Your 2018 Season
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leatherseat

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Re: Your 2018 Season
« Reply #540 on: July 19, 2018, 07:19:54 AM »

As a bowler at heart (currently unable to bowl, so playing purely as a batsman, nowadays), I always felt the game was in the batsman's favour. Thus seems to be increasingly the case with smaller boundaries etc. In the days of Viv Richards dominating one day matches, the opposition's gun bowler could only bowl a fifth of the overs, yet Viv could bat through the innings (once he was in), having a far bigger influence on the outcome of the match.

If the bowlers are restricted to X overs (4 overs for T20, 10 in 50 overs), there should be some form of restriction on batsmen, too.

(Further debate, dependent on having specialist scorers - Would be interesting if that were a certain number of balls faced by a batsman, rather than runs scored -add further pressure).

David
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smilley792

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Re: Your 2018 Season
« Reply #541 on: July 19, 2018, 07:34:51 AM »

As a bowler at heart (currently unable to bowl, so playing purely as a batsman, nowadays), I always felt the game was in the batsman's favour. Thus seems to be increasingly the case with smaller boundaries etc. In the days of Viv Richards dominating one day matches, the opposition's gun bowler could only bowl a fifth of the overs, yet Viv could bat through the innings (once he was in), having a far bigger influence on the outcome of the match.

If the bowlers are restricted to X overs (4 overs for T20, 10 in 50 overs), there should be some form of restriction on batsmen, too.

(Further debate, dependent on having specialist scorers - Would be interesting if that were a certain number of balls faced by a batsman, rather than runs scored -add further pressure).

David

Maybe we should play double wicket rules like I did when I was 11.

That way when I get a first ball duck, I know I’m still there for a fair few overs. Rather than  as currently. I get to do nothing for the next 91 overs and 5 balls.
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leatherseat

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Re: Your 2018 Season
« Reply #542 on: July 19, 2018, 08:19:01 AM »

Going in a different direction, then - In the interests of trying to balance bat vs ball, have no restriction on either batsmen or bowlers.
Remove the restriction on the number of overs each bowler can bowl.

This is likely to lead to one or two dominant bowlers doing what one or two dominant batsmen do - dictate the game. If its good for the goose, it should be good for the gander.

We (each club/ league) need to decide if we are happy with one or two strong players (whether batsmen or bowlers) dominating matches.
Perhaps at lower levels there should be restriction for both batsmen and bowlers, to give more people some real involvement. At higher levels, no restriction on either.

David






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WalkingWicket37

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Re: Your 2018 Season
« Reply #543 on: July 19, 2018, 08:59:03 AM »

Wouldn't limiting the number of runs you're allowed to score or balls you're allowed to face devalue the game/league somewhat? As a bowler I love dismissing a bloke who's well set, if he'd just walked off retired after a chanceless 50/100 and I dismissed the new man who'd replaced him it wouldn't feel the same!

As for allowing bowlers to bowl through, that would simply be a step backwards as the rule of each bowler being allowed to bowl no more than 1/5th of the overs was to prevent 2 players doing it all.

I guess what I'm trying to say is, if it ain't broke don't fix it!
Is using a minimum of 5 bowlers a good thing? Yes
If someone has the skill to carry their bat, should they be forced to retire? No
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smilley792

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Re: Your 2018 Season
« Reply #544 on: July 19, 2018, 09:12:30 AM »

Cricket is a wierd sport that is hard to balance.

Currently you have that chance that a gun batsman may carry his bat and win a game, surely hat should be championed as a great innings?
As to do that he’ll have to survive a few wonder balls, dig a few out that the pitch helped the bowler with, and survive those lbw shouts the umpire wants to give as his bus is due soon.

He could easily get a first baller or earl duck a few weeks in a row, and there’s no second chance on that.


Where as a bowler who can bowl 12 overs, well he’s got 72 legal balls to make soemthing happen.
Ball at rank long hop that’s hit into next county? Turn round and run back it.
Massive leg side wide that goes for four? Turn round and run back in.

He doesn’t need his chance upping to 148 balls at one end, his mate same at the other.
He’s got a decent chance already to impact the game and can easily get his five for every week. Mistakes and all.



I’d rather beat a team with a gun bat who we’ve got out, than one we’ve just settled on him retiring.


(Different ish story, I once played against a very good lms side. We’d never beaten them, but if got a few 80 not ours in previous games.
This game they had a plan and bullishly talked about to, they bowled (No Swearing Please) at me so I could retire at 50, they than bowled well to lint our other batsman, made no attempt to run out when it was available and even “Avoided” two catching chances so I couldn’t come back in.
Yet they still won by around 105 runs.
That to me is when retirement cricket doesn’t work)
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SLA

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Re: Your 2018 Season
« Reply #545 on: July 19, 2018, 09:57:01 AM »

Anyone else seeing the irony that SLA has a ton in t20s??

Now he either carries his side if it had retirements then, or his entire team had one bad day.

Actually the story behind that is that we were playing a bunch of dicks who refused to play retirements because they said three of their batsmen would just walk off right then and there if they couldn't score 50s. So I smashed a ton, and then none of their batsmen got past 20 anyway and they lost by over 100 runs.

Next time we played them they suggested batsmen retire at 25.

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Batoff

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Re: Your 2018 Season
« Reply #546 on: July 19, 2018, 10:00:50 AM »

Actually the story behind that is that we were playing a bunch of dicks who refused to play retirements because they said three of their batsmen would just walk off right then and there if they couldn't score 50s. So I smashed a ton, and then none of their batsmen got past 20 anyway and they lost by over 100 runs.

Next time we played them they suggested batsmen retire at 25.

Couldn't you have improvised and made it a retire on 50 game to keep everyone happy? ???
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SLA

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Re: Your 2018 Season
« Reply #547 on: July 19, 2018, 10:04:42 AM »

I'm actually a bowler so retirement is never likely to effect my batting, I'd actually count a season's average being in double figures as "statistical glory"...

As far as "playing for the joy of cricket and the thrill of working as a team to try and get the win" I'm always pleased for a teammate if they get a personal milestones, be it 5 wickets, a hattrick, 50 or a 100. If they do so in a winning efforts even better!

While this everyone gets a bat, retire on X amount of runs sounds great in theory, I can't help but think it's a result of today's everyone is entitled to something society. At the end of the day I prefer traditional cricket where the batsmen bat and the bowlers bowl, but that's just me


The joy of cricket is that its flexible enough that you can adjust the rules and the format to fit any desired outcome. My team and our oppositions vastly prefer playing in games with a retirement rule, we find it gets everyone involved and makes for a good exciting game, and that to us is more important than the opportunity for batsmen to chase personal milestones - we can do that on a Saturday if we're that way inclined.

Horses for courses etc. For what its worth, I don't think its anything to do with "entitlement of modern society". For one thing these rules have been around since the 80s, for another, if you want to get sociological, its more about how groups of people prioritise collectivism vs individualism. We are openly a "collectivist" team. We don't keep running records of individual stats throughout the season and we award a champagne moment rather than a player of the year award, and players are expected to happily "take one for the team" whenever necessary.

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SLA

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Re: Your 2018 Season
« Reply #548 on: July 19, 2018, 10:05:06 AM »

Couldn't you have improvised and made it a retire on 50 game to keep everyone happy? ???

They didn't want to. :shrugs:
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jjelricksmith

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Re: Your 2018 Season
« Reply #549 on: July 19, 2018, 10:09:19 AM »

Out of interest what are people setting in the T20 leagues at the moment? We seem to have started the season winning games with 120 and now 180 is a good game.
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SLA

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Re: Your 2018 Season
« Reply #550 on: July 19, 2018, 10:18:40 AM »

Out of interest what are people setting in the T20 leagues at the moment? We seem to have started the season winning games with 120 and now 180 is a good game.

I did our team stats a few weeks ago. Over the past 5 years we played just over 100 games, and our average score batting first is 140 and we defend this 67% of the time, our opposition's average score when we field first is 135 and we chase this 53% of the time.

I think the scores are slightly lower than you might expect because we play retire at 25, so normally 9/10 batsmen get to bat in most games - obviously you can lose a bit of momentum when your tail enders are in. Its the same for both sides though.

Its also harder to chase in recreational cricket normally because the light is starting to fade towards the end of the innings. There's an unspoken rule that if the defending team has any quick bowlers, they bowl in the first ten and not at the death (otherwise it becomes dangerous). Hence the reason that I am a spinner who specialises in bowling the death overs, lol.

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WalkingWicket37

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Re: Your 2018 Season
« Reply #551 on: July 19, 2018, 10:21:31 AM »

@SLA what tactics do you go for bowling spin at the death mate?

I always used to think full and flat was the way to go towards the end of the innings, but I've actually found recently that moon balls seem to bamboozle batsmen trying to hit everything out of the park
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SLA

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Re: Your 2018 Season
« Reply #552 on: July 19, 2018, 10:33:35 AM »

@SLA what tactics do you go for bowling spin at the death mate?

I always used to think full and flat was the way to go towards the end of the innings, but I've actually found recently that moon balls seem to bamboozle batsmen trying to hit everything out of the park

Well I normally start with a set sequence of 4 balls that I practice: stock ball with topspin, skiddy quicker ball at the pads from wide on the crease, wide ball outside off and turning away from close to the stumps, wrong'un spinning back, and then see where we are. Basically I try and guess what the batsman is thinking and then try desperately to scupper his plan. It also depends on the length of the boundaries. If I have a short legside boundaries I'll try to keep my line outside off, If I have a short straight boundary or short offside boundary I'll bowl at the pads.



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Neon Cricket

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Re: Your 2018 Season
« Reply #553 on: July 19, 2018, 12:06:35 PM »

Scorecard from Ansty 2s Saturday was interesting...

http://anstycc.play-cricket.com/website/results/3313229


Literally everything that is wrong with win/draw cricket in one scorecard, can anyone honestly say they enjoy blocking out for 160 chasing over 300?!
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SLA

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Re: Your 2018 Season
« Reply #554 on: July 19, 2018, 01:12:31 PM »

Literally everything that is wrong with win/draw cricket in one scorecard, can anyone honestly say they enjoy blocking out for 160 chasing over 300?!

Given that they were (presumably) never going to chase 300, then the game was over as a contest at tea. What do you think would have happened in a win/win game that would have been so much more enjoyable for either side?
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