Captaincy
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ProCricketer1982

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Re: Captaincy
« Reply #15 on: October 09, 2013, 06:16:00 PM »

Completely agree! That's what makes being a first team captain more of a challenge than a lot of people might think. Personally I'd be happy to play as a fielder occasionally but not every week but I think it takes a clubman who sees the bigger picture to not moan about it. That's the predicament for a lot of ones captains in multi team set ups

So you say 'clubman' but if I use myself as an example. Opening batsman by trade and I do lots of stuff off the field for the club. However, there is no way I'd be happy losing my opening slot for games for someone who's a lazy chap etc. now, does that mean I'm not a club man or just being petulant ? (Quite likely the latter :) ). I defo agree that it is a big problem though but I'm trying to look at it from a personal point of view.
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dhackett89

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Re: Captaincy
« Reply #16 on: October 09, 2013, 06:48:52 PM »

Exactly the arguments we have all season. There different ways of being a clubman and to be honest the majority don't involve cricket. Take this scenario you have opened for the seconds all season. And another player has been in the firsts batting seven and eight with limited chances, you are of similar ability and experience. First team captain asks if you will swap roles for one or toe games to give the other guy a hit. Do you kick up a fuss? (Not doubting your a clubman at all. I doubt there's many people on here that loves cricket this much that doesn't get involved in running their club in some way)
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ProCricketer1982

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Re: Captaincy
« Reply #17 on: October 09, 2013, 06:54:59 PM »

Exactly the arguments we have all season. There different ways of being a clubman and to be honest the majority don't involve cricket. Take this scenario you have opened for the seconds all season. And another player has been in the firsts batting seven and eight with limited chances, you are of similar ability and experience. First team captain asks if you will swap roles for one or toe games to give the other guy a hit. Do you kick up a fuss? (Not doubting your a clubman at all. I doubt there's many people on here that loves cricket this much that doesn't get involved in running their club in some way)

Hum, I think if it were me opening and if imams doing my job I'd be put out at moving. Again though, that's just me as I want to bat and batting at 6+ isn't really a good bat (excluding collapse).  I genuinely feel for capts over this as I don't have an answer. I think there has to be a clear stated way of doing things so people at least know the deal. Then if they want to bat but only bat one in three weeks then they either put up with it or move
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dhackett89

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Re: Captaincy
« Reply #18 on: October 09, 2013, 06:58:34 PM »

It's tough in most clubs I assume a number if players are getting a bit of a crap game every week just gotta be up to captains and selection committees to make sure it's not the same person every time. The issue that really creates problems is trying to manage it and people refusing to play in certain places as it normally results in the same nice guy ending up taking one for the team as they aren't the sort of guy to kick up a fuss!
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richthekeeper

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Re: Captaincy
« Reply #19 on: November 13, 2013, 12:31:13 PM »

I'm keeper/opening bat/vice captain for our club's 2nds, although I spent half this season in the firsts covering injury.

I agree that the combination of all three can be too much, especially if you don't have any natural leaders in the side to help you out. Luckily I only had to skipper the side once last season as the captain was almost ever-present.

Last season was the first where I could honestly say I managed to maintain my standards of both keeping and batting without sacrificing one or the other, so maybe in time I could assume a captaincy role as well. Realistically though I'm keen to give up the gloves in the next couple of years to let a youngster have a go. I'm 28.
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TangoWhiskey

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Re: Captaincy
« Reply #20 on: November 13, 2013, 01:33:19 PM »

I've been the fielder in a side before and the novelty wears off fairly quickly. I got involved with a club through a couple of mates and started in the threes but soon was bumped up to the ones to cover an injury. I'll freely admit I wasn't good enough to play premier league cricket but I had mates in the side and to begin with was happy getting the odd over here and there and the occasional bat after a collapse because I was spending time with mates. However, I was a student at the time and the £8 match fee soon slapped me in the face and made me realise I was basically paying £8 to hang out with my mates every Saturday.

Point being that its the dilemma a skipper will face. As others have said, at most standards of cricket the standout batsman is likely to be a better bowler than the second or third change so unless you can find specialist fielders,  you either have to try rotate the hangers on or just deal with them getting pissed off.
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ajmw89

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Re: Captaincy
« Reply #21 on: November 13, 2013, 01:52:58 PM »

I play in and skipper my club's 4s.  My main aim at the start of the season wasn't promotion, it was making sure everyone got a game.  So far, there's only been 1 game this season where people have got the TFC, and that was because we bowled our oppo out for 86 and won by 10 wickets.

If there's one thing I can't stand it's paying match fees and getting nothing apart from Tea and some time standing around in the field.

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Re: Captaincy
« Reply #22 on: March 20, 2014, 08:28:42 PM »

Usually I find Shane Warne's commentary/articles a little myopic. However, if you move past the self congratulatory stuff - there is more in here about playing short form cricket than in many books on captaincy etc...



Twenty20 is evolving every year and at each World Twenty20 we see a new innovation, but some basic principles apply.


This World Twenty20 tournament will take place on the slow pitches of Bangladesh, similar to the ones in India where I played four seasons of the IPL for the Rajasthan Royals.

When the IPL started in 2008 we came up with some plans not seen before. A lot of people have since copied what we did, evolved and improved our ideas but I would like to think the Royals set the benchmark for how you should play Twenty20 in terms of field placements, running between wickets and set plays with batting and bowling.

When bowling we would always have a set play on the first and last balls of overs tailored to the batsman, size of the ground and situation of the game.

It could range from bowling a wide yorker to a bouncer or firing it down leg side with four men out on the fence. On big grounds we would also bowl bouncers wide of off stump every ball in the last two overs with three fielders at third man.

We would tell bowlers that instead of bowling a length ball for your first delivery, bowl instead a bouncer as a surprise. We did not want a rank loosener that would go for a boundary. The mental attitude of the bowler was vital. We would tell them at the top of your mark, whatever the delivery you are going to bowl, for example if it is a bouncer, say to yourself 'this is going to be the best bouncer I have ever bowled in my life'.

Every ball was a contest. Intensity in the field was really important to get a buzz going. We never put fielders right back on the inner circle. They would always be a step or two in because we did not want to see the opposition pinching singles off good balls. You need dot balls to build up pressure.

With a new batsman we would always bring the field up and never let him get off the mark early. We would have two fielders on the fence and a third man, but everyone else would be close in to make the batsman earn his first runs.

The key to spin in Twenty20 is never bowl the same ball twice. You might bowl six leggies per over but they would all be delivered from different parts of the crease and at different paces. It is about not being predictable. There are ways of doing that so you don’t upset your own rhythm.

Don’t try and bowl a flipper, googly and a leggie because the more variations you introduce the more chance there is for a loose ball. We also went all out to take three wickets in the first six overs. That could mean having three slips, a bat-pad or a leg gully so you would risk conceding more runs in the first six overs to take wickets.

We would also ensure the field would change every ball. As a captain you have to be two overs ahead of the game all the time. If you get a wicket you might bring your part-timer on for a quick over just to sneak it in while the new batsman is getting accustomed to the pace of the pitch, which helps make up an over if one of your main bowlers has been expensive.

When batting we tried to be 50-plus after the first six overs. We always thought we could get 50 off the last five so that gave us 100 off 11. If we managed seven or eight an over off the other nine we would post 170-plus most times. That was our basic strategy. In Bangladesh you might want to get more runs in the first six overs because it could be harder to score through the middle.

Normally, as soon as the seventh over starts the spinners come on and the field goes back. We used to have our best two players of spin, Yusuf Pathan and Ravi Jadeja, padded up from the sixth over so, regardless of the batting order, if we lost two wickets in the first three overs those two guys would drop down and be ready as soon as the spinners came on.

This would force the opposition to change tactics. They would have to bring their quicks back on, which was fine because it meant at the end of our innings they would have to bowl part-timers or risk a few overs from the spinners which we could take advantage of straight away.

You have to think on your feet in Twenty20 which is why we made all the players sit out on the ground to watch the match, not in the dressing room. It gives you a feel for the game.

I never captained in Tests but I did a lot in first-class and one-day cricket and I found Twenty20 the most satisfying because it was all about instinct. Yes I have talked about plans, but you had to adapt quickly because you are up against the clock. You have to be proactive and reactive all the time as a captain.

In Bangladesh that will be crucial because more than half of the overs will be bowled by spinners.

Pakistan, India and Sri Lanka will clearly be confident playing in the sub-continent but West Indies will be very dangerous. The tournament is only being played at two venues so the wickets are going to break up and spin will play a huge part.

We are likely to see spin bowlers opening the bowling so teams might want to put their best players of spin in a pinch-hitter role. If England want to have a chance, then Ravi Bopara has to be batting up the order rather than being the finisher. I think he was wasted in the West Indies batting down at No 7. He should be in the top three making big runs.

From the way they played spin in the West Indies, England will struggle in Bangladesh. They did not seem to have a plan in the Caribbean and just tried to swing and hit spin for four or six. They have to go back to the drawing board, work out a plan and look at the batting order.

Ashley Giles knows his cricket and perhaps they were just experimenting in the West Indies but he needs to attack rather than defend.

A top four of Alex Hales, Michael Lumb, Ian Bell and Ravi Bopara, with Eoin Morgan at five, could be dangerous. England have to think about how they can score big runs at the top rather than being cautious and worrying about losing a few early wickets. At the moment they are putting faith in the finishers. I would try having a few starters first.
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"Bradman didn't used to have any trigger movements or anything like that. He turned batting into a subconscious act" Tony Shillinglaw.

ijmorgan

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Re: Captaincy
« Reply #23 on: March 20, 2014, 08:43:17 PM »

That was a good read, just shows it all about thinking on your feet and being able to adapt in a very small time frame. The flexibility seems to be missing from England's set up as well as a few other things.
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ProCricketer1982

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Re: Captaincy
« Reply #24 on: March 20, 2014, 08:44:33 PM »

That was a good read, just shows it all about thinking on your feet and being able to adapt in a very small time frame. The flexibility seems to be missing from England's set up as well as a few other things.

Eng only had one player capable of this thinking... And he's been fired. They'd rather have plodder Cook
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ijmorgan

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Re: Captaincy
« Reply #25 on: March 20, 2014, 08:49:31 PM »

I agree he was one of the other things.
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MJB3

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Re: Captaincy
« Reply #26 on: March 20, 2014, 11:33:25 PM »

Interesting to note how they planned the first and last ball in an attempt to prevent a boundary.

Nothing worse for a bowler to concede a boundary of the first ball, heaps the pressure on as 5 singles means atleast 9 off the over.

Same with the last, if you have had a good over, nothing worse than wasting it.

To be fair to Warne, whilst all that he says must be taken with a pinch of salt, I do remember him having close fielders in for the early overs, and the RR often putting others on the back foot.
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