Custom Bats Cricket Forum
General Cricket => Cricket Admin, Facilities and Fundraising => Topic started by: ProCricketer1982 on March 10, 2021, 09:53:33 AM
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All,
What interest is there is clubs/teams live streaming their games ? So, PCS Pro charge nearly 2k for their single camera and I've built a very billy basic system using Pis, IP Camera's , TP Links etc.
cost to buy..circa 500 max (this gives you 4 camera's , 2 at each end (one normal on the wicket.. one zoomed out to see fielding)).
just wondering if I should basically message a load of local clubs to see if they want it? saves people paying stupid money for PCS (as this rips out the same stats from PCS anyway and displays it).. it's also idiot proof.. once you power the pi on, it literally works.
What would people love to see recording wise?
So, I've got a training solution which basically is a much better frame rate so you can quite literally, see the seam the whole way down for example.
Match day solution
Simple solution if you anted to take it to away games
even got one for indoor training and indoor cricket etc..
Even got a little mic for stump mic :) :)
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That'd definitely be of interest to my club mate, especially the training aspect (although not sure stump mic would be a good idea with our keeper :D)
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We've just purchased a pretty decent camera to be a static cam to record our games. i spent a lot of time researching IP cameras and stuff but couldn't really find anything which would be of a suitable 'zoom' or reach the magical 50/60 frames per second.
Would like to have a set up like this but we basically had no budget to work with! We're not really interested at this stage for the PCS integration, as our ground is in the middle of nowhere (no internet), but just for recording memories and for training purposes. (As well as having evidence when members of the opposition kick off and start acting like doughnuts! :D )
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Pro,
would you be able to share information of a decent IP camera or the specs that would allow for decent viewing.
I agree the PCS costs seem high and even with a little knowledge people can get very similar set ups for a fraction of the cost.
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Let me remember how to do a picture on here :)
So, out of interested I started using simple USB Logitech webcams with zoom purely for dev. These actually work quite well but it's the PTZ function you want . So 1080P is the bare min you want and you have to keep an eye between what you stream 'live' and what quality you want for training. Bandwidth is not your friend for transmitting high frame rates remember live.
anyway.. when I remember how o do pics, I'll show you the main IP Camera I'll use for outside.. Inside nets is easier still. also 3d printing cases and hardened ones for training when it get invariably smashed by the ball
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That'd definitely be of interest to my club mate, especially the training aspect (although not sure stump mic would be a good idea with our keeper :D)
Stump mic was just playing.. not sure it's ever viable really :)
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We've just purchased a pretty decent camera to be a static cam to record our games. i spent a lot of time researching IP cameras and stuff but couldn't really find anything which would be of a suitable 'zoom' or reach the magical 50/60 frames per second.
Would like to have a set up like this but we basically had no budget to work with! We're not really interested at this stage for the PCS integration, as our ground is in the middle of nowhere (no internet), but just for recording memories and for training purposes. (As well as having evidence when members of the opposition kick off and start acting like doughnuts! :D )
so you can just record it easily enough to local storage.. not a problem. Only issue is how much storage then you want etc etc (data protection if online etc)
Oh, I want to eventually do no ball/stumpings too :) :)
not having PCS attached is super simple.. hell, I can send you a micro SD card for one pi if you want.... with a basic streaming ready to go :)
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Pro,
would you be able to share information of a decent IP camera or the specs that would allow for decent viewing.
I agree the PCS costs seem high and even with a little knowledge people can get very similar set ups for a fraction of the cost.
so, something like this..
https://www.fruugo.co.uk/1080p-30x-zoom-poe-20mp-ptz-wired-camera-system-pantilt-speed-dome-camera-audio-waterproof-home-se/p-54312507-110155150?language=en&ac=croud&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIpZC-qc6l7wIVDq-yCh2ZGwYQEAQYASABEgJCUvD_BwE (https://www.fruugo.co.uk/1080p-30x-zoom-poe-20mp-ptz-wired-camera-system-pantilt-speed-dome-camera-audio-waterproof-home-se/p-54312507-110155150?language=en&ac=croud&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIpZC-qc6l7wIVDq-yCh2ZGwYQEAQYASABEgJCUvD_BwE)
I would go to bang good though ... cheaper :)
You can go better, bigger... but as always.. costs more.
the frame rate can be increased in bits of software as an FYI..
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also, did initially look at this one
hisses H.265 1080P POE PTZ IP Camera, 4x digital zoom, 2mp .. only 25 quid on bang good for example. Perfectly good but just not quite as good as the one earlier for example. All depends how much money you want to spend really and the outcome/agility.
a simple pi camera with zoom will do training for example .. don't need to spend loads!
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Great topic. Have you got any footage to upload, so we can gauge quality?
As that's my biggest gripe with some of these packaged systems. Some are acceptable on a sunny day but really then struggle, once the ISO is cranked up for low light levels on early season cloudy days.
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Great topic. Have you got any footage to upload, so we can gauge quality?
As that's my biggest gripe with some of these packaged systems. Some are acceptable on a sunny day but really then struggle, once the ISO is cranked up for low light levels on early season cloudy days.
I am doing some streaming from the ground tomorrow so will put the YouTube up..
Just been doing clips of the ball currently get the frame rate right.. aka.. you can then really see all you need for technical coaching (seam position, finger etc etc)
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Great topic. Have you got any footage to upload, so we can gauge quality?
As that's my biggest gripe with some of these packaged systems. Some are acceptable on a sunny day but really then struggle, once the ISO is cranked up for low light levels on early season cloudy days.
I actually agree. I've been quite disappointed with the PCS option as it cuts out as it advises people to use WiFi.. better off just running cat6a or fibre (with converter) to ensure connectivity. Also, as you say.. it depends what you'd like .. in game , takes a lot of bandwidth to stream 120+fps, hence most doing it at 60fps.
training wise though, you can up that to 200+ and really get the quality footage (which is good for technical coaching or just selling to players generally)
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We’ve just paid for FrogBox. Looks a decent option from what I’ve seen of the videos!
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We’ve just paid for FrogBox. Looks a decent option from what I’ve seen of the videos!
These seem quite expensive option as well. £1300 for a £300 camcorder a tripod that doesn't look too stable.
And then £275/£500 for streaming your matches every year.
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We’ve just paid for FrogBox. Looks a decent option from what I’ve seen of the videos!
what do you get for your money?
I'm not against them in any way btw!!! They are a business so charge what they think is reasonable for the kit and profit
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we've looked at this, both from Waffle and also the PCS option. as yet not decided to make the investment.
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As far as I’m aware we get a half decent camera, a large tripod with remote pan and tilt, a tablet to be able to change the pan and tilt and a 4G decoder to stream the game live to YouTube.
It is pricey but our club is remote in terms of WiFi etc so the fact that it live streams over 4G was the main reason we went with it!
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As far as I’m aware we get a half decent camera, a large tripod with remote pan and tilt, a tablet to be able to change the pan and tilt and a 4G decoder to stream the game live to YouTube.
It is pricey but our club is remote in terms of WiFi etc so the fact that it live streams over 4G was the main reason we went with it!
over 4G isa. key bit if you don't have internet. The camcorder will stream low enough res to go via mi fi or phone etc
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Sorry didn’t realise there’d been a response. We’ve actually managed to make money from our camera as the money we have gained through sponsorship outweighed the cost of the camera in year one alone. Looking like the camera will make us 1k per year onwards, and I get the bonus of reliving my 3 off 74 balls again on a Sunday morning!
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Sorry didn’t realise there’d been a response. We’ve actually managed to make money from our camera as the money we have gained through sponsorship outweighed the cost of the camera in year one alone. Looking like the camera will make us 1k per year onwards, and I get the bonus of reliving my 3 off 74 balls again on a Sunday morning!
There is of course that angle. Live banner across he screen.. a screen saver during breaks.. even the increased 'exposure' on Boards etc through being on the internet. All positive things.
Hopefully the future is all games are live streamed and saved. I'm sure eventually it'll auto link to the games in play cricket too to save people having to hunt different YouTube channels
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Little update.
Quite a few clubs have taken up the system and I'm improving it every week. Tweaking kit here, software there etc. If anyone is genuinely thinking of paying over the odds for some of the current systems then give me a shout. Really not interested in making money out of it but do love that people are getting online with all the benefits it brings.
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@ProCricketer1982 well batted at the weekend mate, drop me a line as my club is looking at solutions to get streaming set up 👍
We’ve jusy upgraded WiFi with virgin fibre optic so hopefully can cope with it after going from 10mb to 380mb 😂
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@ProCricketer1982 what's the minimum bandwidth needed?
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Am I missing something here? Who will watch these streams?
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Am I missing something here? Who will watch these streams?
We have:
Ex club members who have moved away from the area
Opposition who are playing in other games checking in on progress
Players in the other teams/ who aren’t playing in the game.
Us as players wanting to watch back stuff.
Random people on the internet… the list goes on.
Usually around 300 views on our live streams get clocked up in the week after the game.
But never really more than 5/10 people watching live at any one point.
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Am I missing something here? Who will watch these streams?
PArents of kids who can’t be at the game, grandparents
Parents or partners of players
Players watching themselves back as you learn more
Supporters who live away and can’t make the ground
Injured players
One clubs stream had 40 someone live at one point, most of the clubs hoover around 10-15 live and 300 ish views .
Close games you can literally see the numbers watching rise up. Say the 1xi are streaming you get 2/3rd teamers watching or checking in etc
More fun checking in with a. Stream than a simple scorecard
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as a coach who cant be at games its good to refer back on to see how and why something happened.
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as a coach who cant be at games its good to refer back on to see how and why something happened.
I've recorded myself a lot in training.. Intentionally had no trigger (Buzz will hate that, sorry :) )... However... first few games I streamed I realised... Back and across was coming in...
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I've recorded myself a lot in training.. Intentionally had no trigger (Buzz will hate that, sorry :) )... However... first few games I streamed I realised... Back and across was coming in...
Cannot beat back and accross. Now idea why anyone is against a small trigger, by the way we will all have one..even moving the bat is a trigger!!
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Cannot beat back and accross. Now idea why anyone is against a small trigger, by the way we will all have one..even moving the bat is a trigger!!
Oh, I wasn't saying either way was better :). More just that I didn't realise I had one until I saw myself in a real time game under 'pressure'
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Random thing I've noticed while fitting out some clubs with cameras... Internet UPLOAD bandwidths.... It's amazing how many clubs have really poor upload speeds. Out of interest, what sort of UPLOAD speeds do you guys have at your clubs generally?
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Little update.
Quite a few clubs have taken up the system and I'm improving it every week. Tweaking kit here, software there etc. If anyone is genuinely thinking of paying over the odds for some of the current systems then give me a shout. Really not interested in making money out of it but do love that people are getting online with all the benefits it brings.
Just interested on this idea/the idea of streaming in general. Would you mind giving an idea of the price?? Its something I would like to put forward to the club but I no idea on cost etc. As far as I know we have WiFi but I do not believe 4G or decent speed so would probably need its own broadband etc, in a town centre though so good speeds. Thinking of a single camera one end that could be fixed to a site screen, be of good enough quality to be zoomed in onto the Wicket (not bothered about fielding cameras etc) and ideally I would like it to be linked up to PCS however if this was ridiculous in cost then probably not really.
TIA! Any other input would be much appreciated in regards to what people have found works and doesn't work etc!
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Connecting to sight screen can be in various ways and depends on the sight screen.. Do you want to get more height or is the sight screen enough? do you want the perfect angle or happy to have it miles to the left or right?
Linking to PCS Pro is stupidly easy. They've done a great job BUT.. the issue isn't using with PCS Pro.. How many teams or clubs use PCS Pro for every game??? not a high %%.. How do you stream ALL games from all the age groups, womens, saturday 2xi, 3xi, 4xi, sundays etc etc.. THAT'S the tricky part
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My club (Chingford) have recently purchased the NV Play Elite kit and I managed to get myself involved in it to help set it up for live streaming home matches. After finally managing to get it all up and working including the laptop and the configuration, due to the poor upload speed (2Mb/s) of the club's WiFi; the streams that I streamed kept buffering. Having recently spoken to a very experienced user, I will be trying some other methods to ensure that the stream can function accordingly; I have not yet been able to live stream it through PCS Pro as I was often playing.
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Have to say the clubs up here have gone about 50/50 between FrogBox and NV Play.
Personally FrogBox looks to be the more user friendly often, is portable and seems to have less drop outs than the others.
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Have to say the clubs up here have gone about 50/50 between FrogBox and NV Play.
Personally FrogBox looks to be the more user friendly often, is portable and seems to have less drop outs than the others.
It would have been more helpfully if we acquired it before the start of the season but now I have some great advice and guidance, I will work with the club to get what we need (if possible, as need a laptop with an 8th generation i7 processor and internet/WiFi with a minimum 10 Mb/s upload) along with ensuring the line of vision between the 2 access points between the camera and the connection to the laptop being used is clear as we have this trouble with interruption to the connection due to players/spectators walking in between; I am hoping to rectify this by placing the access point for the laptop higher and within close proximity of our scorebox as I have previously being doing this from our pavilion. I am going to suggest that we have our own independent internet connection (probably through a hotspot or a dongle) to improve the upload speed instead of relying on our poor internet we already have in situ.
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Seems to be a lot of effort, fair enough if you’re a big club and can get someone to do it but when you’re a small club and it’s left to the skipper to sort I can see why many can’t be bothered!
With the FrogBox it takes around three minutes to put up and be ready to go. It uses its own encoder and SIM card which makes things so easy.
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My club (Chingford) have recently purchased the NV Play Elite kit and I managed to get myself involved in it to help set it up for live streaming home matches. After finally managing to get it all up and working including the laptop and the configuration, due to the poor upload speed (2Mb/s) of the club's WiFi; the streams that I streamed kept buffering. Having recently spoken to a very experienced user, I will be trying some other methods to ensure that the stream can function accordingly; I have not yet been able to live stream it through PCS Pro as I was often playing.
many ways to do this better than NV Play sadly. Very costly method.
For the upload speed you can either approach your provider and pay for more upload or if your LTE/5G reception is good.. simply move the stream to that (it's never the best hence why frog box is poor outside of cities etc but still... might be better than you have now)
also, you can choose to drop the resolution down from 1080 to 720 or 460 for example.. again, lowers the bit rate etc etc.
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Have to say the clubs up here have gone about 50/50 between FrogBox and NV Play.
Personally FrogBox looks to be the more user friendly often, is portable and seems to have less drop outs than the others.
NV Play is by far the worst and most expensive option
FrogBox is expensive , single camera and naturally a year on year subscription cost
NV Play sadly will bring in a subscription cost for PCS as well which will hit clubs hard at the lower end
Setting up different systems is different. NV Play you can leave up each time, you don't have to remove it etc.. meaning the only set up is battery.
My set up is literally only the battery and boom.. it's up.. Obviously pCS PRO is configured but again, once it's done once it never changes... apart from starting the YouTube stream off it works (generally) well. Usually when it doesn't it's because 'someone' has decided to press things they shouldn't, break wires or just generally not accept they don't understand enough not to tinker.
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Seems to be a lot of effort, fair enough if you’re a big club and can get someone to do it but when you’re a small club and it’s left to the skipper to sort I can see why many can’t be bothered!
With the FrogBox it takes around three minutes to put up and be ready to go. It uses its own encoder and SIM card which makes things so easy.
Costs a lot up front for one camera, plus the cost of the SIM card per month and then the streaming licence per year... It's really not the best solution unless you're made of money.
Time wise - You can get a better set up, multiple cameras (even now with split screens in the feed) for about the same upfront cost and with no SIM card fee or yearly subscription.. set up time, the time it takes you to walk to each sight screen with a battery and plug it in..
Honestly, NV Play is very very expensive for one camera and FrogBox is very expensive and has yearly ongoing costs . Plus, with it being a SIM card, as soon as you are in a less than ideal reception area your stream is (No Swearing Please).
Anyway, glad people are streaming.. people really do love it!
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It would help if people mention their club names here as well so that neutrals like me and view and comment on quality etc. :D
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I’m sure what you’re saying is spot on ProCricketer but we are a small club in a rural area with no internet or permanent power, we rely on solar panels, we’ve found FrogBox is best for us, I’m sure it’s not the perfect product but works well with our limitations.
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I’m sure what you’re saying is spot on ProCricketer but we are a small club in a rural area with no internet or permanent power, we rely on solar panels, we’ve found FrogBox is best for us, I’m sure it’s not the perfect product but works well with our limitations.
Rockliffe?
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Correct! Do you know the place?
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Correct! Do you know the place?
Yeah, played there a few times when they were in the Darlington and District League
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Clubs came on a lot in recent years! Really nice place to play!