Print

[alexhilly1492]

im surprised mark footit hasnt been mentioned more 90mph plus and a left armer although a bit raw or is being at derbyshire a big negative?

[Manormanic]

Firstly there was a journeyman like Tim Bresnan. No talent but tried hard. Then rocked up Chris Woakes and Chris Jordan, whom are both inferior to Bresnan.

Bresnan was - pre-shoulder and elbow injuries - a lot better than a bits and pieces cricketer.  Close to 90mph, heavy ball and capable of reverse swing he was the perfect third seamer, willing to do the hard yards whilst the pretty boys got the new cherry and pick of ends.  The fact that he was a perfectly functional seven/eight in Tests more than helped.

The last eighteen months of his test career were rather different because he just was not fit.  Woakes and Jordan are inferior copies of that version...

[jwebber86]

surely they should just pick alex hales in every format. problem solved

[golden duck]

surely they should just pick alex hales in every format. problem solved

222no vs Yorkshire, cane in at no 3.

Even with Yorkshire missing the test players it's a good knock.

Notts on 393/7 so hales has made a good chunk of them!

Personally I hope he has a really good season all round, for his own sake, ignoring how England like to mess players around

[procricket]

Bresnan was - pre-shoulder and elbow injuries - a lot better than a bits and pieces cricketer.  Close to 90mph, heavy ball and capable of reverse swing he was the perfect third seamer, willing to do the hard yards whilst the pretty boys got the new cherry and pick of ends.  The fact that he was a perfectly functional seven/eight in Tests more than helped.

The last eighteen months of his test career were rather different because he just was not fit.  Woakes and Jordan are inferior copies of that version...

I think Woakes is as good as Bresnan he is a superior Batsman than Bresnan for sure and i think given a bit of time his bowling will come good too.

Give the lad time i think Woakes will be a decent fit for England but you are right Bresnan had his uses and was decent.

[Seniorplayer]

As i see it the problem with Woakes  is his lack of pace at Test level As an up and down bowler he won't bother the best players.

[Manormanic]

222no vs Yorkshire, cane in at no 3.

Even with Yorkshire missing the test players it's a good knock.

Being fair to Hales, he was still facing a decent attack - though you wonder how different it might have been had Sidebottom, Plunkett and Rashid been available to give it variety.

[edge]

As i see it the problem with Woakes  is his lack of pace at Test level As an up and down bowler he won't bother the best players.

Woakes is neither slow, nor an up and down bowler! He's bowling quicker than both Broad and Anderson these days, has put a few yards on since becoming involved with England, and he has always moved the ball both ways.

Anderson and Broad both increasingly look like they're on the way to being shot out these days, I would have rested at least one of them for this series in the hope they can regain some fitness and sharpness, which would also have given the chance to include Plunkett for a little extra pace (although he isn't actually much quicker than Stokes) or give Wood a chance to prove himself.

[Manormanic]

Virgil was pretty sharp on Woakes' issue - its not lack of pace so much as the smoothness of his action, which means that the batsman knows exactly where the ball is coming from and therefore can pre-react more than he could with (the similarly paced) Wood.

[Buzz]

Virgil was pretty sharp on Woakes' issue - its not lack of pace so much as the smoothness of his action, which means that the batsman knows exactly where the ball is coming from and therefore can pre-react more than he could with (the similarly paced) Wood.

When Vaughan talks about this stuff - the same with Trott's technique - he sounds like someone who knows about cricket, especially batting, which he doesn't always show in his "click bait" writing/bbc commentary.

[edge]

Hadn't heard Vaughan's views on that, seems pretty fair actually - have noticed a similar issue with bowlers I've played with before. Definitely can't criticise Woakes purely for lack of pace these days though, he's pushing 90 pretty often.

[Seniorplayer]

Woakes is neither slow, nor an up and down bowler! He's bowling quicker than both Broad and Anderson these days, has put a few yards on since becoming involved with England, and he has always moved the ball both ways.

Anderson and Broad both increasingly look like they're on the way to being shot out these days, I would have rested at least one of them for this series in the hope they can regain some fitness and sharpness, which would also have given the chance to include Plunkett for a little extra pace (although he isn't actually much quicker than Stokes) or give Wood a chance to prove himself.

Having watched Warks often
not  convinced Woakes has what it takes  with the bat or the ball to make it at test level.

[Manormanic]

Having watched Warks often
not  convinced Woakes has what it takes  with the bat or the ball to make it at test level.

He's similar to Jason Holder and Mitch Marsh - in that he's a decent fourth seamer who is not quite up to the job of third seamer, but almost good enough to be classed as the all rounder at seven.

[FattusCattus]

So what's the XI going to be?

Cook
Trott
Ballance
Bell
Root
Ali
Stokes
Buttler
Jordan
Broad
Anderson


If it were my watch and bearing in mind reports of a pitch that will be relatively dead but dry enough to break up, it would be:

Cook
Lyth
Ballance
Bell
Root
Ali
Stokes
Buttler
Rashid
Plunko
Anderson

[Gerry SA]

He's similar to Jason Holder and Mitch Marsh - in that he's a decent fourth seamer who is not quite up to the job of third seamer, but almost good enough to be classed as the all rounder at seven.

Clearly not. Holder, after he bulks up will be up at 140kph. Factor in he's 6ft7, he'll be a handful on any pitch.