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[FattusCattus]

Having just watch Shakib bowling some lovely finger spin, it got me to thinking about our spin 'weapon'.

I've backed him in the past, and I really want to like him, and believe he is the future of English spin - but today was the first time I got to have a really good look at a spell he's bowled. I was really surprised by how loose he was, there seemed to be at least 2 gimme balls per over and he dragged loads down. He also seemed to pitch a lot quite wide of the stumps as opposed to turning stuff away on a middle and off line.

He doesn't seem to create much pressure and quite a few wickets seem to come from long hops slapped to cow. I think my point is that he doesn't seem to have advanced as a bowler, having played quite a bit of international cricket, and seems quite unrefined - perhaps there is simply no-one in the England set up to work with him.

I'm more than happy to be proved wrong or to be argued against, as it's simply my observation - it's just that he doesn't fill me with a huge amount of confidence going on to India.

(Oh, and by the way, I am fully aware that our Yorkshire members will inform me that every long-hop he bowls is Andrew Strauss's fault and that all wides are an ECB conspiracy)

[Buzz]

I have never said anything like this.

Oh wait.

And definitely Strauss' fault.

[WalkingWicket37]

Maybe he's still tired a needed a longer break...

[ppccopener]

I feel qualified now to comment on a bowling thread, having to my great joy(and surprise) been given at bowling marker at CBF nets. Long half volleys please to get going? Yes I can do that 

Rashid is about as good as it gets for us, he gets more wickets and poses more of a threat than Mo.

He's a question to ponder FC....take Shane Warne out of the equation. Name one, just one, other leg spinner in the last 20 years who has real control of the ball and can land it where he wants consistently.In county or international cricket.
Murali would come to mind...but although I don't know if he would be classed as a wrist spinner or finger spinner...

I had to demonstrate leg spin as part of my level one coaching course years ago in front of the rest of the group.

About the hardest thing cricket wise I've had to do.

[Woodyspin]

Murali would come to mind...but although I don't know if he would be classed as a wrist spinner or finger spinner...

Definitely a finger spinner, but could turn his shoulder in such a way to bowl the doosra. freak comes to mind.

[FattusCattus]

Murali would be best described as an elbow spinner.

I suppose Qadir was a bit before this time, however I recall Mushy and MacGill both having significant control and developing over time as bowlers. I like the look of Yasir Shah and Amit Mishra was a decent bowler too.

I haven't written him off, but I;d love to see a bit more control and a bit more 'canny' with his length and line - particularly as he has a good google.

[felix]

Kumble's 619 test wickets suggest he wasn't too shabby  . I don't remember him being a huge spinner of the ball but had very good control for a leggie, and didn't get all his wickets on the subcontinent. If Adil was a fraction as good as him we'd be very happy, tho I fear he's the best of a bad bunch we've got to choose from.

[Felix Tito]

Anil Kumble was probably the most accurate spinner I've seen, but he was totally different to Murali and Warne. Kumble a lot taller, bowled quicker and flatter.

Don't think you can really compare slow left arm to leg spin either. Watching the likes of Al Hasan and Jadeja they drive the ball into pitch. Their variations are with angles, speed and to a lesser extent spin.

Rashid has to get the ball up and down to entice the batsmen, but he seems to lack the skills to be a decent spinner. Seldom do you see Rashid get top batsmen out by setting them up, it's normally long hops and full bungers.

[ppccopener]

Kumble was indeed an excellent spinner but yes very different to Warne and other leggies.

Can't be sure but think his stock delivery was a Googly, which is the opposite way Rashid(and Warne) bowl.

Mushtaq yes good shout FC

[Woodyspin]

Watching the other English Leggies this year, Beer (not so close) and Briggs (played for England before), They are both very similar to Rashid in terms of dragging it down and trying to over spin it like warn did from outside leg. it's fair to say that wickets don't offer that to these type of leg spinners, they bowl from a higher release point than Warne used to, but warne changed his pace alot aswell. Being able to throw a few leggies myself, i can confirm it is a hard trait to perfect, and there is a fine line between that good ball and a rank ball, the line being far smaller than it is for the off spinner. I have noticed though that quite possibly Rashid's run up doesn't give him the consistency we are asking for, Warnes was a slow walk to the crease and a quick gather, rashid's is quick and maybe he get's a bit over excited and slows himself down on occasion coming to the crease which can put him off rhythm? Just a theory... as im no coach, but there isn't a coach in the england set up to tell him any different so all he can go by is his fellow batsman's words and his own personal feel

[Northern monkey]

I'll give my two penerth worth

I like rashid
He does bowl some shoite, but he poses problems and asks questions of batters
If your good enough, then the bad balls will be put away, and he'll be expensive
But the threats there, that he can turn it.

My missus thinks he's crap and can't understand why I like his bowling

[GoodLeave]

My missus thinks he's crap and can't understand why I like his bowling

Sounds like a keeper!

[Northern monkey]

Hmm
She's lethal with a sidearm!ha

[Bats_Entertainment]

Watching the other English Leggies this year, Beer (not so close) and Briggs (played for England before), They are both very similar to Rashid in terms of dragging it down and trying to over spin it like warn did from outside leg.

Briggs bowls slow left-arm orthodox.

[Woodyspin]

of course he does! same result though... short and Sh!t