Topic: Are there too many Cricket clubs? (Read 7401 times)

six and out · « **on:** October 21, 2018, 10:55:11 AM »

Interesting article... it's quite long but worth a read and poses an interesting debate....

Are there too many Cricket clubs?? In my area, Milton Keynes (and surrounding villages) I believe there certainly is and the cricket player 'market' is just completely saturated.

https://www.wisden.com/stories/your-game/club-cricket/club-debate-walking-dead-cricket-clubs

ProCricketer1982 · « **Reply #1 on:** October 21, 2018, 10:59:50 AM »

Are there too many clubs or are there too many �super� clubs who have 3+ senior teams or mulitiple junior sides ? You could argue this means those players who will never make it are just playing in a 2/3/4/5th team and bank rolling paid players ?

Tbh, it comes down to whether you believe fewer bigger dubs are better than more clubs but only 1/2 senior teams per club

billyb · « **Reply #2 on:** October 21, 2018, 11:39:02 AM »

If I were in charge of cricket, rural clubs would be limited to 2 teams and a Sunday side, city/urban clubs would be allowed 3 teams and 2 Sunday sides. There would be an easy player transfer system for occasional games, and a limit on how many players you could have on your books.

This would (hopefully) lead to stronger, more competitive leagues across all clubs and standards.

mdg20 · « **Reply #3 on:** October 21, 2018, 11:46:52 AM »

My club has 4 league XIs and I certainly wouldn�t class us as a �super club� our colts section is actually dwindling along with a few others locally and I put that down to a couple of clubs who run 6 league XIs but more importantly have a colts section of over 250 kids with multiple XIs in each age category. There is an argument that they have the set up and put the resources in to earn the right to have that many kids but they just swallow up all the kids in the area. I think an even distribution of colts and juniors across clubs and measures to prevent poaching will significantly help.

ProCricketer1982 · « **Reply #4 on:** October 21, 2018, 12:30:45 PM »

Quote from: mdg20 on October 21, 2018, 11:46:52 AM

My club has 4 league XIs and I certainly wouldn�t class us as a �super club� our colts section is actually dwindling along with a few others locally and I put that down to a couple of clubs who run 6 league XIs but more importantly have a colts section of over 250 kids with multiple XIs in each age category. There is an argument that they have the set up and put the resources in to earn the right to have that many kids but they just swallow up all the kids in the area. I think an even distribution of colts and juniors across clubs and measures to prevent poaching will significantly help.

I�d be interested to know if everyone was honest, do all these kids and players actually get �better� coaching or facilities ? Sure the �top� couple might but the majority will play or train at 2/3rd grounds anyway etc

mdg20 · « **Reply #5 on:** October 21, 2018, 01:29:15 PM »

Quote from: RPC/Blueroom Cricket - Adie on October 21, 2018, 12:30:45 PM

I�d be interested to know if everyone was honest, do all these kids and players actually get �better� coaching or facilities ? Sure the �top� couple might but the majority will play or train at 2/3rd grounds anyway etc

I think they all train at their main ground facilities no different to anyone else but they have very good coaches and plenty of them and a good set up and structure.

My thoughts are though its all well and good get regular games in the U13 2nd XI but eventually when you get older are you going to be in a position where you get a chance to play senior cricket. At this point will these kids move clubs or just give up playing?
If you were perhaps at a "smaller" club and playing in the U13s and getting the odd game in senior cricket and getting more of a chance to play senior cricket at 15/16 are you then more likely to keep playing into adulthood.
Are these big clubs, as commendable as it is to get loads of kids playing, killing off future senior players for clubs around them.

meats · « **Reply #6 on:** October 21, 2018, 02:09:12 PM »

Quote from: RPC/Blueroom Cricket - Adie on October 21, 2018, 12:30:45 PM

I�d be interested to know if everyone was honest, do all these kids and players actually get �better� coaching or facilities ? Sure the �top� couple might but the majority will play or train at 2/3rd grounds anyway etc

We had one guy who left to go to a "super club" (Home Counties prem, regular winners of it and used to do well in the National Cup). Said player was in our 2s, struggling to be honest and had one fatal flaw in his technique. He's been there 2 or 3 years, is a vastly improved player and has now broken into their 2s and scored 80 on debut. No way would he be doing that if he remained with us.

Whilst coaching plays a big part in a player's development, I think the difference between a big club and a small club is that the bigger club will give them more game time - be it colts or men's. That's where you learn more in my opinion, not in the nets.

Seniorplayer · « **Reply #7 on:** October 21, 2018, 02:21:05 PM »

I would say theirs to few clubs also only two one team clubs left in my area clubs have either folded or merged.
Big clubs have the monopoly with juniors so they get the grants finance plus a nice income from the parents at the bar and so called training fees.
Also due to not many local sat matches the travelling has got silly contributing a downturn in Sunday games

Gurujames · « **Reply #8 on:** October 21, 2018, 02:28:23 PM »

I agree that there are too few clubs which leads to greater travelling.
The large clubs suck up all the juniors, only have the capacity to give the better players (private school kids) games and this is demoralising for other kids. These kids are then lost to cricket entirely.
As a member of a 1 team club our only prospect of attracting new youth players is if a current member has a kid who wants to play.
Unfortunately the large clubs near us don�t want to loan out their excess players in case they join the new side permanently.
Ultimately it will end up with a few super clubs who play eachother 4 times a season and the quintessentially British village club and the awesome pubs that go with them are lost forever.

meats · « **Reply #9 on:** October 21, 2018, 02:47:16 PM »

As to whether there are too many clubs or not, I reckon the answer to this may well vary depending upon which part of the country you are in.

Where I am, nestled just outside of Maidenhead and therefore in the Thames Valley, it could be argued that there are too many clubs. Within a 5 mile radius of where I live there are, off the top of my head, at least 10 clubs I can think of who all play Saturday league cricket. League rules dictate they must have at least 2 sides in the league so that's minimum 220 players there. Most of those clubs have 3 sides, some have 4 or 5. I have excluded clubs in another league but if they're included then a couple more clubs can also be added. There are some Sunday only clubs too but I've noticed Sunday cricket has been in the decline over the last few years.

Some of those clubs have struggled in recent years with their lower XIs which suggests fewer people are playing nowadays. Could this be a sign that there are too many clubs? I think you can argue this either way still:

Yes too many - decline in players, number of sides put out decreasing. There have been rumours about some of the smaller clubs potentially merging.

No, not too many - the club's still get out 2 sides every Saturday, some more. Some clubs attract more youngsters than others - this could be because the club are playing higher standard so attract players that way, could be better coaching or just could be that they have got their name out in the local area and are reaping the success of having done so.

Duck Duck Mongoose · « **Reply #10 on:** October 21, 2018, 11:07:27 PM »

I think the real problem is that there are too few players.

Sky TV (has great coverage but) has a lot to answer for.

SLA · « **Reply #11 on:** October 22, 2018, 10:49:38 AM »

Its such a daft, backwards way of looking at the problem. Of course there aren't too many clubs, there are too few players, and no matter how many clubs are disbanded, there will ALWAYS be too few players until international cricket returns to FTA tv.

Merging is just giving up. It solves nothing. Half the players give up anyway.

There are three sensible sizes for clubs:

Big City clubs, with 100s of members, a big ground with 2 pitches, 4 league teams, including a premier league side, 2 midweek teams and large junior setup. Annual turnover of ~£20-30k
Medium suburb/village clubs, with 50-60 members, their own ground, 2 league teams, 1 midweek team and a small junior setup. Annual turnover of ~£5-10k
Small clubs, with 15-20 members, just 1 team, no ground, basically just a bunch of mates. Annual turnover of ~£1k

SLA · « **Reply #12 on:** October 22, 2018, 10:58:29 AM »

Quote from: meats on October 21, 2018, 02:09:12 PM

I think the difference between a big club and a small club is that the bigger club will give them more game time - be it colts or men's. That's where you learn more in my opinion, not in the nets.

Are you sure you've got that the right way round? One of the main reasons kids (or adults) leave the big superclubs and head to smaller clubs is because they can't get a game.

Private school kids quite often get sucked into the big clubs because they've got connections with the schools (same coach etc). Other than the chosen few county stars, many of them don't really get much of a game. They stick it a few years before either giving up or moving to a smaller club where they actually get a bat and a bowl and they're not just seen as a source of ��.

Same applies at adult level. Big clubs are often a bit of a shambles at the lower levels. A 4th or 5th XI is only ever going to be an afterthought, a way of bringing through the kids. The XI will be different every week, and games are often forfeit. At a smaller club, the same player could join a 2nd XI who are a genuinely cohesive and committed group.

ProCricketer1982 · « **Reply #13 on:** October 23, 2018, 11:13:43 AM »

Quote from: meats on October 21, 2018, 02:09:12 PM

I think the difference between a big club and a small club is that the bigger club will give them more game time - be it colts or men's.

I'd say you're getting confused. Bigger clubs are less likely to give you game time and more likely to treat you like a cash cow to pay for the overseas/paid players. How many players (not just young) get messed around by bigger clubs in favour of the next best thing since sliced bread colt/youngster/superstar

joeljonno · « **Reply #14 on:** October 23, 2018, 11:27:06 AM »

We have 4 teams, three in the bottom two league levels (it's split into three sections) and our firsts in Div 1. That is two levels below the Premium league level

We don't pay players.

I think our 4th team played the whole season, maybe forfeiting one or two games only.

There are other large clubs whose teams regularly forfeit 7-8 games a season.

I would go anywhere as we have one of the best pitches in the whole county. We still pull in the regular cricketer and trying to strengthen at the top.

I guess it's all about what your preference is?

There are a lot of small clubs, but their facilities aren't great and it would feel like a chore to go, unless there is some draw.

Those that are folding, generally don't have anything to pull the players in, whether it is location, facilities, social or training.

Author Topic: Are there too many Cricket clubs? (Read 7401 times)

six and out

Are there too many Cricket clubs?

ProCricketer1982

Re: Are there too many Cricket clubs?

billyb

Re: Are there too many Cricket clubs?

mdg20

Re: Are there too many Cricket clubs?

ProCricketer1982

Re: Are there too many Cricket clubs?

mdg20

Re: Are there too many Cricket clubs?

meats

Re: Are there too many Cricket clubs?

Seniorplayer

Re: Are there too many Cricket clubs?

Gurujames

Re: Are there too many Cricket clubs?

meats

Re: Are there too many Cricket clubs?

Duck Duck Mongoose

Re: Are there too many Cricket clubs?

SLA

Re: Are there too many Cricket clubs?

SLA

Re: Are there too many Cricket clubs?

ProCricketer1982

Re: Are there too many Cricket clubs?

joeljonno

Re: Are there too many Cricket clubs?