Topic: England tour of West Indies (Read 147636 times)

WalkingWicket37 · « **Reply #885 on:** February 09, 2019, 11:03:01 PM »

I think all this talk of Buttler's "natural game" is a bit of confusion around his one day batting.

If you've watched him in first class cricket you'll know he does rein it in a fair bit. His career strike rate in red ball cricket is a touch over 60. While that's healthy I think it shows he comes in down the order and hits bad balls from tiring bowlers. He simply isn't a shot a ball player in the longer format like he is in white ball cricket

SD · « **Reply #886 on:** February 09, 2019, 11:07:48 PM »

Quote from: Tailendfielder on February 09, 2019, 11:00:19 PM

Im a warwickshire fan but i was dead set against the return of Ian Bell. He was always the luxury player and this current setup dont need another one. As said in a bbc sport tweet earlier, �remember when we used to moan about bells pointless hundreds�. At this point we�ve tried everyone, bring him back for 12, 18 months and whack him at 3 until someone steps up.

I can't remember a time when England have had such a paucity of options to bat in the top 3. Having given a lot of guys the opportunity - and with only Hammed looking remotely capable of doing what is needed of him - I would have Bell and Jason Roy in the side to face Ireland next summer. Both have shown that they can score big runs against international bowlers which is the most important thing right now

edge · « **Reply #887 on:** February 09, 2019, 11:32:46 PM »

The thing I really don't get about the recall Bell to bat 3 crowd is how they've forgotten that he was rubbish at 3 even in his prime, never mind now! I'll ruffle a feather or two... my top 7 for the first ashes test: Burns, Roy, Root, Hildreth, Buttler, Stokes, Foakes.

Tailendfielder · « **Reply #888 on:** February 09, 2019, 11:53:41 PM »

Quote from: edge on February 09, 2019, 11:32:46 PM

The thing I really don't get about the recall Bell to bat 3 crowd is how they've forgotten that he was rubbish at 3 even in his prime, never mind now! I'll ruffle a feather or two... my top 7 for the first ashes test: Burns, Roy, Root, Hildreth, Buttler, Stokes, Foakes.

Tend to agree but it might as well be bell as any other player whos batted 3. Why isnt Hales being conssidered but roy is?

edge · « **Reply #889 on:** February 10, 2019, 12:10:37 AM »

Quote from: Tailendfielder on February 09, 2019, 11:53:41 PM

Tend to agree but it might as well be bell as any other player whos batted 3. Why isnt Hales being conssidered but roy is?

Cos Roy hasn't retired from red ball cricket. Then again, Rashid did that too.

SD · « **Reply #890 on:** February 10, 2019, 01:04:41 AM »

Quote from: edge on February 09, 2019, 11:32:46 PM

The thing I really don't get about the recall Bell to bat 3 crowd is how they've forgotten that he was rubbish at 3 even in his prime, never mind now! I'll ruffle a feather or two... my top 7 for the first ashes test: Burns, Roy, Root, Hildreth, Buttler, Stokes, Foakes.

He averaged 38 at 3, a couple of points below his overall career record but certainly not rubbish and he didn't bar in that position when he was at his best. Right now we would love someone capable if averaging high 30s to occupy that berth

Jlscarroll17 · « **Reply #891 on:** February 10, 2019, 01:25:58 AM »

Rashid has signed a new contract to play red ball cricket as well as white ball, but hales has not committed himself to redball. I think Roy has the potential to develop into a red ball cricketer but he is not an opener. So still we have the problem of finding another opener

six and out · « **Reply #892 on:** February 10, 2019, 07:09:42 AM »

I really don't get this call for Roy as the next opener. I know we haven't got many options but he doesn't open for Surrey, plays hardly any red ball cricket and won't play a red ball match before the Ireland test if we do well at the World Cup.

Surely the openers slot has to go to the leading opener in the run scoring charts in the CC.

SD · « **Reply #893 on:** February 10, 2019, 08:42:50 AM »

The issue is that scoring runs in domestic cricket doesn't mean you can step up and do it at international level. The 90s were beset by this problem of simply picking whoever was in the best form in first class cricket then watching them fail to make the step up. England improved dramatically as a side under Duncan Fletcher when he based selection on players who he thought had what it would take to succeed in international cricket, not who was having success at first class level. Bayliss by his own admission doesn't have that knowledge of the domestic game to be able to operate in this way, and the new selection panel was long overdue.

Roy had plenty of things going against him when it comes to.batting in the top order in test match cricket, but he has a record of scoring runs at international level, something which we desperately need

ppccopener · « **Reply #894 on:** February 10, 2019, 09:26:48 AM »

It's a tough call to slot Roy in when he hardly plays 4 day cricket and his strength is putting bat to ball when clearly our weakness is being exposed on the current tour.

What about Malan,Stoneman,Robson and Vince?

Has their time passed now and we move onto the next generation?

Of the above 4, two openers and two who could bat number 3....and Denly who is the current number 3. Perhaps England see him as very short term it's hard to tell.

Of the current younger batsman, Joe Clarke looks good, but could bat as high as 3 in an Ashes series, and Liam Livingstone also.

In an ideal world Haseeb hameed starts the season strongly, but that is a big ask after a very bad 2017 and 2018.

If Jason Roy does get selected, he would be playing out of position, we would be back to the same problem.i think he could play test cricket but he is a middle order player and that part of the team is already overloaded.

My team has Stoneman returning with a younger opening bat, Burns is worth persevering with, and it has Root at 3, that way Bairstow,stokes,butler don't go too high in the order.

six and out · « **Reply #895 on:** February 10, 2019, 09:35:44 AM »

Quote from: SD on February 10, 2019, 08:42:50 AM

The issue is that scoring runs in domestic cricket doesn't mean you can step up and do it at international level. The 90s were beset by this problem of simply picking whoever was in the best form in first class cricket then watching them fail to make the step up. England improved dramatically as a side under Duncan Fletcher when he based selection on players who he thought had what it would take to succeed in international cricket, not who was having success at first class level. Bayliss by his own admission doesn't have that knowledge of the domestic game to be able to operate in this way, and the new selection panel was long overdue.

Roy had plenty of things going against him when it comes to.batting in the top order in test match cricket, but he has a record of scoring runs at international level, something which we desperately need

Agreed it can't only be about weight of runs in the CC but that has to be a starting point otherwise what's the point in having one.

Roy has scored runs at international level but they are against a non-moving white ball on roads prepared for fun loving cricket. Not a red ball that is going to move sideways on a grass covered track.

I will happily eat these words if he opens in the Ashes and scores a 100. But it isn't going to happen.

Seniorplayer · « **Reply #896 on:** February 10, 2019, 09:48:45 AM »

Quote from: Tailendfielder on February 09, 2019, 11:00:19 PM

Im a warwickshire fan but i was dead set against the return of Ian Bell. He was always the luxury player and this current setup dont need another one. As said in a bbc sport tweet earlier, �remember when we used to moan about bells pointless hundreds�. At this point we�ve tried everyone, bring him back for 12, 18 months and whack him at 3 until someone steps up.

Would it work though as he will have no Strauss cook trott Peterson batting in front of him

Seniorplayer · « **Reply #897 on:** February 10, 2019, 09:56:29 AM »

With England not having a reserve opener maybe they could have given Foakes a go at opening and said if we bat first you will be keeping wicket.

ppccopener · « **Reply #898 on:** February 10, 2019, 10:05:48 AM »

Quote from: Seniorplayer on February 10, 2019, 09:48:45 AM

Would it work though as he will have no Strauss cook trott Peterson batting in front of him

I'm a huge Bell fan for what he did and the way he scored his runs, but this is a good point-sometimes the players around you can make you look better. It's an easier task batting 5 if a lot of hard work has been done already.

Stokes , butler and Bairstow all need shine off the ball to flourish long term.

Mister Le Chiffre · « **Reply #899 on:** February 10, 2019, 10:51:09 AM »

Bell was always a nearly man. Lacked heart and was mentally weak. Bell was the master of scoring cheap runs after the opponents had been demoralised by the better batsmen up the order.

Author Topic: England tour of West Indies (Read 147636 times)

WalkingWicket37

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SD

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edge

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Tailendfielder

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edge

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SD

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Jlscarroll17

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six and out

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SD

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ppccopener

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six and out

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Seniorplayer

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Seniorplayer

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ppccopener

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Mister Le Chiffre

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