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[Cover_Drive]

One for the bat-nerds ala norbs, Tim, Brucie and Canners (who texts Brucie everyday during his nightshift to gain some knowledge!!)

Anyways, while playing with willows in corner of my room after ages I noticed that pick-up on concaved bats (feel horrendous I must say!) significantly differs from non-concaved bat, this seem like stating the obvious but what exactly enhances this ?

Cheers

[tim2000s]

One for the bat-nerds ala norbs, Tim, Brucie and Canners (who texts Brucie everyday during his nightshift to gain some knowledge!!)

Anyways, while playing with willows in corner of my room after ages I noticed that pick-up on concaved bats (feel horrendous I must say!) significantly differs from non-concaved bat, this seem like stating the obvious but what exactly enhances this ?

Cheers

Before we start this one, what are the side profiles of the bats and where is the middle supposed to be?

[Cover_Drive]

Apologies for vague OP.

Mid to low middles, one has more concaving than another (Oblivion 2011/Distinction 2010/ vs 2009 Powerbow/B3 vs subtle concaving ones ala Screaming Cat Series 1/MB LE)

[tim2000s]

Apologies for vague OP.

Mid to low middles, one has more concaving than another (Oblivion 2011/Distinction 2010/ vs 2009 Powerbow/B3 vs subtle concaving ones ala Screaming Cat Series 1/MB LE)

Here's a way for you to start to answer your own question. Using the edge of your hand or a narrow piece of wood, work out where the balance point is on each of the bats, and measure its distance from the toe. Provide us with a list of the bats with that distance and concaving (measured as H=lots of concaving, M=medium amount  and L=almost none) and your feeling about pick-up.

EDIT: I nearly forgot, you should also include the weight of each bat in the list!

[Chad]

Apologies for vague OP.

Mid to low middles, one has more concaving than another (Oblivion 2011/Distinction 2010/ vs 2009 Powerbow/B3 vs subtle concaving ones ala Screaming Cat Series 1/MB LE)

I am not sure if this is entirely correct, but... I believe that it is because there is more mass down the line of the handle for the bats that aren't as concaved compared to the concaved ones. Because there is a more even weight distribution along the width of the bat for the concaved bats, this extra weight towards the edges can cause the pick up to feel slightly heavier. Also, middle positioning also affects the pick up, and the Distinction 2010 has a low middle I believe. I don't think it is actually that heavily concaved though IMO, but I have never actually seen one in flesh. I think it just looks to be because of the really high spine.

This may be complete rubbish, especially since you're SCat is made by one of the best, therefore is bound to pick up amazingly. But I have found that traditionally shaped bats with thin edges and a healthy amount of meat in the middle pick up really well for their weights. I had a 2.11 Mjolnir which felt like a 2.8!

Pics of the profiles, and then of the concaving from toe up and handle down, and weights would be good! I may try this out as well!

[Cover_Drive]

Will do Tim!

Chad, I do recall my physics that 'further the mass from your hands, heavier it will feel.' However, not sure if its psychological thing but it does not seem to imply on me.

I'll get measurements soon, that should give as definite answer..

[uknsaunders]

Agree with Chad on this one. Mass down the spine, as opposed to the edges helps pickup - if the middle is positioned in the same place and the edge profile is proportioned equally. The hands are closer to the majority of the wood on a high spined bat, but further away on a big edged bat. Trade off is how many of us actually use the middle compared to the edge most often!

Would be interesting to take 2 identical bats in weight/middle position but one has a higher spine and smaller edges. Just to see if it does pickup better. Sounds like a couple of MSR net bats and some tools to me.

[tim2000s]

Agree with Chad on this one. Mass down the spine, as opposed to the edges helps pickup - if the middle is positioned in the same place and the edge profile is proportioned equally. The hands are closer to the majority of the wood on a high spined bat, but further away on a big edged bat. Trade off is how many of us actually use the middle compared to the edge most often!

Would be interesting to take 2 identical bats in weight/middle position but one has a higher spine and smaller edges. Just to see if it does pickup better. Sounds like a couple of MSR net bats and some tools to me.

I think it's 99.99% psychological. The variance feel of weight in distribution of the mass in the concaved bat is so low that you shouldn't be able to feel it. 

But if we get Uzair to do the measuring and weighing exercise, then at least we know what is being compared accurately, and can get a better idea of what's going on!

[Six Sixes Cricket]

I agree with 99.99% psychological thing, the laver ultra pays testament to this, or is just down to the skill of the bat maker.

[Chad]

I agree with 99.99% psychological thing, the laver ultra pays testament to this, or is just down to the skill of the bat maker.

I think the skill of the batmaker is key, and perhaps you are right about the psychological side of things. I would say that it is mostly to do with the batmaker skill and shape, but have generally found traditional shapes to pick up nicer, hence my little theory.

[smokem]

I think something that gets overlooked is where there are varying degrees of concaving through the profile of the bat. I'll try to illustrate this with an example...

We start off with 2 identical 2.10lb bats with a identical mid-profiles and balance points. We assume this balance point to be where the max spine height occurs and both start off with the same amount of concaving.

But now with Bat 1, we remove 1 oz by further concaving the areas above the initial balance point. This will then move Bat 1's balance point down the blade.

Then on Bat 2, we remove 1 oz by further concaving the areas below the balance point. By doing this, we raise Bat 2's balance point up the blade.

So Bat 2 should now pickup better than Bat 1, even though both bats weigh the same 2.9lb and have seemingly identical side profiles. In a way, it's similar in concept to offset edges.

Hopefully that was somewhat clear... 

[tim2000s]

Which is why we asked Uzair to investigate where the centre of mass of all the bats is...

[tushar sehgal]

Which is why we asked Uzair to investigate where the centre of mass of all the bats is...

Unfortunately some his bats are with me, not that it would create any real shortage of willow in CD's household...

[RightArmRapid]

I think it may be psychological as if you take the flame and icon, the icon picks up much better despite the fact they both have high middles and big edges. Flame has no concaving, icon has plenty.

[uknsaunders]

I think it may be psychological as if you take the flame and icon, the icon picks up much better despite the fact they both have high middles and big edges. Flame has no concaving, icon has plenty.

the Icon picks up better than a Flare and 95% of bats in my opinion. It is an odd one. Might be worth checking the edge profile, the Icon has a fair amount of weight in the shoulders. The other thing with the Flare is the edges are big and spine relatively small. If you were to chop the bottom 20cms off each bat you'd probably find the toe on the flare was heavier than the Icon due to the lack of concaving. ie. Icon is less toe heavy. The Icon I believe has a higher spine than the Flare, which kind of backs up Chads thoughts about weight down the middle of bats.