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General Cricket => Latest Matches => Topic started by: ppccopener on April 16, 2019, 01:53:19 PM
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the legend that is Chris Woakes speaks out against Archer's possible WC selection saying the current group is 'tight knit' and has won lots of series. He's right about that.its the best team we have had in living memory, with due respect to the class of 92 that just missed out on the trophy( I remember that not sure most of the forum will). Previously David Willey has expressed similar views to CW.
So what does the forum think? strongest team regardless or is it, or as Woakes says 'morally not right' to parachute in a player only just qualified.
It's a discussion point where they may be differing views, for those that wold suggest Archer replaces Woakes(there will be someone!), that's not really the point....
:)
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It's funny than Woakes and Willey are against his selection when it's their places that are most likely under threat... ???
If the squad was that "tight knit" they'd welcome the rising star who's just been called into the squad with open arms anyway, wouldn't they?
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Can't see that Woakes could possibly be under threat given he's been our first choice seamer over the last several years?
Daft not to pick Archer in my view. 1-10 pick themselves and 11 is probably now Wood. Hales as spare bat plus Denly/Dawson leaves 2 spots. Incumbent contenders are Willey and Curran, both specialists in their 5 overs at the end of the innings but never complete 10 overs. Given Archer covers opening swing, pace for the middle overs and death bowling, how could you not pick him ahead of one of those? The 'tight-knit squad', 'these are the players who got us here' type arguments look pretty daft when Tom Curran's only played 13 ODIs and Denly/Dawson even less. Unless Archer is poor against Ireland/Pakistan then he's an obvious pick.
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It's international cricket, you have to pick the best team. As long as Archer fits in with the group dynamic (can't see him causing any issues) then he has to play. I would be very surprised if he was left out considering the ECB essentially changed their eligibility criteria so he could be selected.
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pick your best side.. if your the one to miss out improve don't cry about it!
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Archer definitely makes the 15.
He is better than Curran, who didn't play in WI. And there is no point in selecting Denly as Hales will be the spare batter, and again Denly didn't even feature in WI.
Whether he makes the starting XI will massively depend on how he gets on against Pakistan.
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Archer definitely makes the 15.
He is better than Curran, who didn't play in WI. And there is no point in selecting Denly as Hales will be the spare batter, and again Denly didn't even feature in WI.
Whether he makes the starting XI will massively depend on how he gets on against Pakistan.
if you look at our bowling thou, we get hit for quite a few runs, the wickets should be goods over here, and I think myself there is one spot.it's not Woakes thou he's a banker. Willey and Curran look most likely.
I still think the side with the best bowling attack will go far in the tournament, you cannot chase 350 every game it's not realistic.
As @edge says, Archer has pace and can bowl at the death.....
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if you look at our bowling thou, we get hit for quite a few runs, the wickets should be goods over here, and I think myself there is one spot.it's not Woakes thou he's a banker. Willey and Curran look most likely.
I still think the side with the best bowling attack will go far in the tournament, you cannot chase 350 every game it's not realistic.
As @edge says, Archer has pace and can bowl at the death.....
Look I would have Archer straight into the XI but you mustn't forget that he has never played a game with or for Morgan. Which is why I say about the Pakistan series being so important.
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Pretty poor attitude from Woakes in my opinion. This isn't a University social XI. You pick your best squad. No one is entitled to a place in the team
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Think there’s an argument for picking your core group of players
That being said, this is the World Cup, not a Sunday 2nd XI, you’ve got to pick your best team, if Archer takes poles and scores runs in the warm up games, think you’ve got to pick him
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Morgan has hinted archer will be given a shot.
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Look I would have Archer straight into the XI but you mustn't forget that he has never played a game with or for Morgan. Which is why I say about the Pakistan series being so important.
Watched Archer give Morgan a right going over in a Championship match at Lords last year so they're probably acquainted.
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Pretty poor attitude from Woakes in my opinion. This isn't a University social XI. You pick your best squad. No one is entitled to a place in the team
Poor attitude to just read the clickbait headline and not the full article
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Poor attitude to just read the clickbait headline and not the full article
Indeed, and having read the full article this morning I was unimpressed by his attitude. Selection has nothing to do with him and all players have to accept that England has a competitive pool of players to select from and you have to earn selection rather than feeling that you are entitled to be there
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no archer,
morgan
ali
bairstow
buttler
T curran
denly
hales
plunkett
rashid
root
roy
stokes
willey
woakes
wood
i think plunkett is a lucky boy! id have taken archer over him, although that may change following the ODIs pre-world cup
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squadf for pakistan ODIs:
as above but with Archer and Jordan as well
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no archer,
morgan
ali
bairstow
buttler
T curran
denly
hales
plunkett
rashid
root
roy
stokes
willey
woakes
wood
i think plunkett is a lucky boy! id have taken archer over him, although that may change following the ODIs pre-world cup
If Archer performs it will change, you only have to hear the tone in Ed Smith - they are leaving it open to pick him.
“In line with ICC regulations, we have to name a preliminary squad of 15 for the ICC Men’s Cricket World Cup before April 23. However, all 17 players named in the Royal London ODIs against Pakistan can stake a claim to be in the final 15-man squad, finalised at the end of that series.
“The selection panel has been impressed with Jofra Archer’s performances in domestic and franchise cricket. He is a very talented and exciting cricketer."
As i said in a previous post, Morgan wants to look at him as a captain etc....
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If Archer performs it will change, you only have to hear the tone in Ed Smith - they are leaving it open to pick him.
“In line with ICC regulations, we have to name a preliminary squad of 15 for the ICC Men’s Cricket World Cup before April 23. However, all 17 players named in the Royal London ODIs against Pakistan can stake a claim to be in the final 15-man squad, finalised at the end of that series.
“The selection panel has been impressed with Jofra Archer’s performances in domestic and franchise cricket. He is a very talented and exciting cricketer."
As i said in a previous post, Morgan wants to look at him as a captain etc....
yes looks that way....this is probably the right way to do it....I think like lots of others Archer will make the final squad. It's pro sport at the end of the day-someone will miss out if England get Archer in, that is the nature of selection in crunch tournaments,which this most certainly is.
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Yes i think we have been lucky enough to have the full Pakistan series as warm ups before we need to name the final squad, so Morgan can see Archer up close as a captain etc.... and against the others who would not get selected.
It also give more time for us to assess how 'injured' Woakes is.
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I can't believe it - the ECB have managed this situation well.
he comes in, bowls rockets, the squad get to know him and then they finalise him in the squad. easy work!
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haha heaven help us the selectors get right
some of us wont have anything to post on here if it carries on :)
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The selectors have named the 15 to be loyal to them, as they have worked hard to make England the No1 ODI side over the last couple of years.
Unless Archer has 2 nightmare matches, then I'll be surprised if they don't include Archer in the final cut!
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Good to see Plunkett performing at domestic level before the tournament.
7 overs 0-67 today :o
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After alls said and done - I think the selectors have gone about this the right way.
That’s being said, I’ll be very shocked if Archer’s not in the squad come the final squad
Think Plunkett, Willey or Wood will be the man to miss out
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“In line with ICC regulations, we have to name a preliminary squad of 15 for the ICC Men’s Cricket World Cup before April 23. However, all 17 players named in the Royal London ODIs against Pakistan can stake a claim to be in the final 15-man squad, finalised at the end of that series.
Whats the point of picking 15 then if you can change it? Might as well pick 17 with two to be omitted.
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Can't see that Woakes could possibly be under threat given he's been our first choice seamer over the last several years?
Daft not to pick Archer in my view. 1-10 pick themselves and 11 is probably now Wood. Hales as spare bat plus Denly/Dawson leaves 2 spots. Incumbent contenders are Willey and Curran, both specialists in their 5 overs at the end of the innings but never complete 10 overs. Given Archer covers opening swing, pace for the middle overs and death bowling, how could you not pick him ahead of one of those? The 'tight-knit squad', 'these are the players who got us here' type arguments look pretty daft when Tom Curran's only played 13 ODIs and Denly/Dawson even less. Unless Archer is poor against Ireland/Pakistan then he's an obvious pick.
Regardless of Archer woakes looking back at the last 2 ODI series is no longer the first choice seamer his place is under threat now he's sorted his run up and if he can stay fit from Mark Wood also his bowling has not been in recent series consistent. Also Gurney Curran and Archer were the seamers bought for the 2019 IPL series whereas woakes who had been sold previously for big bucks remained unsold. As the squad being tight that's not the case nine of the squad are nailed on but are lacking a 90 mph bowler who is not a one trick Pony.
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Regardless of Archer woakes looking back at the last 2 ODI series is no longer the first choice seamer his place is under threat now he's sorted his run up and if he can stay fit from Mark Wood also his bowling has not been in recent series consistent. Also Gurney Curran and Archer were the seamers bought for the 2019 IPL series whereas woakes who had been sold previously for big bucks remained unsold. As the squad being tight that's not the case nine of the squad are nailed on but are lacking a 90 mph bowler who is not a one trick Pony.
You are lying to yourself. Woakes is the first seamer on the teamsheet.
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The grumpy old git continues to bash Woakes
Woakes gets in ahead of at least Curran/ Plunkett/ Willey and probably wood as well
So what if he didn’t get an ipl gig? Morgan went unsold too but I doubt you’re suggesting leaving him out
A seam attack of stokes Woakes archer and wood is better than any other combination
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Archer strolls into the squad most likely, the difficult bit will be where he gets in the side - England's seam attack has got a really nice balance to it lately. Unless Plunkett has a pretty shocking drop in form I don't see him being left out, he's been so good at the middle overs role during the past few years. Similarly Woakes opening up (also massively underrated contribution batting at 8), struggled with injuries recently but England have shown he's their first choice seamer. Wood bowled himself into the team in the West Indies so if he keeps bowling that way it's hard to leave him out too, suspect if Archer comes in it'll be more down to form as to who he replaces.
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The issue we have is we don't have 2 death bowlers. I mean Rashid did it a couple of times in the WI but that can't be a permanent solution in England on WC pitches. We have all seen that Stokes isn't a death overs bowler! Plunkett bowls the middle overs. Willey bowls the new ball overs. That leaves Wood, Woakes and Curran in the squad. Woakes has shown he can do it, Wood has no previous experience and Curran is a specialist at it but would he genuinely get in the team anyway?
It all points to needing Archer at the end of the innings with probably Woakes.
These pitches will probably be roads and I think it will be the best bowling attack that wins it, much like the Champions Trophy that Pakistan won here.
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The grumpy old git continues to bash Woakes
Woakes gets in ahead of at least Curran/ Plunkett/ Willey and probably wood as well
So what if he didn’t get an ipl gig? Morgan went unsold too but I doubt you’re suggesting leaving him out
A seam attack of stokes Woakes archer and wood is better than any other combination
Not really bashing or grumpy but agree
regarding the IPL gig following a poor 2018 IPL it only shows how the Franchises rate him anyway time will tell who plays.
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@Seniorplayer I wouldn't read too much into who gets given a part to play in the IPL pantomime to be honest mate.
For all we know, there may be some players who get a copy of the script before the auction and decline a part...
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@Seniorplayer I wouldn't read too much into who gets given a part to play in the IPL pantomime to be honest mate.
For all we know, there may be some players who get a copy of the script before the auction and decline a part...
I don't but they have probably done woakes a big favour as a 30 year old seamer who has suffered injuries wouldn't have thought it wise to flog yourself around India weeks before the World Cup.
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You are lying to yourself. Woakes is the first seamer on the teamsheet.
For Warwickshire CC
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The issue we have is we don't have 2 death bowlers. I mean Rashid did it a couple of times in the WI but that can't be a permanent solution in England on WC pitches. We have all seen that Stokes isn't a death overs bowler! Plunkett bowls the middle overs. Willey bowls the new ball overs. That leaves Wood, Woakes and Curran in the squad. Woakes has shown he can do it, Wood has no previous experience and Curran is a specialist at it but would he genuinely get in the team anyway?
It all points to needing Archer at the end of the innings with probably Woakes.
These pitches will probably be roads and I think it will be the best bowling attack that wins it, much like the Champions Trophy that Pakistan won here.
Wood did a half decent job defending next to nothing against SA (I think it was) a couple of year back.
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Pakistan leaving out Amir, I know he's not been in great form but in England I still regard him as a very good bowler
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Sri Lanka named an odd squad
new captain who hasnt played in 4 years and 5 experienced players dropped,
matthews recalled
(im not going to even try and spell names)
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Dimuth Karunaratne (capt), Avishka Fernando, Suranga Lakmal, Lasith Malinga, Angelo Mathews, Jeevan Mendis, Kusal Mendis (wk), Kusal Perera (wk), Thisara Perera, Nuwan Pradeep, Dhananjaya de Silva, Milinda Siriwardana, Lahiru Thirimanne, Isuru Udana, Jeffrey Vandersay
copy and paste saved me here!
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I love the new format. Most teams can beat anyone on the day which means you need to be consistently good to be the champions.
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With Gayle Russell and their bowlers windies look a good bet.
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Yes I agree, think Windies are favourites.
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Liam Plunkett bowling himself out of the World Cup squad so far this season!!
He can’t run up and bowl 80mph up and down rubbish.
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https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/cricket/article-6940489/amp/England-star-Alex-Hales-steps-away-cricket-personal-reasons.html (https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/cricket/article-6940489/amp/England-star-Alex-Hales-steps-away-cricket-personal-reasons.html)
Alex Hales taking a break from Cricket for personal reasons but England hope to have him back for the pre WC camp starting next weekend.... the official line was he made himself unavailable for selection with no timescale set for his return.
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Liam Plunkett bowling himself out of the World Cup squad so far this season!!
He can’t run up and bowl 80mph up and down rubbish.
2 games
13 overs
1 wicket
124 runs
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Liam Plunkett bowling himself out of the World Cup squad so far this season!!
He can’t run up and bowl 80mph up and down rubbish.
Watched him yesterday he needs to get his rhythm back.
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https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/cricket/article-6940489/amp/England-star-Alex-Hales-steps-away-cricket-personal-reasons.html (https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/cricket/article-6940489/amp/England-star-Alex-Hales-steps-away-cricket-personal-reasons.html)
Alex Hales taking a break from Cricket for personal reasons but England hope to have him back for the pre WC camp starting next weekend.... the official line was he made himself unavailable for selection with no timescale set for his return.
Grassed by the other players wives and girlfriend's on the Carribean tour. I suppose they all get to know each other(the wags).
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Well, Wood and Woakes have both had injury worries (Wood always seems to be a niggle away from being called delicate!)
And Plunkett has had several bad outings although last match was evidently better bowling.
Tom Curran looks on excellent form and Archer certainly does look excellent - watch a bit of IPL and Archer's yorkers and slower balls are very impressive, as is his raw pace!!
This is going to be an interesting selection. I wonder if one or two may be "rested" to protect them from injury? ;)
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Everything seems to be falling apart a bit... In the current round of the RLODC Roy's injured, Morgan's injured, Wood, Denly, Curran, now Billings too. Hales is on a break, Woakes can't play two games in a row, Stokes can't bowl... :(
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Everything seems to be falling apart a bit... In the current round of the RLODC Roy's injured, Morgan's injured, Wood, Denly, Curran, now Billings too. Hales is on a break, Woakes can't play two games in a row, Stokes can't bowl... :(
Opens the door for the exciting Joffra Archer