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[tailender]

Afternoon everyone.

just thought I would pop this post up and see what everyone's thoughts are, especially some of the forum sponsors.

If I was to buy a bat and not knock it in and it was to break in indoor nets, would I be entitled to a replacement? or would this simply be my own stupid fault?

Reason for me asking, theres a guy who plays in my club's third team and he literally hits everything at the toe, last night his bat broke for the second time (he's already been given one replacement) and I asked him whether or not he knocks his bats in.  His reply was "the pro's don't so why should we" as you can probably tell hes a bit of a Pr*ck.

I was just wondering what would the guys on here do if it was obvious that the bats hadn't been knocked in etc and the breakage was not down to any fault in that bat itself but more likely to be user error.

surely brands cant protect themselves against stupidity?

[Red Ink Cricket]

most warranties cover manufacturing defects and replacements/repairs are done under this guide. its pretty common knowledge that knocking in a bat can help prepare it/ protect it, although that cant stop everything. if he drives every yorker and doesnt prepare the bat then its down to him. i may offer to repair the bat once as a good will gesture but if its clear he hasnt knocked it in and has damaged the bat through his own lack of effort rather than a manufacturing defect then i wouldnt be covering it.

[tailender]

Well for example, his bat is full of seam marks all over the place so would this make you think he hasn't prepared the bat? of course, he would tell you that he had! so its probably very hard to prove that he hasn't?

[Gingerbusiness]

One of the lads I teach had the same attitude... Until he broke his brand new Kookaburra Kahuna 1250 and sports direct told him to do one as it was 'clearly not knocked in'.

Moral of the story - We are not part of the top 2% of pro's who get all their bats for free/paid to use a specific brand (Apologies if anyone is lucky enough to be in this position) so definitely should not act like we are.

Case in point, just because rally car drivers drive their cars in a specific way, does that mean I should drive my 3-series the same way?! Should I just write off the damage I cause as being 'inevitable'? Or should I do the same as most 'normal' people and pay my insurance, and take care when I am driving to make sure it lasts?? (Because sure as eggs is eggs, Mr BMW will not give me a new car if it is spitting mud and grass out of a smashed up front bumper!)

(1st post back after NYC - Great to be back! )

[kal_m]

Well, abusing the return/replacement policy of the bat makers/retailers by some people causes a lot of issues for people who want to get a replacement/return for a genuine reason. I know some people who abused this policy with L&W.Absolutely ridiculous.

And I would think that technically if the bat broke within the warranty period it should be replaced.What's stopping the abuser from saying that he knocked the bat in for x hours?? Would be interesting what the forum sponsors' response would be.

[Vitas Cricket]

Most brands have what I call the stupidity clause written into their terms. Normally they call it 'player error' or similar and they spell out that the warranty doesn't cover damage caused by insufficient preparation, or from damage caused by driving at yorkers etc.

We warn all local buyers not to use their bat at club nets as almost all the nets in Peterborough are pretty low bouncing. We don't say 'you won't be covered' but i suppose we are implying it.

I am yet to encounter a brand who has actually enforced the 'player error' clauses i laid out above. Most agree to repair/replace and then provide a letter/email to give to the customer outlining how willow is a natural product, needs preparing correctly and cannot be expected to survive when playing aggressively at certain deliveries etc etc.

I have heard of certain retailers who won't entertain a warranty claim if you bring the bat back within 2 weeks of purchase, as this is apparently how long it takes to knock a bat in. Quite an inventive way to avoid fulfilling your after care obligations if you ask me

[tailender]

I suppose you have to look at it from the manufacturers point of view:

if they produce a bat that is up to standard etc and it is broken because of stupidity then why should they replace it? as gingerbusiness said, if I was to drive my car like a rally driver and hit a tree, would BMW replace it? I doubt it.  on the flip side, its very hard to prove that someone has or has not prepared a bat well enough. 

[Red Ink Cricket]

there should be enough of a clue to see if it has been knocked in or not. dont get me wrong im not saying that if everyone doesnt knock it in to my standards then its not covered. we are talking about someone blatantly not bothered about the bat so uses it straight away. if there is evidence that knocking in has been done but maybe not enough, then i would probably give them the benefit of the doubt.

warranties on bats work the same as most things. abuse them or dont use them in the way they should its not covered. if its a genuine warranty issue then i have no problems covering it.

some people need to realise that pros may not knock their bats in but Brand X is getting loads of exposure so giving away a handful of bats a year but getting 100 sales from it is good business. a few bats here to there doesnt make a huge amount of difference to a big brand who sponsors pros

[Gingerbusiness]

Most brands have what I call the stupidity clause written into their terms. Normally they call it 'player error' or similar and they spell out that the warranty doesn't cover damage caused by insufficient preparation, or from damage caused by driving at yorkers etc.

We warn all local buyers not to use their bat at club nets as almost all the nets in Peterborough are pretty low bouncing. We don't say 'you won't be covered' but i suppose we are implying it.

I am yet to encounter a brand who has actually enforced the 'player error' clauses i laid out above. Most agree to repair/replace and then provide a letter/email to give to the customer outlining how willow is a natural product, needs preparing correctly and cannot be expected to survive when playing aggressively at certain deliveries etc etc.

I have heard of certain retailers who won't entertain a warranty claim if you bring the bat back within 2 weeks of purchase, as this is apparently how long it takes to knock a bat in. Quite an inventive way to avoid fulfilling your after care obligations if you ask me

I fell foul of this with the Adidas from UKSportsWarehouse. They told me the damage (A big split vertically through the bats middle?!) was caused by 'user error' and would not be refunding me. The bat had been knocked in for 4 hours and had a Hammer Edge and edging tape applied...

UPDATE: Though I am still fighting to get the bat back - They will not speak to me, nor return my phone calls. Disgraceful behaviour from a company with such incredibly close links to Adidas! (Most of you saw the England Players Issue bags they were selling recently).

[kal_m]

provide a letter/email to give to the customer outlining how willow is a natural product, needs preparing correctly and cannot be expected to survive when playing aggressively at certain deliveries etc etc.

I have heard of certain retailers who won't entertain a warranty claim if you bring the bat back within 2 weeks of purchase, as this is apparently how long it takes to knock a bat in. Quite an inventive way to avoid fulfilling your after care obligations if you ask me

What about the case of bats that are advertised as pre-prepared and ready to play bats? Technically speaking they could be used in the match right away, aren't they? And if somebody knocks in the bat for, say 8 hours and after 2 months of preparation uses it in a match and breaks it while digging out a yorker is a genuine reason to break a bat. What happens then?

[GarrettJ]

Most warranties explicitly mention digging out a Yorker is not covered.

[Blank Bats]

What is the ratio of bat breakages from  indoors to outdoors

At i a guess i would say 70/30

I dont recall many breaking outdoors where the quality of balls are stipulated by a league.

Cheap balls and indoor nets dont mix

[Vitas Cricket]

What about the case of bats that are advertised as pre-prepared and ready to play bats? Technically speaking they could be used in the match right away, aren't they? And if somebody knocks in the bat for, say 8 hours and after 2 months of preparation uses it in a match and breaks it while digging out a yorker is a genuine reason to break a bat. What happens then?

pre-prepared is pretty meaningless, unless it is says 'ready to play now' (which is only on GM bats) then the bat needs some knocking in. The policy i mentioned above is not one i have ever dreamt of enforcing, so i can't comment on what would happen.

Regarding yorkers, like i said before - the brands have policies, but they rarely enforce them. When we get this kind of damage on a bat that has been returned, we make it clear to the customer that there are no guarantees, but we send it to the manufacturer and wait for their opinion. I am yet to experience a case where the manufacturer doesn't repair/replace.

[TangoWhiskey]

pre-prepared is pretty meaningless, unless it is says 'ready to play now' (which is only on GM bats) then the bat needs some knocking in. The policy i mentioned above is not one i have ever dreamt of enforcing, so i can't comment on what would happen.

Regarding yorkers, like i said before - the brands have policies, but they rarely enforce them. When we get this kind of damage on a bat that has been returned, we make it clear to the customer that there are no guarantees, but we send it to the manufacturer and wait for their opinion. I am yet to experience a case where the manufacturer doesn't repair/replace.

I was told specifically that my new Mjolnir was ready to play by one of the pros at the Newbery and, much to my disappointment, required no knocking in other than a few gentle net sessions.

[fasteddie]

What is the ratio of bat breakages from  indoors to outdoors

At i a guess i would say 70/30

I dont recall many breaking outdoors where the quality of balls are stipulated by a league.

Cheap balls and indoor nets dont mix

in the net's I try and leave yorkers. That's my excuse for getting cleaned up the other week.....