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[Howzat]

Whats the worst decision you have ever got from an umpire? Once you have written it -think was it a hard decsion to make?
Mine has to be being given out LBW half way down the track! I dont think the umpire found it a hard decision...he just knew if i was out we wouldnt win!

[art]

Hi folks. Some will know from elsewhere.

On this board we hope to start serious dicussions about umpires, Laws and rules and we will seek input from all who are interested. Umpiring is having problems at present and perhaps we might with deep thought try and solve some of the issues.

Oh and Leo, was this an official umpire or someone else?

[Howzat]

In our junior cricket we have the coaches umpiring...

[art]

Ah yes of course. A little later as we go through the series on umpires and umpiring I will discuss an initiative we have taken in the local competition about junior cricket, umpires and umpiring.
This initiative might not solve all the problems but it isolates the cheating parents and coaches who forget fairness. In a recent canvas of junior players I did it was found that perceived umpire 'bias' was a major reason for not continuing in cricket. So there are solutions to this. Then again perhaps some junior players, pushed by their parents, are not as good as they believe.

Hint 1. A hand made 750 pound bat does not a batsman make.

[gramw]

my worst was in a 2nds match and the some people who wernt playing for the oppostion where umpiring and an legspinner came on round the wicket pitched outside leg and went onto my pads, so if it pitches outside leg it couldnt of been, pitched a fair bit outside but you win some you lose some,

welcome to the forum art and i have a question for you, in an u15s match a bowler bowled and it came up higher than i thought and went off my arm (somewhere  between the wrist and elbow) and the keeper caught it, i was given out and asked why at the end because i assumed he thought i gloved it but he said you where out because it hit your baselayer which is not an item that you have to wear therefore its out, was he right?

[Richie]

Mine has to be when I went to pull a leg spinner who was coming around the wicket, it hit my outside leg, whilst also pitching outside leg, and only the bowler went up.

[art]

Good question. Now let's take a chance to look at the Law.

Provided that all the conditions of a fair catch are met we must in this case turn to Law  6, The Bat. So the glove including and wristband, providing the hand is holding the bat at the time it is struck is deemed part of the bat. So we come to the obscure part of what happens if you have a piece of clothing that is touching your glove and it is hit.

However let us put that conjecture aside and if you were wearing a baselayer that was not in contact with or part of your glove then if it is struct it is not part of your bat and you should not be out. hmmm.

Now the harsh umpire is coming out in me. For the umpire to be asked a question generally a batsman has made a mistake. Simple answer is that if you hit the middle of the bat and either keep the ball on the ground or clear the boundary with a lofted shot the methods of dismissal are greatly reduced.

[art]

Many years ago while at school I was on 99. Facing a legspinner with 'promise' or so I was told later I padded a ball away that clearly pitched outside and hit me outside the leg stump. The umpire, a teacher from my own school, gave me out LBW.

I resolved on that day that if ever I became an umpire everybody would receive equal treatment, test star of 6th grade number 11. No one has ever got or ever will get a special favour from me one way or the other.

[Arthur]

Wasn't involving me, but at a 1st XI match two weeks ago, there was apparently a whole host of truly shocking decisions; the worst of which being one where the batsman came down the track, got a huge inside edge, and our bowler only went up slightly, just a reaction. It wasn't even a half-appeal, yet the umpire's finger was up straight away! Another, was when one of our batsman again inside edged the ball onto his pad, noticeably, and went through for a single. When the batsman got to the other end, the umpire said; "It's a good job you got outside the line", implying that had he been in line, he would have given it. These were league umpires, by the way, not players or umpires provided by the teams.

[gramw]

 

Good question. Now let's take a chance to look at the Law.

Provided that all the conditions of a fair catch are met we must in this case turn to Law  6, The Bat. So the glove including and wristband, providing the hand is holding the bat at the time it is struck is deemed part of the bat. So we come to the obscure part of what happens if you have a piece of clothing that is touching your glove and it is hit.

However let us put that conjecture aside and if you were wearing a baselayer that was not in contact with or part of your glove then if it is struct it is not part of your bat and you should not be out. hmmm.

Now the harsh umpire is coming out in me. For the umpire to be asked a question generally a batsman has made a mistake. Simple answer is that if you hit the middle of the bat and either keep the ball on the ground or clear the boundary with a lofted shot the methods of dismissal are greatly reduced.

i am not sure i understand all that but does that mean if the clothing is touching the glove then i would be out? bedause mine wasnt actualy touching the glove it was halfway between wrist and elbow( well near enough)

[art]

gramw have a look at the Law and see what you think. Also check Tom Smith's and see what you conclusion is. In the blur of playing a shot isn't it also wise to make sure there is a separation between glove and arm guard, for example? If everything is touching and looks connected it is a bit rough to argue after the incident that the items were in fact separate pieces of clothing.

Oh and to Arthur it is nice to withdraw an appeal if one is given in error and it obviously was not out. We all make mistakes and the more pressure placed on umpires for minor things there is a much greater liklihood that errors in decisions will be made at an increasing rate one way or the other.

Another old axiom, the decisions become apparently much worse in general relationship to the larger the margin of defeat in the eyes of the defeated team.

[Arthur]

The two umpires got the decisions wrong on several occasions, for both teams, one bowler ended with 7 wickets, only 3 of which were definitely out, the other 4 were all marginal LBW's. There were 7 leg before dismissals in the game, something extremely rare, and I can't see every single one of those going on to indeed hit the stumps.

Regarding the half appeal, we didn't think to retract the appeal due to it being a league umpire, and therefore having to respect their decision, no matter how wrong. Also the speed at which he gave the decision, as soon as the bowler made a sound that the ump thought was an appeal, out came the finger, no thought, no hesitation whatsoever.

I understand where you are coming from, but as the umpires were commissioned by the league, you'd have thought they'd be of a higher standard, as frankly they were shocking throughout the game.

[art]

Well I should support my brothers I guess. As for LBW's they are generally so easy if you follow the standard steps in appraising the incident but I defy anyone to pick an small inside edge once the bowling gets above 145 k's an hour.

I gave 2 LBWs in a game a couple of weeks ago, well actually one walked so I only gave one lol.

[Chris1976]

I got given out LBW earlier this season when the ball jagged back and hit me in the box... I'm 5'9" tall so not massive but not short either but was standing up tall trying to hit the ball off the back-foot.

When I asked the umpire about it after the game... he said "I thought the ball might just be clipping the top of leg stump" .....whatever happend to benefit of the doubt?? LOL

Must admit I dont argue decisions but I did query that one as I thought it a little odd.

[Redback Cricket]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yB3dJElsv_E