Custom Bats Cricket Forum
General Cricket => Your Cricket => Topic started by: six and out on December 05, 2016, 09:21:04 AM
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So my clubs league have decided to bring in a rule starting next season that you have to bowl your overs in a set time or you get penalised. To be honest it has been coming as there have been some stupidly late finishes for no reason apart from slow over rates and something had to give.
The rule specifics -
Bowl your 44 overs (i know its a weird number) in 150 mins (2.5 hours) or for every over after the time you get penalised 6 runs. By my maths it is 17.6 overs an hour or an over every 3.4 mins. There will be leeway given apparently for things like lost balls etc... but that just opens up peoples questioning of the umpires i reckon.
What i find interesting is how they got to this number when you consider to below competition minimum over rates -
Tests - 15 overs an hour
Specsavers FCCC - 16 overs an hour
Royal London Cup - 15.15 overs an hour (50 in 3.5 hours)
ODI - 14.28 overs an hour
T20I - 14.11 overs an hour
T20 Blast - 19 overs in 90 mins (eg. be in position for the 20th)
Looking at these and from experience of playing in the league for the last 5 years i don't think the majority of teams have got much chance of doing this.
What are everyone's thoughts? and i would like to know if anyone else plays with these sorts of rules and if so what are they?
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Cant remember what the penalties are but im sure we have to do 50 overs in 3 hours so just over 16 an hour and that includes loss of wickets so about every 3.6 mins
its a struggle some weeks but rarely and it has stopped some captains who would take 4 hours to bowl their overs
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When you compare it to LMS, where we have to bowl 100 balls in an hour, which equates to 16.7 overs an hour in six-ball cricket, with one end change and 8 fielders, so plenty of boundary fetching, 17.6 is pretty a tough ask! I think anything around 16-16.5 is reasonable in Saturday cricket.
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Last season i filled in for a mates side . 40 overs per side . If you didn't bowl the overs in time the innings stopped at the designated time regardless (ie meant to finish by 3pm but only 35overs bowled ,then the innings finishes at 3pm / 35 overs etc . In this example the team batting second only has 35 overs to bat ,instead of 40, which is where the time is caught up . Apparently, the thinking is that the penalty for the first teams slow over rate is that they are docked the overs they didn't bowl , but the team batting first is deprived of knowing when their innings would end /how to pace their innings . Even so , i understand the logic behind this , but personally, i prefer proper /80 over/full day innings , so 40 overs felt like a rip off , 35 etc just felt a bit 'mickey mouse' for my liking.
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So my clubs league have decided to bring in a rule starting next season that you have to bowl your overs in a set time or you get penalised. To be honest it has been coming as there have been some stupidly late finishes for no reason apart from slow over rates and something had to give.
The rule specifics -
Bowl your 44 overs (i know its a weird number) in 150 mins (2.5 hours) or for every over after the time you get penalised 6 runs. By my maths it is 17.6 overs an hour or an over every 3.4 mins. There will be leeway given apparently for things like lost balls etc... but that just opens up peoples questioning of the umpires i reckon.
We have 50 overs in 3.5 min pr over. Never been behind during a full innings. Just be on the trott during overs, and have a captain with a tight setting.
Spinners usually take less, seamers a bit more.
Otherwise, take wickets!
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We have to bowl 50 overs in 3 hours but the umpires have been asked to help it along and give leeway based on the match situation. The umpires will judge it on 17 overs per hour and give the captain an update every hour which is helpful. For the last couple of seasons they've also been given rough time estimates to add on for stoppages too, like 2 mins per wicket. So, for example, if you take 3h 15 minutes to bowl 50 overs but take 8 wickets you're ok with time.
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Perhaps this is a genius way of the ECB to improve our spin bowling stocks, as you'd have to bowl spin for almost all the innings to get through your overs in time.
Give it a few years and seam bowling will be dead as a result of this, though...
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Perhaps this is a genius way of the ECB to improve our spin bowling stocks, as you'd have to bowl spin for almost all the innings to get through your overs in time.
Give it a few years and seam bowling will be dead as a result of this, though...
and Jimmy will still be bowling at a solid 75 swinging it round corners
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Our league has 46 overs per side. It has never been made clear exactly how long we have to bowl them. I think we take 3 hours.
I find it really annoying how late we finish. It ruins any chance of going out for dinner on a Saturday night. I still don't understand why we can't just play 40 overs each and start at 11am. 2.5 hours each and a cut off of 6pm if there is rain.
I do understand some teams have people who work Saturday mornings and that would mean a 1pm start. To have the early option would be good though.
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I have seen my Saturday side race through 52 in under 2 hours 20 so anything is possible if you have spinners who get through their overs and fielders who get a move on.
Equally, seen our twos take four hours to bowl 50 so go figure...
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I played in a game this year and we got through 26 in an hour , admittedly with 2 spinners on ,but it did include 2 drinks breaks.We had similar rules brought in an we introduced a 'power hour' ,run around between overs for an hour and get as many overs in to boast the rate.W e found that as well as improveing the over rate it really puts pressure on the oppo
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I played in a game this year and we got through 26 in an hour , admittedly with 2 spinners on ,but it did include 2 drinks breaks.We had similar rules brought in an we introduced a 'power hour' ,run around between overs for an hour and get as many overs in to boast the rate.W e found that as well as improveing the over rate it really puts pressure on the oppo
Power hour is a cracking idea. Solves the problems for those who want to play overs and those who have other commitments. Instead of reducing overs on a Saturday, why not just crack on!
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Goodbye seam bowlers..........We have to do 17ph in a 100 over game. Skippers will only bowl economic bowlers who get thru there overs. quick young bowlers will get frozen out. why the hell cant we start earlier
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The later finishes do bug me a bit especially as in our league we play half our games in Essex but we are in Suffolk so an hour travel time. I don't see why we don't start games earlier than 1pm especially in peak summer I feel should be 12pm April/May and 11am from June onwards personally. We also play 46 overs and its 3hrs but can't say I have ever known a side penalised for longer
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17 Overs an Hour in club cricket is acheivable. 3.5 mins an over. That's a ball bowled every 35 seconds and unless you are pushing off the sightscreen or going around the park, it shouldn't be a problem. Up to the captains to show a bit more urgency and stop spending half the over changing the field for crap bowling.
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Firstly I'll declare a slight conflict of interest - I bowl seam off an excessively long run-up.
Are slow over rates genuinely an issue in amateur cricket? In my view late finishes are almost entirely down to cricket being a game that takes a long time and games starting at 2/2.30 etc for no real reason. Start earlier or play less overs - problem goes away? Also seems it's easy to forget that the huge majority of amateur cricket is played with no neutral umpires - can't imagine it ever going well when the batting captain pops out to the middle and says (in best wally voice) 'excuse me skipper, you're only going at 16.852 overs per hour and I'm going to have to insist your team forfeits us 12 runs if you don't speed up'...
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Up to the captains to show a bit more urgency and stop spending half the over changing the field for crap bowling.
This - it's the cocking around between balls that really slows things down.
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I think the umpires could do a lot more to speed things up. We tend to have at least one appointed umpire each game.
I haven't captained much but I certainly haven't heard any instructions from the umpires, or via the captain that we need to have people ready to find a ball if it gets hit for 6 into the bushes etc. or how long we have for tea. Fairly often we aren't pushed to start bang on time. All these kind of things that might cost you 20 minutes each game.
I also have a problem with the toss. Personally I think it should be done 30 minutes before the match without fail unless the weather is dodgy. Sometimes it has been 10 minutes before and as a keeper who often opens I find myself scrambling for the right pads/shirt/gloves and most importantly mindset.
Start time is my main issue, as I said before. I don't really mind if the over rate is a bit slow. I just want to be able to tell my very patient girlfriend that I will be able to meet her for food/drinks no later than 7.30pm and have time to have a beer with my teammates after the game. I increasingly find I have to rush off after games which I don't want to do. I think drinks after with your team and the oppo is very important and probably decreasing now.
The other thing is, I am bored out of my mind on Saturday mornings waiting to set off to cricket.
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I think the umpires could do a lot more to speed things up. We tend to have at least one appointed umpire each game.
I haven't captained much but I certainly haven't heard any instructions from the umpires, or via the captain that we need to have people ready to find a ball if it gets hit for 6 into the bushes etc. or how long we have for tea. Fairly often we aren't pushed to start bang on time. All these kind of things that might cost you 20 minutes each game.
I also have a problem with the toss. Personally I think it should be done 30 minutes before the match without fail unless the weather is dodgy. Sometimes it has been 10 minutes before and as a keeper who often opens I find myself scrambling for the right pads/shirt/gloves and most importantly mindset.
Start time is my main issue, as I said before. I don't really mind if the over rate is a bit slow. I just want to be able to tell my very patient girlfriend that I will be able to meet her for food/drinks no later than 7.30pm and have time to have a beer with my teammates after the game. I increasingly find I have to rush off after games which I don't want to do. I think drinks after with your team and the oppo is very important and probably decreasing now.
The other thing is, I am bored out of my mind on Saturday mornings waiting to set off to cricket.
I brought a rule into our league when i was 1's captain that both captains have to be in the middle to toss 20 mins before start of play or the oppo can claim the toss.
I heard last night that another new rule has gone through in our league that after a successful trial due to the Euro's last summer - clubs are now allowed to start at 12.30pm if they get agreement from both captains (and league umpires if applicable) - usual start time is 1.30pm.
This will be really interesting how many clubs do this as we have seen alot of us think start times are a big issue for people.
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Yes def a big issue, the start times
just wondering people posting on here 17 over an hour should be achieved, I've been playing a long time in 100 over games starting 1pm and the only teams in my experience that achieve this have two or even three quality spinners. I just cannot see even if the umpires/captains pushed things a long a bit how it can be done
we have a 20 min tea break in the Middlesex championship-reduced from 30 mins a couple of years ago.
I'm absolutely convinced myself 10 overs should be gone from league games and it should be 90 overs......
somehow we have to shorten the games, I have finished at 8pm many many times
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Are later start times mainly because of Saturday morning workers? Golfers trying to fit a round in before playing? Or another reason I can't think of?
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Are later start times mainly because of Saturday morning workers? Golfers trying to fit a round in before playing? Or another reason I can't think of?
Morning workers is the general concern with starting earlier - I know for a fact at least 3/4 of our players each week work the Saturday morning.
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Morning workers is the general concern with starting earlier - I know for a fact at least 3/4 of our players each week work the Saturday morning.
Yep it's the Saturday morning workers that will mean that no matter how many times the earlier start time gets but forward at our League AGM (the last 6 years by my count) it will never get voted in due to the amount of players that work Saturday mornings.
Thats why our league finally agreed on this 'compromise' where if the clubs agree you can start the game early.
It won't happen for us because our 1's captain works Saturday till 12 ;) ;)
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I understand about the workers, can't exactly rule a huge number of people so I can have a good Saturday night. The compromise of starting early if both teams agree seems the most sensible option. Even if you could start 4 games a season early it would make for a better experience.
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Firstly I'll declare a slight conflict of interest - I bowl seam off an excessively long run-up.
Are slow over rates genuinely an issue in amateur cricket? In my view late finishes are almost entirely down to cricket being a game that takes a long time and games starting at 2/2.30 etc for no real reason. Start earlier or play less overs - problem goes away? Also seems it's easy to forget that the huge majority of amateur cricket is played with no neutral umpires - can't imagine it ever going well when the batting captain pops out to the middle and says (in best wally voice) 'excuse me skipper, you're only going at 16.852 overs per hour and I'm going to have to insist your team forfeits us 12 runs if you don't speed up'...
I doubt your run up is longer than the likes of Ian Botham, Graham Dilley and Bob Willis at their peak...yet they managed 17-18 an hour for England...
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When I was playing 3rd XI cricket 5 years ago we bowled 20-22 overs an hour!!
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It's been said before but 50 overs in 3 hours, just below 17 an hour, we've done it a few times and the umpires praised us for it saying, we don't see that very often. however what i've actually seen, majority of the umpires take alot of time walking to their ends or even finish what they are writing down... given that this may last 30 seconds some times, that's an extra 25 minutes per innings, and nearly an hour for both! Which can make alot of difference!
We were forced not to bowl our seamers last year in a bid to finish the match off, it was getting dark but the batsman could see fairly well as they were tonking the medium pacers about pretty well. It got darker and darker, and the umpires told our captain he has to bowl 2 spinners, he turned around and said i dont have 2 spinners, let's not argue about this the less time we spend discussing it the quicker we will be done. Needless to say it ended in a draw due to umpires taking their time to begin with, had those 25 minutes for innings been nullified, we would have been able to bowl our seamers and finish them off.
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Lost count of the times I've barked 'we're ready' from behind the stumps in the last couple of seasons because as a fielding team we are all in place and ready to start an over but umpires are still messing about or batsmen are still having their meeting between overs.
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Lost count of the times I've barked 'we're ready' from behind the stumps in the last couple of seasons because as a fielding team we are all in place and ready to start an over but umpires are still messing about or batsmen are still having their meeting between overs.
Good point this, got to own up I do like a 'meeting' between overs when batting to chat about pretty much the same stuff, it's amazing the habit of keep going,watch the ball, look for the singles can be repeated over after over.
Batters should be ready when the fielding side is for sure. There's not really any excuse not to be.surprisingly in our league anyway, umpires don't often mention to batsmen to get ready, but they do to the fielding side.
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Good point this, got to own up I do like a 'meeting' between overs when batting to chat about pretty much the same stuff, it's amazing the habit of keep going,watch the ball, look for the singles can be repeated over after over.
Batters should be ready when the fielding side is for sure. There's not really any excuse not to be.surprisingly in our league anyway, umpires don't often mention to batsmen to get ready, but they do to the fielding side.
Its normally 'We have loads of time, if we get a steady 3/4 an over we can push later on, lets not do anything silly' I then watch from the non strikers end where the batsmen swings so hard he almost breaks his back in the process and gets clean bowled middle stump.
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Its normally 'We have loads of time, if we get a steady 3/4 an over we can push later on, lets not do anything silly' I then watch from the non strikers end where the batsmen swings so hard he almost breaks his back in the process and gets clean bowled middle stump.
Don't talk about my batting like that!
contributing to the thread, our 3s have a spinner known for bowling 90 second overs, so he'd do fine, but then again our 4's have a seamer that takes 30 seconds to recover at the end of his mark between each ball, even when the batsman and all the fielders are waiting. He's not the most popular on the pitch...