali should ever be considered as captain. He's a bits and pieces player and only ever a poor series away from the axe
it's a great suggestion. he's an intelligent understated cricketer. If you take both batting and his bowling he's been invaluable for England.
If you take his bowling alone...agreed although it's getting better.
But an allround contribution England can't do without him....he does both and he's in the team to do both.
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I like to think he's handle himself well in such an interview, and his friendly Northern tenancies would come out...
"Aye, we was f*cking dreadful lad. Get that microphone out me face, I'm off for a pint o' gravy"
it will come as no surprise Nasser is a huge fan of Stokes and the way he plays.
For those that remember Nass as a total hothead capable of flying off the handle
said to of obliterated untold number of bats after getting out against dressing room walls
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Not many stand out candidates.
Root is the obvious choice for me. His attitude is infectious and I think it would pull others along with him.
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Woakes.
Just so we get to see Seniorplayer lose his fruit.
Or Root, whatever.
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Root will be offered the Captaincy and they will probably ask Cook to be Vice! Cook will probably decline and they will offer to Stokes.
Or that's what I suspect.
But I'm sure that Cook would still offer his advice too!!
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Batty
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Benji!
He has the most fight in him out of all the options and if groomed properly, he'd be a fantastic leader. Forget a cool head (not that he can learn to channel his aggressive temperament), England - with all the depth and talent they have - need a captain who will lead from the front and rouse the team to leave everything on the field.
Root should be groomed for records and sport PR in U.K. Cook should leave captaincy to focus on records as well.
If not Benji, then I'd opt for Jos Butler. He was very impressive in Bangladesh.
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Get Andrew Gale in as specialist skipper, the Yorkshire fans would love that!! :D ;)
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Get Andrew Gale in as specialist skipper, the Yorkshire fans would love that!! :D ;)
:o
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Ahh - but Andrew Strauss would veto that, as we all know that he is the 'Devil of the Ridings'!
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If Gale was batting as he was three to four years ago, that wouldn't be a totally ridiculous shout - you would figure, after all, that he was good for the runs that Ballance/Vince/whoever was offering up. But Windy has not been anywhere near that level in the Championship years. There aren't really any credible external candidates - Morgan is hardly likely to get back into the test side and the assorted Lions captains have not really hit the heights...
I also don't think Root should be given it. We shouldn't overburden someone who is our second best batsman and who plays all three formats. Stokes similar, as well as the temprament issue.
Who does that leave though? For me, Buttler would be a massive call, Broad has been shown to lack the nous required and Bairstow...just let him bat (and keep, if thats what you like). So....if he could hang on for another couple of years, I'd go Jimmy Anderson. We can pack the side with all rounders to keep his work load light, and he does have a decent level of cricket smarts together with the requisite ECB-media profile.
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Tough one innit!
The fact that the team already relies on so many people to perform multiple roles makes it harder.
I agree that I'd prefer it not to be root. Burdening your best player is the wrong thing to do.
Needs to be a player whose place in the team is safe and who is not already performing dual roles... Of which we have none!
So Root will prob end up doing it. A non-keeping YJB I think would be a good shout, but don't think that's the path they want to take.
A fit James Taylor or a James Vince that can score runs at test level would have been nice.
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Down the years it generally hasn't worked, most able player as Captain. Buttler may be a better bet, wish I could explain why.
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How much has Root captained before? VC is one thing but having the team on your shoulder is another and I'm not sure he has the instinct for it. A captain should be a guaranteed starter and have the man management skills and cricket brain ahead of any other contribution to the team IMO.
Captained every side he's played for in his career, so a fair bit
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To all the people saying Jos Buttler - how would you get him into the side to begin with?
Once in the side is he in as captain & batsman, or does he take over the gloves too and have a crazy workload?
Root and Stokes are possibly the only two with their paces nailed down for the foreseeable future, and I'd rather not burden either of them with it.
Vince has captained both Hampshire and the Lions, so he would have possibly had an outside chance if he wasn't out of his depth in the Test arena.
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Am I the only one who think Broad (as petulant as he can be) might be the best man for the job? Wealth of Test match experience, should have the respect of the dressing room, aggressive winning mentality, still only 30yo, nailed on in the side but not really required to bat any more so only one "job" in the side.
That being said it'll be Root.
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Down the years it generally hasn't worked, most able player as Captain. Buttler may be a better bet, wish I could explain why.
Everyone seems to be basing Buttler's captaincy credentials on 3 ODI's in Bangladesh which is obsurd
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Everyone seems to be basing Buttler's captaincy credentials on 3 ODI's in Bangladesh which is obsurd
It's that crazy it might even be Absurd :D sorry couldn't resist!
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To all the people saying Jos Buttler - how would you get him into the side to begin with?
Once in the side is he in as captain & batsman, or does he take over the gloves too and have a crazy workload?
Root and Stokes are possibly the only two with their paces nailed down for the foreseeable future, and I'd rather not burden either of them with it.
Vince has captained both Hampshire and the Lions, so he would have possibly had an outside chance if he wasn't out of his depth in the Test arena.
Cook
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Root
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Ali
Stokes
Bairstow
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Woakes
Broad
Anderson
All nailed on for the next 12 months (barring injury) IMO. Give it to Broad or Ali.
To all the people saying Jos Buttler - how would you get him into the side to begin with?
Once in the side is he in as captain & batsman, or does he take over the gloves too and have a crazy workload?
Easy, bat him at 8. Can captain and keep if they want him to.
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Throw I left field idea but England may still need a batsmen at 4/5 if Duckett & Ahmed don't work, Sam Northeast is County skipper and been a solid performer for 2 seasons in county championship. Will never happen but my wild card pick.
If cook does stand down it will only be Root really that they could offer it to
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Ali bomaye ! Ali bomaye ! Ali bomaye ! Ali bomaye!
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Northeast is a decent player but surely they'd look at Roy, Bell-Drummond, Westley, Clarke, Burnham, Lees etc first?
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Northeast is a decent player but surely they'd look at Roy, Bell-Drummond, Westley, Clarke, Burnham, Lees etc first?
In my humble opinion not before Northeast but along with the others mentioned they should all be looked at. Northeast was mentioned purely as he is skipper of his county
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Root all the way.