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Author Topic: Is it time to drop Prior?  (Read 6919 times)

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RossViper

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Re: Is it time to drop Prior?
« Reply #30 on: December 17, 2013, 12:35:52 PM »

no, stick with Prior - why has he been in such a dip for so long??? thats the question you need to answer.
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Alvaro

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Re: Is it time to drop Prior?
« Reply #31 on: December 17, 2013, 12:37:07 PM »

Boucher came into a settled side though, with enough allrounders down the order to hide his basic batting ability at that time. England would be looking for more.

I think Bairstow at six and Stokes at seven has legs if Prior is stood down for a series or two.
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jamielsn15

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Re: Is it time to drop Prior?
« Reply #32 on: December 17, 2013, 01:46:45 PM »

No, on the basis that no one on here has identified a clear alternative. England demand a wk batsman. The options described here either lack keeping or batting, are too old or too inexperienced.

in a similar way to avoiding dropping your proven players in a run of bad form, keep in a guy that had proven his abilities worldwide for a lot longer than his dip in form. By all means identify some successors but for me I'll take prior's track record over unproven, ill prepared, technically deficient alternatives. For now.
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Vitas Cricket

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Re: Is it time to drop Prior?
« Reply #33 on: December 17, 2013, 01:47:14 PM »

Just to clarify, i realise i didn't actually say it at all. I think dropping Prior is a terrible call. Fair enough if there was a fantastic gloveman scoring buckets of runs in FC cricket, you can't ignore someone who is banging down the door, but there isn't anyone at the moment.

Mtown Don

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Re: Is it time to drop Prior?
« Reply #34 on: December 17, 2013, 01:57:34 PM »


No, on the basis that no one on here has identified a clear alternative. England demand a wk batsman. The options described here either lack keeping or batting, are too old or too inexperienced.

in a similar way to avoiding dropping your proven players in a run of bad form, keep in a guy that had proven his abilities worldwide for a lot longer than his dip in form. By all means identify some successors but for me I'll take prior's track record over unproven, ill prepared, technically deficient alternatives. For now.

I think most mentioned would perform than Prior currently is but take your point. Form aside, I would suggest that Davies is currently the better overall player but probably the only one on the list I would say that for. However, it's worth remembering how much Prior's game improved 'on the job' even coming into the side at a reasonably late age. Many of these names are more complete players than he was then. Also, as much as continuity is desirable, some of the current deficiencies in the side need to be addressed sooner rather than later and Prior looks to be the weakest link at the moment. It's not as though there are ready-made replacements available for other weak areas either...


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GarrettJ

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Re: Is it time to drop Prior?
« Reply #35 on: December 17, 2013, 02:07:45 PM »

he is rubbish, must be someone better

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uknsaunders

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Re: Is it time to drop Prior?
« Reply #36 on: December 17, 2013, 02:10:04 PM »

Didn't Prior get 60 odd in previous test?
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mdg20

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Re: Is it time to drop Prior?
« Reply #37 on: December 17, 2013, 02:17:44 PM »

he is rubbish, must be someone better

Hes not rubbish though is he, 3 poor performances doesnt constitute you suddenly beocming a rubbish player. If he continues like this for 12 months then fair enough start to think about it, but 3 games, no. Hes had a dip in form thats all.
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Byo

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Re: Is it time to drop Prior?
« Reply #38 on: December 17, 2013, 02:27:56 PM »

Hes not rubbish though is he, 3 poor performances doesnt constitute you suddenly beocming a rubbish player. If he continues like this for 12 months then fair enough start to think about it, but 3 games, no. Hes had a dip in form thats all.

He was poor in the summer ashes series as well - it is a rather prolonged dip in form....
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Leddster138

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Re: Is it time to drop Prior?
« Reply #39 on: December 17, 2013, 02:33:58 PM »

Prior got away with a couple of missed stumpings (Clarke at Lords) and dropped catches during the summer but because overall the team was doing well it was overlooked. It is this kind of complacency that has got England in it's current state. There needs to be consequences to not performing. This train of thought has the selectors concentrating on the failings of the bowling attack and bringing in allrounders when England have had 20 innings without scoring 400 and the Aussies were 1000 runs ahead in the series on Sunday.

Prior has been a fantastic player for England and I don't believe you become a bad player overnight however (as one person has already commented on) he's always been "working on" being a keeper, it's never been in the same bracket as his batting. He's rarely guaranteed the gloves when he goes back to Sussex and hasn't done since he started playing for England. Like many others he's struggled on this tour but without runs I feel his place is up for grabs by either a better keeper or a better batter. At the moment you're not getting much out of him and haven't done since 2012

Would anyone play him as a batter and play a better keeper dropping Bresnan (or another)?
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The_Bird

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Re: Is it time to drop Prior?
« Reply #40 on: December 17, 2013, 02:34:35 PM »

He did save our bacon massively in NZ though. I think most of the senior players need to rest up. Let's have a look at some new blood in the summer.
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imran75

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Re: Is it time to drop Prior?
« Reply #41 on: December 17, 2013, 02:42:02 PM »

Just to add to a few comments about Prior not being the only one needing a break, I did some statsguru analysis of the last 12 months:

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/stats/index.html?class=1;filter=advanced;orderby=batting_average;spanmax1=17+Dec+2013;spanmin1=17+Dec+2012;spanval1=span;team=1;template=results;type=batting

Makes for interesting reading (If the link works). Prior's tour to NZ massively impacted his figures, i think he averaged 103 or something on that tour, whilst over the last 12 months, he's around 31.

Cook and KP's averages are interesting as well - both around 33. Not what you'd expect at all.

Like The_Bird said, perhaps everyone needs a bit of a break.

*Edit:

This is what it looks like without the NZ series, only looking at players who have played more than 5 matches (there were a couple who had only played one or two):

http://stats.espncricinfo.com/ci/engine/stats/index.html?class=1;filter=advanced;orderby=batting_average;qualmin1=5;qualval1=matches;spanmax2=31+Dec+2013;spanmin2=01+May+2013;spanval2=span;team=1;template=results;type=batting

« Last Edit: December 17, 2013, 02:49:08 PM by imran75 »
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GarrettJ

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Re: Is it time to drop Prior?
« Reply #42 on: December 17, 2013, 02:47:01 PM »

he is supposed to be the best wicketkeeper in England, he is missing stumpings and dropping catches. He is not performing with the bat and is getting on in years.

He had to play in the ashes as like you say his form dipped in summer but one bad series doesnt mean he should be dropped but 2 on the bounce is unacceptable at international level and this late stage in his career.

If Haddin had performed like Prior, it would be 3-0 to England. He saved them on a lot of occasions where as prior dropped England even further in trouble.

There must be someone who keep as bad as him and score more runs ... kieswetter or buttler arent that bad are they?
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Gingerbusiness

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Re: Is it time to drop Prior?
« Reply #43 on: December 17, 2013, 02:47:13 PM »

My retort to this would be "and bring in who?!".

It is an art form which has been neglected over the years, with the introduction of Adam Gilchrist. Very few are going to have that ability with Bat and Glove again - Dhoni being the obvious comparison.

Who in England is good enough with bat, or gloves, to replace Matt? I would argue, currently, noone.

Buttler and Kieswetter are the two obvious candidates for me - however, they need ALOT of work done on their techniques - this will take time. They cannot be thrown into test cricket and be expected to operate at the level Matt has been working at for the past few years.

It is obvious that Matt needs a break, but I don't think dropping him for good is a viable option with the people we have in reserve.
« Last Edit: December 17, 2013, 02:49:18 PM by Gingerbusiness »
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GarrettJ

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Re: Is it time to drop Prior?
« Reply #44 on: December 17, 2013, 02:53:47 PM »

Didn't Prior get 60 odd in previous test?

after he had 3 prior innings totalling 4 runs and 13 balls!!!!

He got 60 when it was irrelevant.

now the series is lost, watch these players who failed (cook, pietersen, prior) get some runs.
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