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[Manormanic]

We have a guy who can scare people for fun especially on a few of the hard true tracks we have in our league but he gets no where near as many wickets as our seasoned opening bowler who is probable about 70 tops but can swing in both ways at will.

Yeah, it was that kind of situation - he got the ball through sharp as but didn't really have many ways of taking a wicket - the tracks were too bouncy for him to get many bowled or LBW, slips at club level were not good enough to hold the fast edges and balls that hit the middle were gone.  Even when he stepped up to County 2s he was the quickest things there, but would regularly take 0-40 or 1-60 when other seamers took 4-50...

[ajmw89]

Playing mainly in the 4s, I exclusively play against dibbly dobbers.  Only time I like facing them iswhen the ball and pitch are dead as a dodo and they can't do anything with it...

[Aldred Cricket Bats]

Yeah, it was that kind of situation - he got the ball through sharp as but didn't really have many ways of taking a wicket - the tracks were too bouncy for him to get many bowled or LBW, slips at club level were not good enough to hold the fast edges and balls that hit the middle were gone.  Even when he stepped up to County 2s he was the quickest things there, but would regularly take 0-40 or 1-60 when other seamers took 4-50...

That's the difference isn't it when it becomes professional. You have guys bowling at pace who are able to swing it both ways. So for example when I was at derby we had Devon Malcolm open up 87mph plus mid 90s when it was his day and when on song he swung it away late. Other end would be daffy or corky mid to late 80s swinging it both ways then a variation of first change bowlers from there who would be medium pace 80mph swing bowlers with a spinner in there. On top of that you have fielders that take the half chance at pace. So along with other counties who had the likes of Donald, Walsh Ambrose, pollock, younis Yorkshire had white Gough silverwood, Hoggard Hamilton this is where you saw the seasoned batters being able to build an innings against pace and swing which is where the game has changed a lot. People struggle a lot now to build an innings when the ball swings or moves around but they feel run rates are important, personally I feel its harder trying to get the runs with the tailenders than the top order doing it. Reverse swing has changed things as well it's become quite an art form now there were only a few that could really do it well at that time, Yorkshire were good at it, waqar younis obviously. The game has changed from when I was playing but for the better? I don't know its different both have their plus points and both negative but the principles are the same as the game hasn't changed just people's perception of it and how it's played.

[trypewriter]

I think professional cricket is a different world. At local and even some decent league level you can have guys who make you hop about a bit, but if they make the step up you see them rated as 'medium'. What will also mash your spuds is that when they've played at that level looking every inch the 10 or 11 bat, if they drop back you simply can't bowl to them. One guy who had gone back to minor counties after an injury had finished his first class career reckoned his matches were some of the most boring ever because a lot had played at higher level and at the very least could block all day right down the order. The only chance of a result was a dodgy wicket or if one of the teams had a decent leg spinner.

[Bats_Entertainment]

and doesn't get in Yorkshire's best side...

Ryan Sidebottom was Yorkshire's quickest bowler when I saw them. Plunkett wasn't playing.

[Bats_Entertainment]

I think professional cricket is a different world.

For sure.

[Aldred Cricket Bats]

Ryan Sidebottom was Yorkshire's quickest bowler when I saw them. Plunkett wasn't playing.

Side bottom Hoggard were medium quick really and good bowlers as they swung it at 85mph

[Manormanic]

Ryan Sidebottom was Yorkshire's quickest bowler when I saw them. Plunkett wasn't playing.

Who was? 

I ask because every time I've seen Sidey this year he has been military medium at best - hell, even Patto looked quicker than him at Lords!

[Manormanic]

That's the difference isn't it when it becomes professional. You have guys bowling at pace who are able to swing it both ways. So for example when I was at derby we had Devon Malcolm open up 87mph plus mid 90s when it was his day and when on song he swung it away late. Other end would be daffy or corky mid to late 80s swinging it both ways then a variation of first change bowlers from there who would be medium pace 80mph swing bowlers with a spinner in there. On top of that you have fielders that take the half chance at pace. So along with other counties who had the likes of Donald, Walsh Ambrose, pollock, younis Yorkshire had white Gough silverwood, Hoggard Hamilton this is where you saw the seasoned batters being able to build an innings against pace and swing which is where the game has changed a lot. People struggle a lot now to build an innings when the ball swings or moves around but they feel run rates are important, personally I feel its harder trying to get the runs with the tailenders than the top order doing it. Reverse swing has changed things as well it's become quite an art form now there were only a few that could really do it well at that time, Yorkshire were good at it, waqar younis obviously. The game has changed from when I was playing but for the better? I don't know its different both have their plus points and both negative but the principles are the same as the game hasn't changed just people's perception of it and how it's played.

I don't think that the standard of bowling is manifestly worse now than it was in those days, save that there are not the same number of high quality overseas quicks available to bolster the lower counties attacks, which means that the top English quicks tend to gravitate toward the top 14 or so sides.  But there is a big difference in the way batsmen approach the game - my Dad and Godfather often argue at length that this has been an ongoing process since the 50s and the end of covered pitches in the 70s, but I think it is as much a sign of the times changing.

Your post got me thinking back to a Championship game I saw in 2000 in which you played...

http://cricketarchive.com/Archive/Scorecards/69/69688.html

Although the result was probably more to my liking than yours I don't think you'll mind me sharing the card given you got runs and wickets!  An odd game - Yorkshire had way more firepower than Derby with five home grown Test quicks in the side...

[Manormanic]

More thoughts on that golden generation of Yorkshire bowlers - at one point we could field Gough, Silverwood, Hoggard, White, Hamilton and have Sidebottom, Kirby and Hutchison (the last being one of English cricket's great lost talents) in reserve!  Wonderful side...

[FattusCattus]

Steve Titchard - thought he was a run machine for Lancs for a while, but I didn't think he did it when he moved on.

And Aldo - you got done by Vaughny! No shame there!

[Bats_Entertainment]

Who was? 

I ask because every time I've seen Sidey this year he has been military medium at best - hell, even Patto looked quicker than him at Lords!

It was the game at The Oval. He looked quite sharp for an old 'un. As quick as I ever remember him being, in fact.

[Manormanic]

It was the game at The Oval. He looked quite sharp for an old 'un. As quick as I ever remember him being, in fact.

I think Sibley's blockathon and the general lack of interest from Patto and Brooks might have made him look faster than he actually was!!!  Only saw day three but he looked fairly pedestrian to me.

[Manormanic]

Steve Titchard - thought he was a run machine for Lancs for a while, but I didn't think he did it when he moved on.

And Aldo - you got done by Vaughny! No shame there!

Actually, to be fair to Paul he was much the best of the Derbyshire bowlers.  Vaughan was good in that knock - Lehmann arguably better!

[Bats_Entertainment]

I think Sibley's blockathon and the general lack of interest from Patto and Brooks might have made him look faster than he actually was!!!  Only saw day three but he looked fairly pedestrian to me.

I was there every day apart from day three! He'd eaten his Ready Brek those days.

Incidentally, he was using Slazenger bats? I thought he had a deal with Redwood this season?