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[procricket]

It time to put to bed the fact we have no front line spinners.

Rashid is not good enough Mo is a batsman who can bowl a bit and Root is a under used bowler.

Time we had a massive look at this department and produce...

[GoodLeave]

To Be Captain of England  history shows you usually have to come from a selective background

 Not sure that makes you any less competent.

Good news Chris Woakes fans. He went to a state school. (So says Wikipedia)

[Manormanic]

It time to put to bed the fact we have no front line spinners.

Rashid is not good enough Mo is a batsman who can bowl a bit and Root is a under used bowler.

Time we had a massive look at this department and produce...

Wonder what Rashid's figures would be like if he were bowling at Australia or South Africa on these pitches?  He has bowled well, is clearly test class though not a world beater - its harsh to judge him when he is bowling at a very very good side who are masters of the conditions.

[procricket]

Wonder what Rashid's figures would be like if he were bowling at Australia or South Africa on these pitches?  He has bowled well, is clearly test class though not a world beater - its harsh to judge him when he is bowling at a very very good side who are masters of the conditions.

The pitches have helped spinners he is simply not good enough...

Yes he bowled at good players but his stats of a average over 40 not for me sorry...

Good enough when has he been good enough he has never been consistently good enough

He at the minute best of a very bad bunch it a double edged sword yes they are good on these wickets but we are adding to that unfortunately by not keeping it tight at least.

And please do not go down he a leggie route because his strike rate doesn't tell me he anything special either although it is at 60 which is the norm I guess

. He all potential that's simply doesn't look like happening.

Time we looked at a few other options.

[procricket]

Lets be honest Rashid will not get a look in at home.

[ppccopener]

Not sure that makes you any less competent.

Good news Chris Woakes fans. He went to a state school. (So says Wikipedia)

If he gets a ton tommorow we could be in for a lively time on the forum, and no one has even mentioned M And H.

More tea vicar?

 

[FattusCattus]

Ultimately we are being beaten by a very good side who are better than us in their own backyard - better spinnrs, and better batters in these conditions.

However, looking at the few positives from this tour and the Lions, there is some talent coming up. I wonder what an England touring party might be in 12 months time?

Cook
Hameed
Jennings
Root
Bairstow
Gubbins
Butler
Foakes
Moeen
Leach
Stokes
Woakes
Ball
Broad
T Curran
S Curran

[procricket]

Plenty of positives for sure...

[FattusCattus]

http://www.espncricinfo.com/india-v-england-2016-17/content/story/1072098.html


Hmmm, whilst it not be completely untrue sentiments he expressed, it's pretty poor timing to throw them out now whilst Kohli, Jadeja and Ashwin are pulling our pants down and giving it to us quite vigorously!

Makes him sound a bit of a tit IMHO

[ppccopener]

Expectations of the tour obviously depend on whether you think we could honestly go to the worlds number 1 team in their conditions and win, which the majority of team don't. Their record home is fantastic. I don't know the last team to win there apart from us in 2012. We had Swann and panesar(absolute shoe in he would have been, what happened Monty?), and a truly great ton by he who cannot be named to win a match pretty much single handed. We scraped that series 2-1.

Personally a draw I would of been delighted with, a series loss it's going to be. Not the end of he world, and we drew in Bangladesh....in my book that's decent.

Huge positives hameed, rash has bowled well, not so good here but very well last couple of matches.  Jennings could be the real deal, root has scored runs and so has bairstow-quickly becoming invaluable to us.

Spin wise it's the third spinner that's the problem, can't be fixed overnight. Think back...how many real quality spinners have we had in the last 30 years?. And as has been said how many spinners do we need at home and most away series.

Ansari don't know what to make of, could have potential, could not.

I just hope we go down fighting tommorow, as @FattusCattus says, pin your ears back and smash it.

[Number4]

Lets be honest Rashid will not get a look in at home.

Rashid has been too 1 dimensional.... same ball, same ball, same ball etc etc wrongun. Same ball same ball

[Number4]

http://www.espncricinfo.com/india-v-england-2016-17/content/story/1072098.html


Hmmm, whilst it not be completely untrue sentiments he expressed, it's pretty poor timing to throw them out now whilst Kohli, Jadeja and Ashwin are pulling our pants down and giving it to us quite vigorously!

Makes him sound a bit of a tit IMHO

Isn't he just saying he can't bowl in India but he can on English pitches

[procricket]

Expectations of the tour obviously depend on whether you think we could honestly go to the worlds number 1 team in their conditions and win, which the majority of team don't. Their record home is fantastic. I don't know the last team to win there apart from us in 2012. We had Swann and panesar(absolute shoe in he would have been, what happened Monty?), and a truly great ton by he who cannot be named to win a match pretty much single handed. We scraped that series 2-1.

Personally a draw I would of been delighted with, a series loss it's going to be. Not the end of he world, and we drew in Bangladesh....in my book that's decent.

Huge positives hameed, rash has bowled well, not so good here but very well last couple of matches.  Jennings could be the real deal, root has scored runs and so has bairstow-quickly becoming invaluable to us.

Spin wise it's the third spinner that's the problem, can't be fixed overnight. Think back...how many real quality spinners have we had in the last 30 years?. And as has been said how many spinners do we need at home and most away series.

Ansari don't know what to make of, could have potential, could not.

I just hope we go down fighting tommorow, as @FattusCattus says, pin your ears back and smash it.

Agree with all that bar the 3rd spinner problem I think we have a 1st and 2nd spinner problem but we are not alone in that.

Maybe cricket has changed again where bits and pieces  players will play but think we need a frontline spinner one we have not seen yet...

Do we need one at home is the honest truth and I think cricket has been moving on look around most countries are doing it.

The world does not have many great spinners like keepers there all bits/pieces now...

[FattusCattus]

I disagree Carlos the Jackal - I think it;s all 3 spinning departments that have been exposed.

Moeen is a handy 2nd spinner at best
Rashid is too inconsistent
Batty / Ansari too 'English' and to inexperienced.

I'm going to go crazy here and say that when we go back to normal conditions, we actually pick Rashid as the one spinner and Root as the 2nd spinner for 5-6 overs a day.

I see a side like:

Cook
Hameed
Jennings
Root
Bairstow
Stokes
Buttler
Woakes
Rashid
Ball / Broad
Anderson

[procricket]

Isn't he just saying he can't bowl in India but he can on English pitches

Yes he is...