Custom Bats Cricket Forum
General Cricket => Latest Matches => Ashes 2013/2014 => Topic started by: alexhilly1492 on November 26, 2013, 01:05:36 PM
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with trott coming home, hope he gets better soon, big loss for england, looks like root will be at 3, whos gonna be at 6???
id say stokes bring an all rounder into the side!!
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Root at 3? Says who?
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thats just roomers i saw on bbc and cricinfo, personally id prefer bell at three, root at 5, prior at 6 and stokes at 7
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http://www.espncricinfo.com/the-ashes-2013-14/content/story/693465.html?CMP=chrome (http://www.espncricinfo.com/the-ashes-2013-14/content/story/693465.html?CMP=chrome)
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I like Bell at 5, so I would prefer Root to move up, or bring Ballance in at 3.
Suppose they could look at KP at three and move everyone up one. Bairstow at 6 or Stokes at 7. Who would be the best player of the short ball?
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Why wouldn't England put bell at 3. He practically won the ashes single handedly.
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Because he won the Ashes batting at 5. He averages 40+ at 5 and about 30 at 3 (or something like that).
Bell has looked a far better player at 5. You also don't want too many rookies batting with the tail. You need some solidity down the bottom of the order too.
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Last time Bell had to step to 3 in Trott's absence he scored a double ton - he's said in the past 3 is his preferred position.
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James Taylor had been knocking on the door for a while... Havent been following English County cricket that much, but what are his chances...
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James Taylor had been knocking on the door for a while... Havent been following English County cricket that much, but what are his chances...
Although the selectors sporadically give him chances. They don't think his technique (and his small stature) will work at the top level.
Shame really cos he's quality.
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I think they'll go with Root at 3 and then bring in Bairstow (possibly Stokes if they feel they need the bit of bowling) personally.
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Root at 3, they like the way he played Johnson 2nd inns.
bell will stay at 5, they don't want to move him from his best position.
KP has never played at 3 in 100 tests, so he's not going to start now!
ballance doesn't seem ready, so probably bairstow at 6. They wont bring a player from outside the squad to start, that would be tantamount to admitting your selections are wrong. Send poor message to players and media would rip them apart...
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How's Bresnan fitness wise??
Root 3
Prior 6
Stokes /bresnan 7
Panesar for tremlett
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How's Bresnan fitness wise??
Hasn't really been any coverage on him, but I'm quite sure I saw him in training kit in the pavillion during the last match on sky.
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isnt he playing for the EPP vs Queensland 2's?
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isnt he playing for the EPP vs Queensland 2's?
Haven't seen that but could well be true! Has the match started already I assume? Do you know if there's a live scorecard anywhere or not?
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Haven't seen that but could well be true! Has the match started already I assume? Do you know if there's a live scorecard anywhere or not?
It was mentioned on sky that he would play for EPP as well
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Bowled out twice for less than 200... Yeah, let's pick an extra bowler then
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Although the selectors sporadically give him chances. They don't think his technique (and his small stature) will work at the top level.
Shame really cos he's quality.
I quite like the idea of taylor, any short stuff will be miles over his head.
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As an Aussie, I would least prefer Bell at 3, I imagine the Aussie team may think similarly, therefore that's what England should do. Adelaide will be batting friendly and a cook/bell partnership batting us out of the game is not inconceivable. Then KP coming in against a soft ball and tired bowlers, well there's 450+ on the board right there.
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Excellent article:
http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/england-coach-andy-flower-out-of-line-when-he-questioned-australias-leadership-and-standards/story-e6freuy9-1226768985021#ixzz2lmXKikpm (http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/england-coach-andy-flower-out-of-line-when-he-questioned-australias-leadership-and-standards/story-e6freuy9-1226768985021#ixzz2lmXKikpm)
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An excellent article indeed, thanks for sharing. At least one journalist has some perspective and a clue. I don't mind what goes on really, can't stand hypocrisy, is that flowers middle name by the way?
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I think all this talk about Clarke, Anderson, sledging and ex players opinions is just the product of the media, a real storm in a teacup.
The stuff between Clarke and Anderson, that was most certainly not the first threat made by either side in the series. Nor the worst. Nor is it the first time the English and the Aussies have come to words. I have faced much more sinster threats and I play a (No Swearing Please) standard. The only thing that surprises me is that Clarke didn't say he'd take his head off. This stuff has been going on forever, it has just never been picked up upon before technology.
Regarding Trott and Warner, whilst ignorance is not innocence, if Broad has come out and said that Trotts mates didn't know the extent, how was he to know? When all he said was, lets be honest, a fact. We have all said things at somepoint that have come out to appear more sinister than they are. You apologise, feel like a tit and move on.
Vaughan is now paid to sell papers/advertising space. All past players do it, Hussain, Botham, Warne all male derogatory statememts about former teammates. That is life. It is no different than any other sport, the way Micheal Owen commentates on BT sport you'd think he was Pele.
Storm in a tea cup. Cricket should now be the last thing on JT's mind
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Storm in a tea cup alright. So Clarke said a few things to Anderson when he was desperate to get in and enjoy winning a test match - a feeling which, lets face it, he has not been able to enjoy for quite some time now - its hard to see why this gets anyone at all worked up.
The Aussies and their crowd get stuck in to Stuart Broad. He bowls well as a result (note to Flower - that's the way to do it! we had always wondered y'know...)
Warner says something about Trott. He was not to know about the background issues and even if he was, any sin is of being an ignorant bogun - which he would be mouth open or shut, lets face it - this is hardly a diplomatic incident (though Warner is more or less alone in being able to dish it out, but never to take it back).
All of this is, well, kind of meh. It reminds me of a comment made to me in a game earlier this year when I was playing with a cast on my hand. Said comment amounted to a query as to whether my medical insurance covered amputation - and the bowler was the first to buy me a pint afterward.
Lets all grow up, eh?
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Storm in a tea cup alright. So Clarke said a few things to Anderson when he was desperate to get in and enjoy winning a test match - a feeling which, lets face it, he has not been able to enjoy for quite some time now - its hard to see why this gets anyone at all worked up.
The Aussies and their crowd get stuck in to Stuart Broad. He bowls well as a result (note to Flower - that's the way to do it! we had always wondered y'know...)
Warner says something about Trott. He was not to know about the background issues and even if he was, any sin is of being an ignorant bogun - which he would be mouth open or shut, lets face it - this is hardly a diplomatic incident (though Warner is more or less alone in being able to dish it out, but never to take it back).
Lets all grow up, eh?
Pretty much spot on. It's the media (surprise surprise) that appear to be stoking the flames and whipping up a frenzy. Most cricketers know what goes on and couldn't give two hoots, aside from Trott having to leave which isn't a very nice thing at all.
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Pretty much spot on. It's the media (surprise surprise) that appear to be stoking the flames and whipping up a frenzy. Most cricketers know what goes on and couldn't give two hoots, aside from Trott having to leave which isn't a very nice thing at all.
We've got a cricket chat room at work (about 200'people in it on an average day and more if a test is on), and most people agreed that actually far from being fine and dandy sledging has no place on the cricket field anymore. Kids and players see these incidents and copy thm on a Saturday/Sunday with coaches who,also allow and teach them these things. Funny/witty banter is universally accepted as beneficial to the game but when someone finds it offensive then it shouldn't happen. Of course a couple of people chipped in with 'it's a man's game ' 'it's happened since time begun ' but were quickly rebuffed by the majority with 'if we left things 'as they'd always been we'd live in caves still, time and society moves on'.
Just thought it was interesting to see so many come out and finally say they'd had enough of sledging on the tv and on Saturday afternoons
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have they really? My Dad argued yesterday that it was a modern invention and got very defensive when I recounted his mate Freddie Trueman's classics....
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have they really? My Dad argued yesterday that it was a modern invention and got very defensive when I recounted his mate Freddie Trueman's classics....
There was an opinion that said pros should be able to do it more than amateurs due to then having sanctions (enforceable ones) and umpires etc who can actually do apmething about it. Low level is the concern coming out of that particular forum as there is no protection from it and no way to 'prove' it either, meaning nothing can be done.
I just though it was interesting to finally hear people separate the pro game from the game we all play. Most people treat out sarurdays ALS if they are a test
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I don't have a problem competing hard on a Saturday - there would be very little point in playing league cricket if you are going to do it as though its a jolly hockey sticks jape.
There are of course limits, but in twenty three years of playing league cricket I've only seen one or two really offensive bouts of verbals.
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I think they want Bresnan in if hes fit. To add extra in both departments. I dont think we should move Bell or KP. id put Root 3, bresnan 6. Maybe swap prior for Bairstow...and swap Tremlett for Finn. Id like to see Ballance in for trott but dont think theyll do thst
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Storm in a tea cup alright. So Clarke said a few things to Anderson when he was desperate to get in and enjoy winning a test match - a feeling which, lets face it, he has not been able to enjoy for quite some time now - its hard to see why this gets anyone at all worked up.
The Aussies and their crowd get stuck in to Stuart Broad. He bowls well as a result (note to Flower - that's the way to do it! we had always wondered y'know...)
Warner says something about Trott. He was not to know about the background issues and even if he was, any sin is of being an ignorant bogun - which he would be mouth open or shut, lets face it - this is hardly a diplomatic incident (though Warner is more or less alone in being able to dish it out, but never to take it back).
All of this is, well, kind of meh. It reminds me of a comment made to me in a game earlier this year when I was playing with a cast on my hand. Said comment amounted to a query as to whether my medical insurance covered amputation - and the bowler was the first to buy me a pint afterward.
Lets all grow up, eh?
Firstly, it is BogAn not Bogun.
Warner is indeed a Bogan and should not have said what he said in they presser...publically bagging a fellow cricketer in the media is crass and uncalled for.
However, insinuating that Warner can give it out, but cannot take it is utter (No Swearing Please)....show me even a skerrick of evidence where Warner has run crying to umpires and the authorities like this England combo, who up until yesterday were pooping on their Australian opponents at every opportunity and now that the boot is on the other foot, are crying like stuck pigs to the authorities.
I mean, Mr Motor Mouth Anderson complaining about sledging, FFS!?! Pot. Kettle. Black.
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We've got a cricket chat room at work (about 200'people in it on an average day and more if a test is on), and most people agreed that actually far from being fine and dandy sledging has no place on the cricket field anymore. Kids and players see these incidents and copy thm on a Saturday/Sunday with coaches who,also allow and teach them these things. Funny/witty banter is universally accepted as beneficial to the game but when someone finds it offensive then it shouldn't happen. Of course a couple of people chipped in with 'it's a man's game ' 'it's happened since time begun ' but were quickly rebuffed by the majority with 'if we left things 'as they'd always been we'd live in caves still, time and society moves on'.
Just thought it was interesting to see so many come out and finally say they'd had enough of sledging on the tv and on Saturday afternoons
Do they want a hug and a fresh pot of tea. I'll say it again, sledging has never killed anyone a ball travelling at 120+ kmh has. Do we then stop bouncers......and yes someone has died when the ball hit them in the chest where there is no protection just in case you were going down the helmet argument.
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However, insinuating that Warner can give it out, but cannot take it is utter (No Swearing Please)....
The WAlkabout Incident?
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I quite like the idea of taylor, any short stuff will be miles over his head.
There was some logic that said short players were better against fast bowling for this reason. Based on the success Allan lamb had against the great windies sides. Tall players tend to stand tall and eventually get pinned, ie. Hick . That said I don't rate Taylor at all.
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Do they want a hug and a fresh pot of tea. I'll say it again, sledging has never killed anyone a ball travelling at 120+ kmh has. Do we then stop bouncers......and yes someone has died when the ball hit them in the chest where there is no protection just in case you were going down the helmet argument.
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Ah the 'it's happened for years so all is fine' or the 'man up, it's a mans game' point. Maybe we should follow football a bit more ??
Well it is an office this forum is based in so maybe they aren't all hardy manual workers, doesn't invalidate their opinion though as most of them love the game. I asked them what they thought about sledging and banter, was there a difference etc and that's (generally and rounded up) the majority opinion of a fairly large group. Dismiss it if you want but it just proves not everyone thinks like your nd you are no more correct than them. Not one person thought witty, intelligent banter shouldn't be allowed but personal digs and anything just brainless should be.
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Neither does it win you a test match, as Botham says, bowling batting and fielding does...... discussion about it does however provide a nice thick smoke screen to hide behind.
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Ah the 'it's happened for years so all is fine' or the 'man up, it's a mans game' point. Maybe we should follow football a bit more ??
Well it is an office this forum is based in so maybe they aren't all hardy manual workers, doesn't invalidate their opinion though as most of them love the game. I asked them what they thought about sledging and banter, was there a difference etc and that's (generally and rounded up) the majority opinion of a fairly large group. Dismiss it if you want but it just proves not everyone thinks like your nd you are no more correct than them. Not one person thought witty, intelligent banter shouldn't be allowed but personal digs and anything just brainless should be.
That I will agree. No personal attacks. I know u will bring up Clarke but as far as I am concerned he was backing up his man as any captain is expected.
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The WAlkabout Incident?
I don't understand your point?
Root mouthed off - Warner readjusted Root's attitude problem.
Root has behaved himself ever since, as he realises that everybody knows that he got his head caved in for being a smart (No Swearing Please).
Root is unlikely to mouth off to anybody ever again.
I think everyone is a winner in this instance.
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I don't understand your point?
Root mouthed off - Warner readjusted Root's attitude problem.
Root has behaved himself ever since, as he realises that everybody knows that he got his head caved in for being a smart (No Swearing Please).
Root is unlikely to mouth off to anybody ever again.
I think everyone is a winner in this instance.
What decsription of events have you read?!?
Root, drinking amongst the England players, put a multicoloured afro on his chin, in response to England lads giving his boyish looks stick for "not being able to grow a beard"
Warner (pissed off at England after recent events no doubt) went over and punched him, apparently he thought he was taking the piss out of Hashim Amla - Warners fellow countryman and spiritual brother oh wait, he has no connection to Amla outside of they play the same sport as a living.
You have requested evidence several times when an Australian player has been questioned. Please provide evidence of Roots attitude problem, and then evidence of this problem being gone now Warner punched him.
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What decsription of events have you read?!?
Root, drinking amongst the England players, put a multicoloured afro on his chin, in response to England lads giving his boyish looks stick for "not being able to grow a beard"
Warner (pissed off at England after recent events no doubt) went over and punched him, apparently he thought he was taking the piss out of Hashim Amla - Warners fellow countryman and spiritual brother oh wait, he has no connection to Amla outside of they play the same sport as a living.
You have requested evidence several times when an Australian player has been questioned. Please provide evidence of Roots attitude problem, and then evidence of this problem being gone now Warner punched him.
Unlike Flintoff's constant moronic (and many of the clowns on this site) "it is going to be 10-0...Australian will never win another test again" statements, I was merely taking the piss.
You can take that hook out of your mouth now, cause you took the bait.
I don't really care what led Warner to belt Root in the mouth - Warner is a bogan from housing commission. My care factor for him is next to zero. In fact, if you go over my posting history on this site, you will find that I have had a consistent ambivalence towards Dave Warner.
He may be able to belt a ball out of site, but he is a bloke of limited intellect and even less class.
But this whole holier than thou attitude of English cricket fans...especially attempting to paint that insidious slime ball Anderson as an innocent victim (when the normally placid Mike Hussey nominates you as the worst sledger in international cricket, it doesn't say much about your character), then I can only laugh at the hypocrisy and double standards practiced by myopic English cricket fans.
Get your collective heads out of your Kyber pass, you have a player in your squad who was punching on while out on the turps only a couple months ago and has not been sanctioned by ECCB AT ALL. If he was an Australian cricketer, it would have been an international incident made out of it.
The embarrassing silence of the Indian supporters on cricinfo after the above incident occurred was utterly shameful, I might add, considering they rip into anything and everything that Oz cricketers get up to.
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Root mouthed off - Warner readjusted Root's attitude problem.
Root has behaved himself ever since, as he realises that everybody knows that he got his head caved in for being a smart (No Swearing Please).
Root is unlikely to mouth off to anybody ever again.
I think everyone is a winner in this instance.
So a few questions - firstly were you there to hear Root mouth off? What did he say that warranted being punched in the face?
So if you mouthed off to me and I punched your lights out, would that make it a winning result all round? That is an attitude I hate! With a statement like that, you are showing yourself to be a total ...... :(
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as much as warner is a (no swearing please) he had no right to hit root, as he was joking round with team mates, from the reports from the media at least was the it was unprovoked, warner was punished, lets move on.
on the note of the england side bres hit 57* and took 4 for for the epp, good enough to prove hsi fitness??
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You can take that hook out of your mouth now, cause you took the bait.
Ahhh very well done.
Have this golden star *
You can maybe add this to your signature as a sign of your acheivement. Whilst worth many internet points and will instantly win you praise from many other members, unfortuantely it cannot be traded in for cash value or discount from forum sponsors. It is recommened you still look after this star as without it, how will you manage to stand above us all knowing and such?
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Ahhh very well done.
Have this golden star *
Ha ha, brilliant!
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Warner is a div who uses his brashness where talent should be. He is a fill in until Australia find a true world-class opener again.
Clarke was threatening and I think that is too far. Yes, sledge about talent, but to directly threaten is over the line. What next? I'll see you in the car park later. Bring a bat as I'll have a stump!
Anderson is a talker and if he was threatening too, then he should be equally reprimanded. Clarke was unfortunate that he was heard on the stump mic.
They all really need to move on now.
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I would like to hear all of what goes on. Do the commentators hear more caught up by the umpires mics?
The one thing I thought about Clarke's sledge, was "i'm going to knock your block off" is threatening but doesn't have much substanance. Andersons head won't literally be removed. "Prepare for a broken arm" This is quite real and potentially career ending as an injury. Of course this then has Jimmy conscious about not getting hit, unless he has unlimited mental strength, which could have more of an effect than the threat.
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Wouldn't have thought the standard commentators will hear any more than we do from the stumps mic but I could be wrong.
Personally I feel a few people here have taken recent events and posts a bit too personally :-[.
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Wouldn't have thought the standard commentators will hear any more than we do from the stumps mic but I could be wrong.
Personally I feel a few people here have taken recent events and posts a bit too personally :-[.
I know they are tuned in to the umpire mics. When Trott was given lbw and there wasn't hotspot, the commentators were talking about the conversation between pitch and 3rd umpire.
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I know they are tuned in to the umpire mics. When Trott was given lbw and there wasn't hotspot, the commentators were talking about the conversation between pitch and 3rd umpire.
Good point, I do remember them talking about what the umpires are saying during reviews! Suprises me a lot though, allowing access to something like that is only leading to controversy.
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I'm sure the ICC could put better mic's in the stumps to pick up,everything .
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So a few questions - firstly were you there to hear Root mouth off? What did he say that warranted being punched in the face?
So if you mouthed off to me and I punched your lights out, would that make it a winning result all round? That is an attitude I hate! With a statement like that, you are showing yourself to be a total ...... :(
Hosk, you are a lovely bloke, but, in future before you make a complete ass of yourself as you did in this post, read the posts above yours before you hit "send", because you would have seen that I posted this:
Unlike Flintoff's constant moronic (and many of the clowns on this site) "it is going to be 10-0...Australian will never win another test again" statements, I was merely taking the piss.
You can take that hook out of your mouth now, cause you took the bait.
I don't really care what led Warner to belt Root in the mouth - Warner is a bogan from housing commission. My care factor for him is next to zero. In fact, if you go over my posting history on this site, you will find that I have had a consistent ambivalence towards Dave Warner.
He may be able to belt a ball out of site, but he is a bloke of limited intellect and even less class.
I was taking the piss man....even MD2812 (the target of that post) got the joke in the end.
I am a pacifist by proclivity and I do not advocate anyone belting anyone in the mouth etc! :)
Chill mate.
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Ahhh very well done.
Have this golden star *
You can maybe add this to your signature as a sign of your acheivement. Whilst worth many internet points and will instantly win you praise from many other members, unfortuantely it cannot be traded in for cash value or discount from forum sponsors. It is recommened you still look after this star as without it, how will you manage to stand above us all knowing and such?
This post made me smile.
Love it!
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What exactly is Bresnan going to add in terms of fear factor?
He bowls 77-81mph. Cannon fodder no more.
And his batting, has he become Bradman in the last 6 months?
If Johnson's whizzing it past his head, Bresnan won't be scoring too many.
Pick Ballance at 6. He's a good young cricketer. He's African so that's another tick in the right box...😜
Pick Finn to replace Tremlett to add some fire to the otherwise very medium paced attack.
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What exactly is Bresnan going to add in terms of fear factor?
He bowls 77-81mph. Cannon fodder no more.
And his batting, has he become Bradman in the last 6 months?
If Johnson's whizzing it past his head, Bresnan won't be scoring too many.
Pick Ballance at 6. He's a good young cricketer. He's African so that's another tick in the right box...😜
Pick Finn to replace Tremlett to add some fire to the otherwise very medium paced attack.
Agreed
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What exactly is Bresnan going to add in terms of fear factor?
He bowls 77-81mph. Cannon fodder no more.
And his batting, has he become Bradman in the last 6 months?
If Johnson's whizzing it past his head, Bresnan won't be scoring too many.
Pick Ballance at 6. He's a good young cricketer. He's African so that's another tick in the right box...😜
Pick Finn to replace Tremlett to add some fire to the otherwise very medium paced attack.
So bat who at 3 though... It's not number 6 that's the problem at the moment
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So bat who at 3 though... It's not number 6 that's the problem at the moment
Well rationale suggests that Ian Bell should bat at 3. But he seems happy to hide down at 5. Bell's been pretty useless at 3 in the past, but he got two hundreds against a pathetic Indian attack back in 2010.
So it looks like Root will have to go in at 3.
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What exactly is Bresnan going to add in terms of fear factor?
He bowls 77-81mph. Cannon fodder no more.
And his batting, has he become Bradman in the last 6 months?
If Johnson's whizzing it past his head, Bresnan won't be scoring too many.
Pick Ballance at 6. He's a good young cricketer. He's African so that's another tick in the right box...😜
Pick Finn to replace Tremlett to add some fire to the otherwise very medium paced attack.
He gets the ball to reverse, which may be more of a factor as we move to more abrasive outfields. He has caused the Aussies quite a few issues in the past. He isn't currently struggling for form like Tremlett, messing about with his action to the point where has been nigh on irrelevant for 6 months like Finn or inexperienced like Rankin/Stokes.
He's a risk due to his recent injury.
Add to that he is a 'proper' cricketer who will grit things out with both bat and ball.
I love Bres, and whilst not in the same class as Flintoff, or going back further, Botham. For me he is Englands only current proper all rounder. Broad is an exceptional bowler who occasionally looks good with the bat. Bres has all the shots and the patience/nous/skill to scratch out a real innings whereas Broad always looks like a run a ball or out kind of guy.
Not sure how Broad who was clocked at 93mph when i was at the ground the day the Ashes were won can be considered medium pace, but i do accept the rest of your point. :)
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He gets the ball to reverse, which may be more of a factor as we move to more abrasive outfields. He has caused the Aussies quite a few issues in the past. He isn't currently struggling for form like Tremlett, messing about with his action to the point where has been nigh on irrelevant for 6 months like Finn or inexperienced like Rankin/Stokes.
He's a risk due to his recent injury.
Add to that he is a 'proper' cricketer who will grit things out with both bat and ball.
I love Bres, and whilst not in the same class as Flintoff, or going back further, Botham. For me he is Englands only current proper all rounder. Broad is an exceptional bowler who occasionally looks good with the bat. Bres has all the shots and the patience/nous/skill to scratch out a real innings whereas Broad always looks like a run a ball or out kind of guy.
Not sure how Broad who was clocked at 93mph when i was at the ground the day the Ashes were won can be considered medium pace, but i do accept the rest of your point. :)
It's not what pace you can bowl, it's about what pace you generally bowl at and broads pace is usually the quicker end of medium most of the time
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So bat who at 3 though... It's not number 6 that's the problem at the moment
Well Finn averages over 50 batting at 3, get him in at 3 and he can bowl a few overs as the 5th bowler, problem solved ;)
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The "innocent" party speaks out:
http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/cricket/james-anderson-will-continue-to-sledge-because-he-believes-it-improves-his-game/story-fni2usfi-1226772532882 (http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/cricket/james-anderson-will-continue-to-sledge-because-he-believes-it-improves-his-game/story-fni2usfi-1226772532882)
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The "innocent" party speaks out:
[url]http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/cricket/james-anderson-will-continue-to-sledge-because-he-believes-it-improves-his-game/story-fni2usfi-1226772532882[/url] ([url]http://www.heraldsun.com.au/sport/cricket/james-anderson-will-continue-to-sledge-because-he-believes-it-improves-his-game/story-fni2usfi-1226772532882[/url])
I liked Anderson for coming out and saying this. I haven't seen the incident, did Anderson complain when it was said?
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I liked Anderson for coming out and saying this. I haven't seen the incident, did Anderson complain when it was said?
No one complained except the media as far as I saw.
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Anyone feeling confident about predicting the Eng lineup for this test? I fancy the following:
Cook
carberry
root
kp
bell
Prior
Bresnan
Broad
Swann
Anderson
monty
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Anyone feeling confident about predicting the Eng lineup for this test?
Cook
Carbs
Root
KP
Bell
Ron Weasley
Prior
Bresnan
The Tall Medium Pace Bowler from England
Swanny
Armgate
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Although the selectors may think that Gary gives better Ballance to the side than Ron.
Not sure if it will be Bairstow or Ballance, the rest I think will be who I posted above.
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I reckon England will be boring and go with...
Cook
Carbs
Bell
KP
Root
Bairstow
Prior
Bresi-lad
Broad
Swann
Anderson
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Seems like the pitch is very dry so twin spin to come? Stokes at 6 would seem a real gamble though
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Twin spin leaves you when the horrible dilemma of five bowlers or six batsmen. On the batter's current form, and flower's past record, we will play four bowlers and Monty won't be one of them...
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Matt Prior has not scored a fifty since he signed with Spartan. Aussie conspiracy?
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Twin spin leaves you when the horrible dilemma of five bowlers or six batsmen. On the batter's current form, and flower's past record, we will play four bowlers and Monty won't be one of them...
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When the batsmen are struggling Monty is one of the last people you'd bring into a side (no disrespect to the bloke)
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Matt Prior has not scored a fifty since he signed with Spartan. Aussie conspiracy?
He did make an unbeaten hundred though... :-[
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Matt Prior has not scored a fifty since he signed with Spartan. Aussie conspiracy?
Let's be fair though none of the team looks like scoring runs at the moment ;) :D
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Sky reporting that Panesar and Stokes will play.
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Wow!! That was my guess!!
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stokes making debut...
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When the batsmen are struggling Monty is one of the last people you'd bring into a side (no disrespect to the bloke)
Personally I rate Month quite highly, quite often out bowls Swann, makes the tail a bit longer as on current form our tail starts at 7. But as we have seen many times it only takes a little bit of luck and then there back in form so hopefully Prior and a couple of others get there luck. We need to bat first and score big and by big I mean 500+ not this 275-350 score we seem to post first of late.
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If Stokes does play it will be interesting to see if he can live upto the 90 mph hype ppl keep talking abt..
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And we're bowling first, (No Swearing Please)!!
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England will already be on the backfoot losing the toss! Cook must be already repenting picking Monty.
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There we have it then! Batting weakened loads and bowling not really stregthened!!
AND lost the toss.........that's 2-0 by Sunday ???
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Lost this game already. Batting weaker!! Bowling is the same... Only on a flatter wicket :(
2-0 Australia
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I'll be honest with Rogers and Watson struggling for form, this game will be closer than people think. And I'm Australian.....
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Great optimism lads.
All that money spent on the redevelopment and they can't afford a hover cover?
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Lost this game already. Batting weaker!! Bowling is the same... Only on a flatter wicket :(
2-0 Australia
There we have it then! Batting weakened loads and bowling not really stregthened!!
AND lost the toss.........that's 2-0 by Sunday ???
Jesus Christ, I can hear Churchill turning in his grave.
What negative attitudes :o
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Interesting fact... Swann averages 48 with the ball in Australia... That's approx 20 more than his career average
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Australian pitches clearly aren't ripsnorting growlers then...
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this is like an Indian pitch, where statistically it is better to bowl first, knock the oppo over for under 300, bash 500 and roll the oppo on a Bunsen on the last day and a half...
so nip them out and bat for 3 days then...
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So far Bailey treating the bowlers like club cricketers
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So far Bailey treating the bowlers like club cricketers
Can I retract this statement ;)
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Great catch by Swanny. Quick reactions and held on to it
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this is like an Indian pitch, where statistically it is better to bowl first, knock the oppo over for under 300, bash 500 and roll the oppo on a Bunsen on the last day and a half...
so nip them out and bat for 3 days then...
It's only early days with the drop in pitches so nobody really knows how it will play out for the whole match.
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Great catch by Swanny. Quick reactions and held on to it
Shame same can't be said for carbs. Would have been England's day had he taken that sitter
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I think we've done ok here. Both spinners look interesting already and I think will only get more help.
Knock them over for less than 350 and it's up to us then.
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He did make an unbeaten hundred though... :-[
oops - my bad, thought he was still with the blank SS at that pt.
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I'll be honest with Rogers and Watson struggling for form, this game will be closer than people think. And I'm Australian.....
Rogers - 72
Watson - 51
Back in form
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Shame same can't be said for carbs. Would have been England's day had he taken that sitter
I keep reading on here what a brilliant fielder he is, but he seems to be delivering a fairly mixed bag for England, wonder if it's just bad luck.
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Pietersen was not the best of fielders in his first ashes either and he turned out ok
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400 would be a great score on this pitch.
Not seeing the resemblance to Mumbai at all.
There's a little bit for spinners but after day 2, the pitch should be going up and down.
A lot rests on Pup's shoulders, he averages 100+ at the Adeliade Oval.
Haddin also has a fine record on this ground.
Broad's quickly becoming the leader of the English attack.
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I keep reading on here what a brilliant fielder he is, but he seems to be delivering a fairly mixed bag for England, wonder if it's just bad luck.
I think because he is so quick across the ground he is labelled a brilliant fielder. Reminded me of Vaughan in his pomp that drop.
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I think Anderson badly needs a break from Cricket. He looks so tired and uninterested for some reason.
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Wonderful display of batting by Clarke and Haddin this morning
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Pup's record at the Adelaide Oval is remarkable.
Today century takes him up to 6 centuries at Adelaide, equaling the legend Ponting.
Pup averages 110, more the Don(107 average).
Elite company for Pup.
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England's mishaps in the field have cost them dearly. Both Clarke and Haddin getting tons after being dropped early in their innings by Root and Carbery early, and Haddin having a let off with the no ball as well. Aussies looking very good here, England would do well to get out with a draw I think.
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There goes Cook! Wonderful bowling by Johnson so far this afternoon.
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Johnson was bowling some serious heat.
On the Perth pitch he may have shishkebabed a batsman.
As it was, he was a hand full here.
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Root wearing a masuri again, amazing how much better a player looks in a decent lid haha
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Johnson bowled as well as I've ever seen him, clocked around 95mph there. Could have had 2 as well if they reviewed the decision at the end.
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Oooh bugger!
If ever there was a time for a couple of England batters to stand up and be counted it's now. we need a couple of big scores tomorrow.
Surely the series deciding day tomorrow?
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Time for the boys they have put their faith in to step up to the plate. Dreadful drop from Carbs but its up to him whether we remember this match for that drop or the big match saving score, so far this series its all been England under intense pressure eventually through hard graft we may be able to exert some pressure on the aussies and see how they fair under pressure. Long way to go to save this match but as a team it is up to them whether they do it or not. Lets get behind them Come on England.
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Draw is as good as it gets for England, but it's vital that we keep them in the field for much longer than the first test, given the 3rd is right afterwards.
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Oh (No Swearing Please)...
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Oooh bugger!
If ever there was a time for a couple of England batters to stand up and be counted it's now. we need a couple of big scores tomorrow.
Surely the series deciding day tomorrow?
I'm thinking it's the Groundhog Day for this England side too
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sorry ot be pessimistic but 2-0 series gone, underperformed, not good enough
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Johnson was bowling some serious heat.
On the Perth pitch he may have shishkebabed a batsman.
As it was, he was a hand full here.
Was having lunch with a mate today who is a surgeon at royal perth. Apparently shishkebabing is expected! He says the hospital is sending an extra ambulance to the waca (at CA's request) because johnson and potentially harris with coulter-nile (who just got clocked at 150+ in last weeks shield match at the waca) will be looking at ending things inside 3 days. The whole things orchestrated, and ca obviously just dont want anyone to be seriously or permanently hurt, but the attack will be frightening. The england team shouldnt worry about buying out remfry, more masuri I think.
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I don't see why everyone is already saying we've lost the match ???. One wicket down on a flat track and going into day 3. I'd pretty confident we can get the draw to be honest!
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'I know it may be a long shout and looking ahead to the 3rd test at perth, steve finn can bowl 90 mph plus and well bowling well can cause trouble to anyone
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I don't see why everyone is already saying we've lost the match ???. One wicket down on a flat track and going into day 3. I'd pretty confident we can get the draw to be honest!
1) they have near on 600 runs
2) when's the last time this England side scored 400+?
3) one of our key batsmen has gone home
4) our keepe can't bat curently
5) our only other batsmen who regularly spends loooong periods at the crease is out
6) the wicket will get worse
7) Johnson/Harris are faster than anything we have in this match(and tbh, better all round currently!)
8) what two batsmen can you see scoring 100+ currently ?
9) we only have 3 more batsmen as our #6 is new and our #7 is woeful currently
Need we go on? Of course it's possible and I'd love Carberry,root,KP, bell and stokes to stand up and score 500+ but given the recent ashes series and the first test..... Just can't see it
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Bell and KP are due some runs.
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the only chance we have is if two of kp, bell and carbs make very big hundreds.
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the only chance we have is if two of kp, bell and carbs make very big hundreds.
Why not Root?
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Well I'll put my money on this game being a draw then ;). Feel free to come back and make me feel stupid when we get all out for <200 tonight :-[.
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Well I'll put my money on this game being a draw then ;). Feel free to come back and make me feel stupid when we get all out for <200 tonight :-[.
Theresno reason to think that englamd shouldnt perform here. Thisis the easiest batting pitch in the country and kp, bell with carbs and root should be able to put an excellent score on the board. You blokes give up way too easy.
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Root gone. Complete idiot of a shot too
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Going to say what i have always said Root is overrated massively.
Not just on this performance i just do not see what is so good about him
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Root gone. Complete idiot of a shot too
Agree, stupid shot to play when the pressure is on
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Once again is Root good enough so many questions being asked.
I never have been convinced
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Once again is Root good enough so many questions being asked.
I never have been convinced
Bogged himself down then played a silly shot. Very amateurish ! Just bloody bat, does matter the scoring rate as they should know they can't win so are batting to save the game. Runs at this point are irrelevant
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Pathetic
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KP GONE!!!!!! The Aussies are up!!!!!!
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Bogged himself down then played a silly shot. Very amateurish ! Just bloody bat, does matter the scoring rate as they should know they can't win so are batting to save the game. Runs at this point are irrelevant
Runs are important mate but we will agree to disagree.
Poor cricket again.
Not looking too good is it.
Were getting blown away here we need a miricle
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Runs are important mate but we will agree to disagree.
Poor cricket again.
Not looking too good is it.
Were getting blown away here we need a miricle
Agree runs are important, I suppose I meant play each ball on its merits rather than overly worry about run rates. Aus will give bad balls if you stay in long enough. Bell needs to go big now and carbs for us not to be following on this evening :(
Barring cook, it's eng giving it away rather than aus being awesome which is sad.
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Wonder how long it will take Clarke to bring on Smith to bowl to Bell...
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Once again is Root good enough so many questions being asked.
I never have been convinced
England in 2013
Only bell and cook have scored more runs than root(827,765, vs 728)
Only bell and Carberry have a better average than root(43, 41 vs 35)
Root has the highest test score in 2013 of 180
Only bell has scored more centuries than root in 2013(3vs2)
All the above has been without a settled position, 6-1-6-3
You may not be convinced, but he's certainly not having the worse run of England players at mo, and who would replace him?
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England haven't succession planned and will pay the price. Some of the senior players seem to have lost that something in the last 12-18 months.
Anyway, Bell is going to smash a daddy ton and carbs is going to keep surviving somehow and score a gritty 150 off 6 million balls
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Joe Root's problem is his footwork is very ordinary for someone batting at 3.
Root is heavy footed and being continually camped on the backfoot isn't gonna get the job done against a high class pace attack.
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Joe Root's problem is his footwork is very ordinary for someone batting at 3.
Root is heavy footed and being continually camped on the backfoot isn't gonna get the job done against a high class pace attack.
See I think personally he'll be good enough.. Just made a mental error but it's those key decisions that matter. He's around for a good few years yet.
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bad ball, average shot, stunning catch, carbs gone england in real ****
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Stokes out done by a good ball from Mitchy...........England in all sorts!
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Matt Prior's career could be on the line heading into the Perth Test match.
His horror run continues with yet another duck in 2013. 5 ducks in 2013
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Devastating bowling from Mitchell Johnson.
A triple wicket maiden.
The lower order could get blown away here.
He's also on a hat trick.
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Matt Prior is done for me..such a big factor in England's success...amazing bowling by Johnson! Fast and Accurate!!
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On a flat pitch, pretty pathetic scorecard.
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Assuming England follow on, Bell's gotta bat 3.
I also fear for England at Perth. Mitch loves it there and England aren't gonna enjoy 150kph rockets peppering them.
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5-fer Mitchell Johnson. A quite sensational catch by Pup to remove Swann.
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Make it 6-fer!
Anderson gone first ball.
Mitch on a hat trick again.
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Mitch Johnson has not bowled this well since SA 2009.
Incredible.
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I've gotta say I'm completely shocked by this performance, completely unprofessional. I've always thought this England side is very good, but overrated and that once Australia rebuilt a bit we'd resume supremacy, but didn't see such an emphatic message being delivered.
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So good to see Johnson using his brains and not just trying to bowl quick..that ball to Jimmy was spot on...wot a beautiful sight! Just goes to show that the top order need to bat responsibly..that bad shot from Carberry started the slide. Hope England batsmen learn their lesson in the second innings...this is getting pretty pathetic..come on England!!!
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So good to see Johnson using his brains and not just trying to bowl quick..that ball to Jimmy was spot on...wot a beautiful sight! Just goes to show that the top order need to bat responsibly..that bad shot from Carberry started the slide. Hope England batsmen learn their lesson in the second innings...this is getting pretty pathetic..come on England!!!
A bit rough on Carberry! That was a cracking shot....Warner just a took an incredible catch in his WRONG hand!
Nowt you can do about that.
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Not sure what Aus is trying now rotating bowlers..just get it over with..everyone can bowl in the second innings.
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9/172 :(
Depressed.. I had thought this would be one heck of a series..
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All Done. Mitch 7 -40
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Good stuff from the Aussies..........Who would've thought they would be all out for 172?
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Well Bowled Mitchell Johnson! What a superb spell of quick and hostile bowling!!
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Lovely ball by Monty to get rid of Clarke.
I was shocked to see us out for <200 again when i woke up at 5. Our batsmen really need to pull something out the bag second innings and regain some confidencs, and respect from the aussies. They must just be laughing at us so far
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As my old rugby coach used to say total lack of moral fibre. Looks to me that we haven't got the stomach for the fight. Absolutely devastated fair play to the Aussies but bowled out 3 times for under 200 not good enough by a long way.
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Here's my take on everything.
Today/last night.
Not saying root and pieterson didn't play the wrong shots at the wrong time(they both did) but I believe they was playing to England's tactics.
Which I believe we're.
"Block duck and ignore Mitch, he's too good
Harris, just hit the really bad ball.
Lyons and siddle lets get after them, and be aggressive.
This will mean they bring Mitch and Harris back on and get tired"
Didn't work, root should have played down the ground, and looked at a few first.
Pieterson ego took over after siddle bowled well at him.
Bell certainly attacked well!
The ashes in general.
Many will blame the warm up games, priors injury etc, but we are well in now, it's quite clear we aren't good enough and lack confidence at the mo.
We've lost these, we will lose by one of 3-0 3-1 4-0 or 4-1.
In my opinion we only won the home serious for several reasons.
1 bell
2 carried over confidence from the Strauss era
3 Australia's lack of confidence
4 Micky Arthur was useless!
Lehman is doing a great job,and i can only think Australia will get better, they have some good up coming pace options, and when agars spin improves, he should take over as top spinner, but batting at 6,7 to strengthen the batting.
I have a feeling aus will try to drop Rodgers though, as he was Arthur's left field pick, and Lehman has stuck with him through a good few innings, but once he has two tests without a 50, I think he'll go.
Which is a shame as I like him, atleast he will get to win The ashe's atleast once though.
England going forward
They need to mix it up for next test. Bresnan for Monty, bairstow for prior
And change batting line up.
Root
Carberry
Bell
Cook
Pietersen
Bairstow
Stokes
Bresnan
Broad
Swan
Anderson
(I expect flame for this)
As for roots issues, he was picked and groom for England because he is a backfoot player. And that's what they wanted to add to the side.
Would make no sense to then turn him into a front foot player.
Having played against him in two leagues, and watching our juniors vs him. He always has and always will be a back foot player.
I believe he will come good, and will be in an England short for atleast 10 years. We will see though....
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England only won the home series because of the weather and dodgy umpiring.
Thinking of dropping Cook down the order is simply insane... And to be a good opening batsman you need to be a good front foot player
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Speaking of umpires, how annoying is this front foot no ball check at almost every wicket?
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May as well not have umpires in the centre at all
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Last night was totally worth keeping awake. Mitch was superb. Some amazing catches-Clarke, Warner's one -hander.
Bell played well and kept Eng afloat for some time. Monty survived 35 balls - very good considering te 3 more accomplished batsmen before him lasted only half the balls.
High point for Eng - Carberry getting a 60 and taking Watto's catch
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Here's my take on everything.
Today/last night.
Not saying root and pieterson didn't play the wrong shots at the wrong time(they both did) but I believe they was playing to England's tactics.
Which I believe we're.
"Block duck and ignore Mitch, he's too good
Harris, just hit the really bad ball.
Lyons and siddle lets get after them, and be aggressive.
This will mean they bring Mitch and Harris back on and get tired"
Didn't work, root should have played down the ground, and looked at a few first.
Pieterson ego took over after siddle bowled well at him.
Bell certainly attacked well!
The ashes in general.
Many will blame the warm up games, priors injury etc, but we are well in now, it's quite clear we aren't good enough and lack confidence at the mo.
We've lost these, we will lose by one of 3-0 3-1 4-0 or 4-1.
In my opinion we only won the home serious for several reasons.
1 bell
2 carried over confidence from the Strauss era
3 Australia's lack of confidence
4 Micky Arthur was useless!
Lehman is doing a great job,and i can only think Australia will get better, they have some good up coming pace options, and when agars spin improves, he should take over as top spinner, but batting at 6,7 to strengthen the batting.
I have a feeling aus will try to drop Rodgers though, as he was Arthur's left field pick, and Lehman has stuck with him through a good few innings, but once he has two tests without a 50, I think he'll go.
Which is a shame as I like him, atleast he will get to win The ashe's atleast once though.
England going forward
They need to mix it up for next test. Bresnan for Monty, bairstow for prior
And change batting line up.
Root
Carberry
Bell
Cook
Pietersen
Bairstow
Stokes
Bresnan
Broad
Swan
Anderson
(I expect flame for this)
As for roots issues, he was picked and groom for England because he is a backfoot player. And that's what they wanted to add to the side.
Would make no sense to then turn him into a front foot player.
Having played against him in two leagues, and watching our juniors vs him. He always has and always will be a back foot player.
I believe he will come good, and will be in an England short for atleast 10 years. We will see though....
Yeah I wouldn't be moving Cook from 1, considering it is going to be at the WACA I think Tremlett and/or Finn should come into the side..........But the move of Bell to 3 should do him justice. Oh and England should watch out for umm..........Johnson!!!!!! ;)
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I would keep The top 5 as they are.
Then bring in Bairstow at 6 for prior as smilley said. Also agree bresnan for Panesar. I would like to see Finn get a go too. He has the same kind of agression and raw pace as Johnson. Clearly he isnt as good yet, but with time and experience I think he will be.
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I would be wary of throwing the baby out with the bath water.
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I think they need to take a long hard look in the mirror. They are making an average Australian side ( some of who are having blinders) look like unbeatables. Carbs and bell are the only ones who can take a little pride from their batting. Kp should be shot! Someone of his talents playing that shot when the trap it set is shocking. Root should be put in detention. Terrible shot, but you can't pick on a kid. Mitchell is bowling well but he's only a couple of tough spells away from his old spray it everywhere days. He bowled that horrible wide last night. Put him under some pressure and see what he does. He's got the ability to dictate at the moment and were batting like fools.
Bring in a proper no3. A grafter like Compton and let him just bat. Bring in some
Fire power in the bowling. Bowling 80mph at international level isn't testing anyone. Prior has to be dropped but we need to call up a decent keeper batsman. Bairstow isn't the answer.
The difference ATM is this
They have Clarke- our equivalent is bell- tho slightly less runs
They have haddin- out scoring prior massively. I think I'd out score him ATM
They have Johnson - we have medium pacers.
The rest of the aus side isn't doing a huge amount better than some of our boys. We need to hit them hard with a team capable of ruffling some feathers rather than hiding behind some
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johnson has won them this game with one decent spell of bowling, itll be the same at the waca on a fast and bouncy pitch, looks like its could be 5-0 at this rate :s one good thing about mitch playing well is my fantasy side will be raking in the points off him and clarke :D
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I think they need to take a long hard look in the mirror. They are making an average Australian side ( some of who are having blinders) look like unbeatables. Carbs and bell are the only ones who can take a little pride from their batting. Kp should be shot! Someone of his talents playing that shot when the trap it set is shocking. Root should be put in detention. Terrible shot, but you can't pick on a kid. Mitchell is bowling well but he's only a couple of tough spells away from his old spray it everywhere days. He bowled that horrible wide last night. Put him under some pressure and see what he does. He's got the ability to dictate at the moment and were batting like fools.
Bring in a proper no3. A grafter like Compton and let him just bat. Bring in some
Fire power in the bowling. Bowling 80mph at international level isn't testing anyone. Prior has to be dropped but we need to call up a decent keeper batsman. Bairstow isn't the answer.
The difference ATM is this
They have Clarke- our equivalent is bell- tho slightly less runs
They have haddin- out scoring prior massively. I think I'd out score him ATM
They have Johnson - we have medium pacers.
The rest of the aus side isn't doing a huge amount better than some of our boys. We need to hit them hard with a team capable of ruffling some feathers rather than hiding behind some
Carbs did ok, but at the end, it was similar the KP dismissal. There were two there waiting for the catch.
Bell came out aggressive from the start, he could easily mis-timed one to a fielder rather than space.
It seems that they have a bit of bad luck and a lot of bad batting. It could have been a lot worse.
Bowlers don't seem to be helping much either, very solid without being outstanding. You cant see any of them ripping through the Aussies.
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Redink, youve gotta stay off the drugs...
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Redink, youve gotta stay off the drugs...
Nothing quite like an Englishman in denial ;) :D
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Root has made 2 centuries and done next to nothing since, why is he still getting picked when Compton was axed for similar?
Prior is over the hill now it would seem, and I'd like to see a proper keeper in the side (no disrespect to Rom Weasley but he's no Foster is he). Coul we call up Read or Foster (let's face it they'll get more runs than Prior on current form) and recall Compton to strengthen the top order (the selectors are unlikely to do that I'd imagine).
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My views for what it's worth after reading the last few pages.
Firstly England just look scared of Johnson, I can understand one of us as a club player being petrified if facing him, but these are the best players we have, to me abroad just walked inside it to protect himself first and formost not to try and survive and be pre-pared to wear one if that's what was required. The rest of the batting except bell and maybe cook and Carb's is pathetic to be honest.
To comment of moving cook to 4 is to be honest to most daft comment I have seen in ages. End of that one.
Prior just needs to bat, don't care how or where but he needs to bat, I see the point people say about bringing in Bairstow but what is the benefit? All he has done is face net bowlers for basically the last 12 months as he has been carrying drinks. Not his fault at all but he played hardly any county last season and due to poor weather etc in the warm up games nothing in Aus. Plus his keeping is not in the same class as Prior and most importantly I think prior is very very important to the England set up.
England's so called express line up of giants just looks a joke at the moment with Tremlet in the first game and stokes & broad just about touching mid 80's with not a hint of movement and the same can be said of Anderson, who to be fair has carried this side for a long while. Finn is Eratic as we all know but on his day (just like Johnson) is a bloody handful. Swann is out bowled again by Monty. The bit I'm getting at is that all our so called superstars are all playing badly as a collective. What's the answer?? Simply there isn't one at the moment, Aus are just better in every department. I think at the end of this series you have to be brave and say thanks for all you have done but Father Time has had enough. We have some amazing players in the county set up, some have had brief intro's to international like Root who made his place his own. I think it's time to look at the next crop of players. We have dominated Aus while they were trying to get over losing there greats of the game and I think the tide has now turned. Do I like it? No, is it fair, yes as they are playing better cricket and have more players in form.
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Root has made 2 centuries and done next to nothing since, why is he still getting picked when Compton was axed for similar?
Prior is over the hill now it would seem, and I'd like to see a proper keeper in the side (no disrespect to Rom Weasley but he's no Foster is he). Coul we call up Read or Foster (let's face it they'll get more runs than Prior on current form) and recall Compton to strengthen the top order (the selectors are unlikely to do that I'd imagine).
I do not believe it was form that got Compton dropped or axed I think it was that he was not a team player I Remember reading in an article. Is he the best we have? Maybe .
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Carbs did ok, but at the end, it was similar the KP dismissal. There were two there waiting for the catch.
Bell came out aggressive from the start, he could easily mis-timed one to a fielder rather than space.
It seems that they have a bit of bad luck and a lot of bad batting. It could have been a lot worse.
Bowlers don't seem to be helping much either, very solid without being outstanding. You cant see any of them ripping through the Aussies.
I'm not blaming Carberry for his dismissal, absolute blinder from admittedly a very good fielder - its not a high risk shot. As for that starting the collapse, I don't subscribe to that. They are all professioanl cricketers and have a responsible for their own technique and mindset. I'm more likely to blame KP for that ridiculous shot with the trap set. You've got eyes fella, use 'em!
Yes, Bell could have mis timed, but is he likely to in this form on that deck?! Clarke COULD have spooned his first ball on day 2 to a fielder as well. 'Could' never 'did...'
Here are my thoughts on the differences between last summer and this Ashes to date.
1) England let Australia off to a point in the final test at the Oval. They shouldn't have experimented, they should have stuck to their successful formula and maintained momentum into this series. They missed a trick in getting into Australia's minds with incessant pressure. Australia started planning for 2013/14 last summer. England not until they flew out.
2) They will never admit it, but England looked at the 2010/11 series, the 3-0 in the summer, thought they had it in the bag and lacked preparation based on a bit of arrogance and complacency. Their warm ups were nowhere near the quality of three years ago and, partly due to the fifth test in the summer, came in with an unsettled side. They left themselves lacking strength in depth when Trott came home and hadn't planned for all outcomes.
3) Haddin was better than Prior last summer. Haddin is significantly better than Prior now. Again, there is no strength in depth. Clearly they don't rate Bairstow as a batsman and his keeping isn't Test class. prior brings so much with his keeping, vice-captaincy and on-field knowledge, but they need to start succession planning in all areas.
4) Clarke clearly enjoys batting at home and is handling the captaincy much better than Cook. He is top, top class.
5) If England's prep has been average, Australia have clearly gone away and done their homework and left no stone unturned. They have learnt from 2010/11 and the summer. The attention to detail in their focus, psychology, game and situation planning and mindset is clearly huge. Anyone else thinking Johnson's muzzy is deliberate? Shades of Merv and the aggression of the 90s? It's not Movember anymore...
6) I'm a subscriber that you create your luck. You could argue England have been unlucky losing Trott, but his form wasn't great last summer. England almost won last summer by default (no 400+ first innings score - would we have won tests like that in 2005 and 2009?). If you are not batting well, everything else needs to click -the bowlers haven't and the fielding has been average. We talk about England's batting unit but the bowlers have shipped runs in both Tests. Yes, there's an element of chicken and egg in that, but the bowlers are looking ordinary, helped in part by Johnson's incredible form - looks like he's going to have an Alderman-esque impact on this series... I take onboard previous posts, but you have to say overall across their careers, performing across the world, Anderson is a better bowler than Johnson and, all being equal, Anderson and Broad are a better pairing than Johnson and Harris, over the course of their careers. But in the here and now, its no contest.
7) The psychology of elite sport is incredible - this is exactly why I studied it. Johnson's self efficacy is so high at the minute he thinks he's going to take a wicket with every ball. he's also been very well managed by the staff and his captain. Compare him to previous series to now to see the difference. Maybe a couple of technical tweaks, but mainly its his mindset and still (amazingly) some ex pro's across various sports think psychology has no place in elite sport - unbelievable.
8) Australia have unleashed Johnson, who didn't play in England, high on confidence and pace on quick, bouncy tracks. England have no surprise bowlers for Australia to contend with and their matchwinners have been nullified by the pitches.
My concern? Momentum is everything in sport and this really could go 5-0. Australia have to be odds-on in Perth and at 3-0, Ashes gone, what do England have to play for?
Hopefully this isn't an Englishman in denial... ;)
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Root has made 2 centuries and done next to nothing since, why is he still getting picked when Compton was axed for similar?
Prior is over the hill now it would seem, and I'd like to see a proper keeper in the side (no disrespect to Rom Weasley but he's no Foster is he). Coul we call up Read or Foster (let's face it they'll get more runs than Prior on current form) and recall Compton to strengthen the top order (the selectors are unlikely to do that I'd imagine).
Compton in every likelihood won't play for England again. He spat his dummy publicly when dropped and criticised Gooch's training methods - attitude is the next thing Team England look for after ability. His is deemed poor and disruptive.
You can't expect players who've been sitting with their feet up for months to go and play in everything that an Ashes series brings. We talk about poor prep in the warm ups games - Read and Foster, though I do take on board their excellent keeping, would be (excuse the pun) sitting ducks. They haven't had any prep whatsoever.
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My views are England are not that good in the home series we won by producing wickets to suit and Arthur being a joke.
Truth is England have not played great cricket since India and Australia as a sporting nation like the efficient Germans smelt blood.
Sometimes you have to just put your hands up and say the other team is simply better.
There bowling better than us, fielding better than us, and batting better, there creating there own look.
Sometimes you have to start again however there back up looks a bit better than ours Bresnan medium pace or Nile Exocet missiles...
I think England have had two many mediocre players playing recently and the super stars have got us home but now none of them are performing the mediocre have become exposed.
Like the brand Australia are playing a special mention to Carberry he looks a classy test opener
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My views for what it's worth after reading the last few pages.
Firstly England just look scared of Johnson, I can understand one of us as a club player being petrified if facing him, but these are the best players we have, to me abroad just walked inside it to protect himself first and formost not to try and survive and be pre-pared to wear one if that's what was required. The rest of the batting except bell and maybe cook and Carb's is pathetic to be honest.
To comment of moving cook to 4 is to be honest to most daft comment I have seen in ages. End of that one.
Prior just needs to bat, don't care how or where but he needs to bat, I see the point people say about bringing in Bairstow but what is the benefit? All he has done is face net bowlers for basically the last 12 months as he has been carrying drinks. Not his fault at all but he played hardly any county last season and due to poor weather etc in the warm up games nothing in Aus. Plus his keeping is not in the same class as Prior and most importantly I think prior is very very important to the England set up.
England's so called express line up of giants just looks a joke at the moment with Tremlet in the first game and stokes & broad just about touching mid 80's with not a hint of movement and the same can be said of Anderson, who to be fair has carried this side for a long while. Finn is Eratic as we all know but on his day (just like Johnson) is a bloody handful. Swann is out bowled again by Monty. The bit I'm getting at is that all our so called superstars are all playing badly as a collective. What's the answer?? Simply there isn't one at the moment, Aus are just better in every department. I think at the end of this series you have to be brave and say thanks for all you have done but Father Time has had enough. We have some amazing players in the county set up, some have had brief intro's to international like Root who made his place his own. I think it's time to look at the next crop of players. We have dominated Aus while they were trying to get over losing there greats of the game and I think the tide has now turned. Do I like it? No, is it fair, yes as they are playing better cricket and have more players in form.
I know a lot of people won't like me saying this and even I can't believe I am saying it but even Lyon has out bowled Swann...
Simply Swann can't bowl on Aussie wickets
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I'm not blaming Carberry for his dismissal, absolute blinder from admittedly a very good fielder - its not a high risk shot. As for that starting the collapse, I don't subscribe to that. They are all professioanl cricketers and have a responsible for their own technique and mindset. I'm more likely to blame KP for that ridiculous shot with the trap set. You've got eyes fella, use 'em!
Yes, Bell could have mis timed, but is he likely to in this form on that deck?! Clarke COULD have spooned his first ball on day 2 to a fielder as well. 'Could' never 'did...'
Here are my thoughts on the differences between last summer and this Ashes to date.
1) England let Australia off to a point in the final test at the Oval. They shouldn't have experimented, they should have stuck to their successful formula and maintained momentum into this series. They missed a trick in getting into Australia's minds with incessant pressure. Australia started planning for 2013/14 last summer. England not until they flew out.
2) They will never admit it, but England looked at the 2010/11 series, the 3-0 in the summer, thought they had it in the bag and lacked preparation based on a bit of arrogance and complacency. Their warm ups were nowhere near the quality of three years ago and, partly due to the fifth test in the summer, came in with an unsettled side. They left themselves lacking strength in depth when Trott came home and hadn't planned for all outcomes.
3) Haddin was better than Prior last summer. Haddin is significantly better than Prior now. Again, there is no strength in depth. Clearly they don't rate Bairstow as a batsman and his keeping isn't Test class. prior brings so much with his keeping, vice-captaincy and on-field knowledge, but they need to start succession planning in all areas.
4) Clarke clearly enjoys batting at home and is handling the captaincy much better than Cook. He is top, top class.
5) If England's prep has been average, Australia have clearly gone away and done their homework and left no stone unturned. They have learnt from 2010/11 and the summer. The attention to detail in their focus, psychology, game and situation planning and mindset is clearly huge. Anyone else thinking Johnson's muzzy is deliberate? Shades of Merv and the aggression of the 90s? It's not Movember anymore...
6) I'm a subscriber that you create your luck. You could argue England have been unlucky losing Trott, but his form wasn't great last summer. England almost won last summer by default (no 400+ first innings score - would we have won tests like that in 2005 and 2009?). If you are not batting well, everything else needs to click -the bowlers haven't and the fielding has been average. We talk about England's batting unit but the bowlers have shipped runs in both Tests. Yes, there's an element of chicken and egg in that, but the bowlers are looking ordinary, helped in part by Johnson's incredible form - looks like he's going to have an Alderman-esque impact on this series... I take onboard previous posts, but you have to say overall across their careers, performing across the world, Anderson is a better bowler than Johnson and, all being equal, Anderson and Broad are a better pairing than Johnson and Harris, over the course of their careers. But in the here and now, its no contest.
7) The psychology of elite sport is incredible - this is exactly why I studied it. Johnson's self efficacy is so high at the minute he thinks he's going to take a wicket with every ball. he's also been very well managed by the staff and his captain. Compare him to previous series to now to see the difference. Maybe a couple of technical tweaks, but mainly its his mindset and still (amazingly) some ex pro's across various sports think psychology has no place in elite sport - unbelievable.
8) Australia have unleashed Johnson, who didn't play in England, high on confidence and pace on quick, bouncy tracks. England have no surprise bowlers for Australia to contend with and their matchwinners have been nullified by the pitches.
My concern? Momentum is everything in sport and this really could go 5-0. Australia have to be odds-on in Perth and at 3-0, Ashes gone, what do England have to play for?
Hopefully this isn't an Englishman in denial... ;)
Not blaming Carberry for his dismissal? He hit it straight to square leg fielder. I don't see how that is different to KP?
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I know a lot of people won't like me saying this and even I can't believe I am saying it but even Lyon has out bowled Swann...
Simply Swann can't bowl on Aussie wickets
Lyon is no mug in truth never has been he has the favorite old sock feel he keeps coming at you.
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KPs chipped it to one of two fielders set for that shot. The fielder hasn't had to move. he hasn't driven it, he hasn't launched it into the stands. He's chipped it.
Carberry has pulled a ball full pelt six inches off the ground and Warner has dived and stuck his hand out relying on his reflexes. Ask yourself which shot you'd be most annoyed about playing and getting out? And then ask your team mates.
I'm sure the commentators would have slaughtered Bailey if he'd dropped it and Warner would have, like Root, got a 'he's got close, would've been an incredible catch...' It was. We criticise the England players for going into their shells, Carberry plays an attacking shot and warner pulls off a superb catch. A dolly it was not.
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Easby i see your reading this what it look like live at the ground mate
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Easby i see your reading this what it look like live at the ground mate
Absolutely abysmal, had a quick read through some of the comments. Just been a spineless performance in all phases. It's a test of ifs and buts, root and Carberry drops were very expensive.
Today's batting performance is probably the worst I've seen in a very long time. Bell just looked pure class, Carberry dug in, left the ball well and punished the bad ball and looked set for a ton until Warner pulled off a stunner. As soon as he went that was it, pack of cards. Our tail starts at 6 at present the the Aussies know that.
Put your money on a 5-0 whitewash, after seeing it up close I can't see what changes we can make that would make a difference. Even our supposedly stong suit (bowling) looks pedestrian at best compared to the Aussies.
Unfortunately for me I've paid ££££ to watch this shower of (No Swearing Please) and have to put myself through it once again tomorrow and then at Perth - can't wait!
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Have you got me my stuff yet Easo fekk England mate....
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Pipe down - you might be lucky if I can be arsed to make the trip to Meulumans in Perth
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Hey you could do a forum shop mate????
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I said it before and I'll say it again. England need to swap root and bell. I don't care what bells stats are at 3 he is the only one capable of dealing with Johnson atm. I don't understand him coming in when England are in the poop
Sent from my HTC_PN071 using Tapatalk
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I see Monty was using a Shark bat today
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I said it before and I'll say it again. England need to swap root and bell. I don't care what bells stats are at 3 he is the only one capable of dealing with Johnson atm. I don't understand him coming in when England are in the poop
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Bell wants to come in at 3, management prefer him (for now) at 5. That said, I'm pretty sure they want Root to bad every position 1-7, so stay tuned...
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Bell wants to come in at 3, management prefer him (for now) at 5. That said, I'm pretty sure they want Root to bad every position 1-7, so stay tuned...
Hopefully the management see sense soon and have Root carry the drinks!
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We have seen lengthy analysis of what the Aussies are doing right and what England are doing wrong and to some extent some of the points are right and some are wrong. But basically as i put in an earlier post the Aussies have got into our heads, they are in their home country and they are showing a hunger and a desire to win the greatest prize in world cricket. We on the other hand underestimated the opposition and thought we were just going to go through the formalities and return home with the ashes. We were abruptly shown in the 1st test that this was not going to be the case, however it doesn't seem as if we have learned anything from that 1st test. I am a fiercely proud England supporter and if defeat comes against a superior team, but in that defeat England have given their all then I will gladly applaud the victors and rightly so. But come on 3 innings and we haven't even scored 600 runs we aren't even competing, these guys who are representing us are all of a far superior ability than all of us writing on here will ever be, but to me you can have all the ability in the world but if you have got no stomach for the fight that ability will be wasted.
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Jeez you blokes are tough on carberry....... fair enough shot to a bit of a long hop.... decent catch.
The ball cook got, early, will get anyone, not much the batter csn do there.
As a massive kp fan, been disappointed, siddles got him what 9 times now? Thr plan couldnt be more clear, did someone say 3 card trick
Check my posts since brisbane, bell @ 3 is a no brainer. Why you would want your best bat coming in at 3for no many is beyond me. I heard england were concerned with grouping root, stokes, prior in the middle order. If your worried, pick someone else?
Everyone wants to dump prior, and, more is expected of keepers with the bat post gilchrist era, but ask yourself is prior the best keeper in england? If so, he stays, picking a keeper other thsn the best gloveman is dangerous. If he's not, see above. This picking the keeper who is the best batsman of the keepers is rubbish.
Stop blaming the blokes batting below 7 for getting cleaned out. Theres not much a tail can do agsinst extreme pace. Broad has played really well, just misjudged this one.
Anderson (pamela?) Has always been a 'head dropper' when things dont go his way, needs to lift. Broad always tries hard. Cant believe bresnan wasnt picked, stokes (currently) isnt good enough with either bat or ball to warrant selection.
Theres still plenty of scope for this match to be drawn, the pitch is still magnificent for batting. You blokes order in the coffins way to easily! Cook csn bat for a day (remind me to buy a book) as csn bell, kp and carberry by the look of him.
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Jeez you blokes are tough on carberry....... fair enough shot to a bit of a long hop.... decent catch.
The ball cook got, early, will get anyone, not much the batter csn do there.
As a massive kp fan, been disappointed, siddles got him what 9 times now? Thr plan couldnt be more clear, did someone say 3 card trick
Check my posts since brisbane, bell @ 3 is a no brainer. Why you would want your best bat coming in at 3for no many is beyond me. I heard england were concerned with grouping root, stokes, prior in the middle order. If your worried, pick someone else?
Everyone wants to dump prior, and, more is expected of keepers with the bat post gilchrist era, but ask yourself is prior the best keeper in england? If so, he stays, picking a keeper other thsn the best gloveman is dangerous. If he's not, see above. This picking the keeper who is the best batsman of the keepers is rubbish.
Stop blaming the blokes batting below 7 for getting cleaned out. Theres not much a tail can do agsinst extreme pace. Broad has played really well, just misjudged this one.
Anderson (pamela?) Has always been a 'head dropper' when things dont go his way, needs to lift. Broad always tries hard. Cant believe bresnan wasnt picked, stokes (currently) isnt good enough with either bat or ball to warrant selection.
Theres still plenty of scope for this match to be drawn, the pitch is still magnificent for batting. You blokes order in the coffins way to easily! Cook csn bat for a day (remind me to buy a book) as csn bell, kp and carberry by the look of him.
The only victory England can get is to bat for 2 days and break Johnson's confidence (a 0-60 off loads of overs will do it) and break Harris and maybe Watson too :(
Don't like wanting injuries but it'd be nice to make them break down and force them to think about things a little. Game went just after lunch yesterday so it's now about the draw and breaking Aussie quicks.
Johnson's been good and you wouldn't see me lasting more than one ball against his short ball but these are pros and supposed to be the best we have so he shouldn't be that hard to see off as he's bowling short spells.
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Everyone wants to dump prior, and, more is expected of keepers with the bat post gilchrist era, but ask yourself is prior the best keeper in england? If so, he stays, picking a keeper other thsn the best gloveman is dangerous. If he's not, see above. This picking the keeper who is the best batsman of the keepers is rubbish.
No where near the the best glovesman in the country and neither's Bairstow, but like you say they won't pick anyone else because of their lack of batting.
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No where near the the best glovesman in the country and neither's Bairstow, but like you say they won't pick anyone else because of their lack of batting.
Bairstow has the potential to be the best keeper-batsman in the world, but he's not going to get any better without playing. He needs a season for Yorkshire,then maybe a winter overseas, then review.
He is currently is as a batsman who keeps a bit and I'd say there is a number between him and the England keeper spot.
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To be honest I can't see there being many. At the current time the only other person I could have seen in the keeping/reserve keeper role for this series is Davies.
Youngsters coming through, I'm not sure about many other counties but at Hampshire we have Adam Wheater who is looking good but in a very similar to England in a way that he is pushing out Michael Bates who from what I've seen of him is the best glovesman in the country, but unfortunately is still in the process of improving his batting. Again similar to England, in some games we've had Wheater in purely as a batsman with Bates keeping.
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Johnson's doing well at the moment, he has ran through the English top order AND opened the scoring for Sunderland
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To be honest I can't see there being many. At the current time the only other person I could have seen in the keeping/reserve keeper role for this series is Davies.
Youngsters coming through, I'm not sure about many other counties but at Hampshire we have Adam Wheater who is looking good but in a very similar to England in a way that he is pushing out Michael Bates who from what I've seen of him is the best glovesman in the country, but unfortunately is still in the process of improving his batting. Again similar to England, in some games we've had Wheater in purely as a batsman with Bates keeping.
Sam Billings at Kent is very well regarded in this part of the world. Atherton also really rates him as one of the best young keeper/batsmen he has seen. In my view he should have replaced Garient Jones last season with the gloves.
The best keeper in the country by a mile is James Foster and he is arguably the best keeper, consistently in the world in my opinion especially standing up which at times is not Priors strongest suit. But we all know world cricket dictates you have to have a batsmen keeper, even in test cricket now a days.
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Jeez you blokes are tough on carberry....... fair enough shot to a bit of a long hop.... decent catch.
The ball cook got, early, will get anyone, not much the batter csn do there.
As a massive kp fan, been disappointed, siddles got him what 9 times now? Thr plan couldnt be more clear, did someone say 3 card trick
Check my posts since brisbane, bell @ 3 is a no brainer. Why you would want your best bat coming in at 3for no many is beyond me. I heard england were concerned with grouping root, stokes, prior in the middle order. If your worried, pick someone else?
Everyone wants to dump prior, and, more is expected of keepers with the bat post gilchrist era, but ask yourself is prior the best keeper in england? If so, he stays, picking a keeper other thsn the best gloveman is dangerous. If he's not, see above. This picking the keeper who is the best batsman of the keepers is rubbish.
Stop blaming the blokes batting below 7 for getting cleaned out. Theres not much a tail can do agsinst extreme pace. Broad has played really well, just misjudged this one.
Anderson (pamela?) Has always been a 'head dropper' when things dont go his way, needs to lift. Broad always tries hard. Cant believe bresnan wasnt picked, stokes (currently) isnt good enough with either bat or ball to warrant selection.
Theres still plenty of scope for this match to be drawn, the pitch is still magnificent for batting. You blokes order in the coffins way to easily! Cook csn bat for a day (remind me to buy a book) as csn bell, kp and carberry by the look of him.
Broad didn't misjudge it... He was scared he was going to get hit and moved out of the way
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Stuart Broad's batting outside England is pretty dreadful.
40 innings and just one half century. And a pathetic average of 14.
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Broad didn't misjudge it... He was scared he was going to get hit and moved out of the way
Agreed. He needs to sort out his batting or people need to stop pretending he's some sort of Flintoff replacement ! Currently his batting is really poor and has been for a long while
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Aussies declared.
Its gonna rain apparently
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Show some fight!! Don't care if England lose now, just show fight and bat till last session on day 5!
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9balls. Great fight there cook........
Stupid no ball check again. Half his foot was behind the line!
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What an idiot. my twitter puts it in a different way.
But you are trying to save a test, so the best idea is to play a short ball in the second over of the innings. Nope if its not going to hit the wickets and your going to hit it in the air, leave it. I would say more but I dont want to be banned. >:(
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Good % shot there a Cook. Just what you want to be playing when the best we can hope for is a draw !! Pathetic and amateurish, they are giftin Johnson wicket after wicket
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The pitch is looking very timid.... If England can't bat 2 days and draw on this pitch them I pity them in Perth
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Sam Billings at Kent is very well regarded in this part of the world. Atherton also really rates him as one of the best young keeper/batsmen he has seen. In my view he should have replaced Garient Jones last season with the gloves.
The best keeper in the country by a mile is James Foster and he is arguably the best keeper, consistently in the world in my opinion especially standing up which at times is not Priors strongest suit. But we all know world cricket dictates you have to have a batsmen keeper, even in test cricket now a days.
Haven't seen Billings keep but I have seen foster live and to be honest from what I saw I was a bit underwhelmed but still gotta agree with you that he's one of the best in the country but cant see him playing for England ever again now. He should have got more of a chance.
I remember watching the 2012 cb40 final and seeing Michael Bates standing up to Kabir Ali periodically throughout the game and even more impressively on the last ball where 2 runs were required (believe he even followed it up with a stumping when it came through to him)! Not many keepers bar a few are able to do things like that.
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Australia aren't even having to play or bowl well to get wickets... 2 eng batsmen just grown their wicket away.. KP next
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You have to say that all the luck has gone against England so far. Surely that will change.
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You have to say that all the luck has gone against England so far. Surely that will change.
Surely.......
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You have to say that all the luck has gone against England so far. Surely that will change.
But you do make your own luck a lot of the time. Look at the catches the Aussies have taken and the catches the English have dropped. This has really dictated the direction of the game. A wicket off a no-ball is also not luck - it's still a no-ball.
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Why is Broad back wearing the masuri?
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We are still letting them get into our heads Stokes and Johnson have a bit of a do. Next ball Stokes faces he is out caught by Pup. Pup repeatedly from slip goes up to the batsman to have a chat, easier said than done we need to ignore the comments and get on with the game. Broad continued to have a go with Johnson all the way off the field. Lets be honest what have we got to have a go at Johnson about we are getting murdered on the field and also by the mind games.
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Why is Broad back wearing the masuri?
Probably bust up his others facing short stuff in the nets !
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We are still letting them get into our heads Stokes and Johnson have a bit of a do. Next ball Stokes faces he is out caught by Pup. Pup repeatedly from slip goes up to the batsman to have a chat, easier said than done we need to ignore the comments and get on with the game. Broad continued to have a go with Johnson all the way off the field. Lets be honest what have we got to have a go at Johnson about we are getting murdered on the field and also by the mind games.
I don't get of this "what have we got to be chirping about" stuff. If Johnson/Clarke is mouthing off then I say good on broad for having a go back. I wouldn't expect the Aussies to be any different if things were reversed.
If it goes in to wind up the bowler to get wickets then yes that's not very smart but to expect our players to shut up and take all of this from the Aussies just because we are playing poorly is rediculous
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It certainly didn't get bust up facing Johnson in the 1st innings.
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I was suggesting that anyone who is indulgeing in the chirping isnt really concentrating on the job at hand which surely in this case is to not lose your wicket if you are English.
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Some players love it and inspires them. Broad has shown with the ball that people on his back can give him a kick up the a*se not sure if it will work with the bat.
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I hope it does work but we are staring into oblivion at the moment. Is it too much to hope the last day will be washed out.
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Forecast is for some rain but I think it's heavier over night than tomorrow. When you are praying for rain is aus you know you've not done well
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I don't get of this "what have we got to be chirping about" stuff. If Johnson/Clarke is mouthing off then I say good on broad for having a go back. I wouldn't expect the Aussies to be any different if things were reversed.
If it goes in to wind up the bowler to get wickets then yes that's not very smart but to expect our players to shut up and take all of this from the Aussies just because we are playing poorly is rediculous
Concentrate on bloody batting. Unless the Aussies go personal then just ignore them, it's irrelevant drivel which doesn't warrant a response. It's. to pat of the game unless you want It to be.
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Yep, walk to square leg, breathe, dont listen, all bowlers have to walk away at some stage...... stokes fell for it, although he's not competent enough for test cricket, tried hard for a while but ended up not having either the technique or mentality to survive. Broad just needs to worry about cricket. I like broad as a cricketer and thought he simply misjudged the ball that got him in the first innings, but he took his eye off the ball too often today to suggest anything other than he's lost his nerve completely. if the poms loose in adelaide theyll get murdered in perth and I think that many of this team may not recover mentally to challenge australia in the future, home or away. Natural order restored.
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I agree that it's best to walk away and say nothing but to do that in the sort of atmosphere that's going on out there if imagine is very difficult. Personally I'd rather see them standing up for themselves. Although I will concede that the Aussies are probably loving every single bit of this
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I agree that it's best to walk away and say nothing but to do that in the sort of atmosphere that's going on out there if imagine is very difficult. Personally I'd rather see them standing up for themselves. Although I will concede that the Aussies are probably loving every single bit of this
Very difficult, you need to be smart and set your ego to the side. No one bothered trying to spoil tendulkars concentration, he simply wouldnt alow himself to be engaged. The bowler has to turn to go back to his mark at some relatively immediate stage.
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I'd just like to say how awesome is it that Australia are kicking (No Swearing Please) ;)
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I'd just like to say how awesome is it that Australia are kicking (No Swearing Please) ;)
It has been a while :)
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Seems to be a lot of mind games.
Maybe someone read on here about Mitch's confidence. 1-53 is a relative failure compared to 7-whatever in the first innings and the stuff in the last test. Even the wicket he hot was more down to a bad choice of shot than actually getting someone out.
I'd say this is a victory for the English. A very very very small victory, but all the same.
Get in side his head more, let him blow up big style in Perth and you never know.
As Hans Gruber once said, "Christmas is a time for miracles"
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Seems to be a lot of mind games.
Maybe someone read on here about Mitch's confidence. 1-53 is a relative failure compared to 7-whatever in the first innings and the stuff in the last test. Even the wicket he hot was more down to a bad choice of shot than actually getting someone out.
I'd say this is a victory for the English. A very very very small victory, but all the same.
Get in side his head more, let him blow up big style in Perth and you never know.
As Hans Gruber once said, "Christmas is a time for miracles"
You must get your drugs from redink.....
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You must get your drugs from redink.....
Very, very good drugs indeed!!!!
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It's all about baby steps.
First, stop getting blown away by Johnson.
Get past 200 for once.
Win toss and bat.
Put 600+ on as Johnson goes 0-175
Bowl Aussies out for 12,twice.
Win in Perth and the following two games.
See it's all part of a bigger plan. Steps one and two done, now for the next test. :)
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It's all about baby steps.
First, stop getting blown away by Johnson.
Get past 200 for once.
Win toss and bat.
Put 600+ on as Johnson goes 0-175
Bowl Aussies out for 12,twice.
Win in Perth and the following two games.
See it's all part of a bigger plan. Steps one and two done, now for the next test. :)
Everyone's on 'em tonight :)
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Its all good.
2fifties.
A successfully new number 3
First 100 partnership
First time past 200
First time batting a full day.
Hopefully we can keep Australia in the field for least 2 sessions tomorrow so there tired for Perth.
Where we get a fresh Brennan to replace a spinner
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At last some positives on the batting front. Bell, Root and Carbs look like they know what they're doing. Just need to get Cookie and KP going and bring Bairstow in at 6 and we might stand a chance.
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would like to see prior get some runs too, more for his own confidence than anything else
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Where we get a fresh Brennan to replace a spinner
What exactly is Bresnan going to add?
80mph gun barrel straight medium paced cannon fodder?
Perth is a fast bouncy wicket.
Pick a proper fast bowler.
Not bit and pieces like Bresnan.
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Seems to be a lot of mind games.
Maybe someone read on here about Mitch's confidence. 1-53 is a relative failure compared to 7-whatever in the first innings and the stuff in the last test. Even the wicket he hot was more down to a bad choice of shot than actually getting someone out.
I'd say this is a victory for the English. A very very very small victory, but all the same.
Get in side his head more, let him blow up big style in Perth and you never know.
As Hans Gruber once said, "Christmas is a time for miracles"
You're on smack right ?
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You're on smack right ?
Wrong, I'm on 'be positive behind England as they are getting wallopped and we need to find a small bright spot in such horrendous displays'.
Got somespare if you want some?
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Wrong, I'm on 'be positive behind England as they are getting wallopped and we need to find a small bright spot in such horrendous displays'.
Got somespare if you want some?
Could do with some before midnight :)
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Told the missus that I will be staying up to watch the cricket. Said its the last night, little does she know this is only the 2nd test.
If only she could understand that I still want to watch cricket even though it looks like it will be an embarrassing loss.
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Not sure how accurate the weather forecasts are on I phone but they have 70% chance of rain until 14.00 hrs in Adelaide at the moment...keep praying :)
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Just had a look at the weather forecast. Look like a few rain showers possible. I would be happy to stay up all night watching it rain !
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(http://i1206.photobucket.com/albums/bb450/CPye061194/83711EEA-A633-487F-A0DE-CBB9D56E7AF1_zps05mhy58f.png) (http://s1206.photobucket.com/user/CPye061194/media/83711EEA-A633-487F-A0DE-CBB9D56E7AF1_zps05mhy58f.png.html)
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Sand based outfield in Adelaide so unless there's 5-7 cms of rain, Australia should still have enough time to polish of England.
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Sand based outfield in Adelaide so unless there's 5-7 cms of rain, Australia should still have enough time to polish of England.
so basically, as long as it doesn't stop, England has a chance.
If it stops, not so much.
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In light of the dodgy drugs I've been sent... Broad to ton up and prior to ton up :)
England will draw with about 450 on the board and a last wicket stand. No danger! Dunno what's,up,with you all :)
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Disappointing to see rain, needed less than 300, that's only about 3.5 an over. We could easily have won this game if it wasn't for the rain.
And there ain't nowt dodgy about them drugs, like.
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Just interviewed Athers live on the pitch, it's raining....keep up the rain dances guys..... :D
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In light of the dodgy drugs I've been sent... Broad to ton up and prior to ton up :)
England will draw with about 450 on the board and a last wicket stand. No danger! Dunno what's,up,with you all :)
I'll raise you a monty double ton to win the test match. :D
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I'll raise you a monty double ton to win the test match. :D
Sweet lord.. I want what you are on :) :)
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Is rain going to save the Aussies?! :o ;)
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Is rain going to save the Aussies?! :o ;)
I think the Aussies are frightened! Prior ton, broad ton and we are there :). Be afraid Clarke, be very afraid
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What is broad doing too attacking and got out fifth ball...
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I think someone needs to shoot broad. Two stupid pull shots early in his innings AND when we are trying to survive hit it bloody down or just leave/defend it. For gods sake stop gifting wickets!! Aus aren't even having to try
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How unbelievably stupid of Stuart Broad...what was he thinking??
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what the hell was that dismissal, nailed a 6 the previous ball dont try it again very next ball. Braindead batting
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Prior is attacking as well but at least he is trying to hit it down, but broad just want to hit it for 6, even monty can bat better than him!
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Over paid, over hyped. Getting fed up with this England sides performances. It's more and more like the football crap each series.
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drop broad for bres on the evidence of that 1 shot absolutely brainless, what message does that send to the dressing room? absolutely disgraceful!
prior smashes mitch, always nice to see :D
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That last pull shot from Prior; his bat sounded unreal!
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absolute crack, wish my bat sounded that good!!!!
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Seems to be a lot of mind games.
Maybe someone read on here about Mitch's confidence. 1-53 is a relative failure compared to 7-whatever in the first innings and the stuff in the last test. Even the wicket he hot was more down to a bad choice of shot than actually getting someone out.
I'd say this is a victory for the English. A very very very small victory, but all the same.
Get in side his head more, let him blow up big style in Perth and you never know.
As Hans Gruber once said, "Christmas is a time for miracles"
If that's a victory you had better tell England to pack up their bags and go home. On a docile pitch he managed a 5 for and was on 2 hatricks. Even when Mitchell was bowling crap a couple of Years ago he ripped thru in Perth. Remember it's his home turf
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2 left
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drop broad for bres on the evidence of that 1 shot absolutely brainless, what message does that send to the dressing room? absolutely disgraceful!
prior smashes mitch, always nice to see :D
Drop the man who's carried England's bowling attack after one poor shot, I'll have some of whatever you're on!
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that'll be lack of sleep and a lot of coffee!! not to mention the thought of being up at 8 on my first day of holiday from uni.
id still like to see bres and finn in the side but i doubt that will happen
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The end is near...probably for the best for England. Cant see them coming back in the series from here in Perth.
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Soft display from England this morning... Showing zero intent to save the test.
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1 left... nice to see prior get a few runs and a forum sponsor get some air time with monty at the crease
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5-0
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They've not even tried to save this test. Utterly pathetic performance yet again. Let's hear the press releases saying 'we are devastated' 'we know we didn't do well' blah blah flipping blah
The whole set up stinks. This team is stale, not good enough anymore.
I'm just angry at the lack of effort. I don't care tbh if people aren't as good as another team.. The least you can do though is put 100% effort in and fight. I love my cricket but these last performances are turning me off completely. My £ is going to these prats
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2-0 itll be 3-0 this time net week series gone
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Where was my Monty double ton to win the match? Terrible batting display, the fact that we can barely manage 300 on a pitch like that is very worrying...
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Broad is the villain for me today..he should have tried to battle hard on this pitch and frustrate the Aus bowler..absolute brain fart!!
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I liked you Cook. BUT stop talking PR crap. Be open and honest!
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Having been there for days 1,2 and 4 I can honesty say I am embarrassed by certain members of the England side, showing absolutely no bottle or quality throughout the game. Cook has even missing throughout the test, not jut his batting but his captaincy, field placements and bowling changes were questionable to say the least.
The support from the England fans however has been top notch, put the Australian fans to shame despite being on the back foot all test
Day 2 I was actually scared for the batsmen. I have never seen anyone run in with as much intent and bowl as quickly as Johnson did, it was frightening and the stadium was electric, it was as if Johnson would take a wicket with every ball.
Less said about Broads 2 dismissals the better, it sums the man up. And a number of other terrible cricket shots by other batsmen, KP and Bell to name a couple. Was great to see Root apply himself and look to really grit it out but for a peice of bad luck and a good grab by Haddin. Australia held there catches and we simply didn't, it proved a massive factor as the game unfolded.
What would everyone's team be for the test in Perth. Who do we hve tht can come in and strengthen? I'm not too sure
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Well at least it finished in time for me to watch the Panthers vs Saints game, let's see what the other Steve Smith can do!
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Yyyaaaaawwwwwnnnnn aaahhhhh is the test over? What happened? Did England save the match? ;) ;) :D :D
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Come on lads who is going to be dropped by the forum selectors?.. Who should never play test cricket again? How much longer is Cook going to captain for? When should Anderson "retire"? Come on guys rip shreds off them.... That's how it works doesn't it?
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I am certain that Bresnan will be in for Perth (replacing Panesar). Personally I would like to see Finn get a game.
Stokes might be dropped and Ballance brought in?
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Yep, obviously you don't play 2 spinners at Perh.....shouldn't play 1
My guess is Lyon will be replaced by coulter-nyle. He got clocked in the 150's last shield game at the WACA, and if you recon Johnson's bouncer is nasty..... Oh dear, are the poms in for a shock.
For the poms, Bresnan in for Monty is pretty obvious. Stokes out too IMO, not either good enough with bat or ball, makes way for a proper batsman, dunno who you've got that's any good, whoever it is won't crack 30 so what does it matter, may as well blood another kid, is there another root around?
I also like Finn for Perth, quick and bowls a natural full length - which you need at Perth, pitch it further up than in other Aussie grounds. I would have Finn in for swan.
That would be 4 damn good quicks
With a mix of speeds, natural lengths and swing, 6 specialist batsmen (part bit players don't cut it in Perth) plus prior. I think thAts the way you should go for Perth
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I would not drop Swann. He might be crucial in the 2nd innings at the WACA. Instead I would gamble on Bresnan and Finn for Stokes and Panesar. That would be a bold move.
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I think for me, the telling stat of the second innings is that no England wicket fell to a ball that was going to hit the stumps. That tells you all you need to know about rash shots and inappropriate decision making. If you get bowled as a batsman, then it's likely that the bowler has won. If you are out caught, then, unless you were stopping the ball hitting the stumps, you probably got yourself out.
It looks to me as though the mindset is totally wrong, But how do you fix it?
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I would not drop Swann. He might be crucial in the 2nd innings at the WACA. Instead I would gamble on Bresnan and Finn for Stokes and Panesar. That would be a bold move.
I have watched cricket at and played on the WACA and never ever seen a spinner play a critical role, not
Even Warne.
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I think for me, the telling stat of the second innings is that no England wicket fell to a ball that was going to hit the stumps. That tells you all you need to know about rash shots and inappropriate decision making. If you get bowled as a batsman, then it's likely that the bowler has won. If you are out caught, then, unless you were stopping the ball hitting the stumps, you probably got yourself out.
It looks to me as though the mindset is totally wrong, But how do you fix it?
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you don't make wholesale changes, we tried that policy during the 90s, as did the Aussies recently. It doesn't work. You cannot throw inexperienced players into ashes cricket, case in point stokes, who will be good enough, ultimately.
you fix the mindset by taking little things from the game. That Australia were 170-odd for 4 on day one, kp digging in, root getting runs at 3, prior getting into some kind of form, players getting out rather than got out.
that's how they'll go about it. Unfortunately i don't see England winning the series whether they have enough to win or draw at perth and given themselves a chance we'll see...
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Prior can't play at Perth though... The forum selectors had him sacked, never to play test cricket again as well as Root, KP, Jimmy Anderson ;) ;) :D :D
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Can't see how England can get a win in Perth. Will just have to be 2-2 then.
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Prior can't play at Perth though... The forum selectors had him sacked, never to play test cricket again as well as Root, KP, Jimmy Anderson ;) ;) :D :D
Ahh, but by your logic, the Aussies are cheating as "the forum" has spoken and already dropped...
Lyon, Watson, Smith, Johnson and Warner.
So if the Aussie selectors can ignore our "demands" then so can the ECB.
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I counter that with Panesar, Carberry and Swann ;)
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Compton, ronson, root, chopra, balance, sibley, Davies, stokes, Finn, rankin, mills
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What happened to Stuart Meaker? He bowled quickly if I remember correctly.
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What happened to Stuart Meaker? He bowled quickly if I remember correctly.
Meaker is quick but leaks a load of runs.
the reality is that this team lacks an individual whose personality transends the team - in a way that Flintoff (when he was being a good boy, not on the smash...) did.
If we want to recover - we need to look at the personalities and find more leaders. Sacking half the players and bringing in kids is kneejerk bs.
I can't see us winning in perth, unless we bat first and cook and carberry go huge.
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Meaker is quick but leaks a load of runs.
the reality is that this team lacks an individual whose personality transends the team - in a way that Flintoff (when he was being a good boy, not on the smash...) did.
If we want to recover - we need to look at the personalities and find more leaders. Sacking half the players and bringing in kids is kneejerk bs.
I can't see us winning in perth, unless we bat first and cook and carberry go huge.
Who to bat at 6? Nothing wrong with eng bowlers. Cook looks clueless in the field.
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England just really lacked batting depth, once they were 4 or 5 down, it felt as though the wickets would come way too easily.
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England just really lacked batting depth, once they were 4 or 5 down, it felt as though the wickets would come way too easily.
Its such small margins at elite level. Eng havrnt had a cook/pietersen, cook/bell or pietersen/bell partnership so its kind of felt like 1 end is always very vulnerable. The eng tail seriously does not want to be at the crease.
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I like Cook as a player but he really has looked clueless as captain so far this series... Is it because this is the first time he has been under real pressure?
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I worry England are mentally shot. Personnel is not the issue - there are no compelling cases for change, it would be for change's sake.
Bresnan for Anderson if he needs a rest.
Rankin for Panesar otherwise.
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Bowling wise Johnson is the difference between the teams. Don't think there is much between Harris/Siddle and Anderson/Broad apart from the match situation. Easy to look good with 570 on the board and the other guy bowling 90+ the other end.
Batting wise England have mostly got themselves out. Pressure/Pace yes, but mostly poor judgement. Reaction times and margins are fine but England just haven't looked ready for this series as a batting unit. It's almost like Pakistan in the UAE again, we just not at the races. Problem is you can't do much because the best players are playing. Don't see the point in wholesale changes unless somebody makes a real case for inclusion.
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Most frustrating thing is playing back to back series. All the effort of the summer was pointless when you give it away in the opening two tests. England and the ECB's fault for agreeing to it. I think it's devalued the ashes as effectively it's only this series that counts. Should not be allowed to happen again, even if Aus have to travel 3 months later to England to defend. Had it been another 2 years to the next ashes who knows who might be left playing?
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I like Cook as a player but he really has looked clueless as captain so far this series... Is it because this is the first time he has been under real pressure?
He has been under pressure before - but not like this with the team as a whole underperforming. There has usually been someone who has stood up - Compton and Prior in NZ. Himself and KP in India, In the summer it was the bowlers and Ian Bell. Here they lost an important toss in the first game, then dropped a load of catches and it went progressively wrong after this...
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England need to get on the front foot and attack in Perth, I'd play Finn and try and get him bowling as quick as possible, yes he might be expensive but hes a wicket taker and you have to take a gamble at this stage of the series
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It will be interesting if the Aussies bring in Coulter-Nile... Will England handle 2 bowlers throwing 150+ thunderbolts?
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It will be interesting if the Aussies bring in Coulter-Nile... Will England handle 2 bowlers throwing 150+ thunderbolts?
What made the Windies so awesome in the 80s was accuracy. Johnson has it at the moment, who knows with Coulter-Nile? No point bowling quick if it isn't straight.
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What made the Windies so awesome in the 80s was accuracy. Johnson has it at the moment, who knows with Coulter-Nile? No point bowling quick if it isn't straight.
Isn't that what England were expecting from Johnson this series.... Bowl to the left, bowl to the right, bowl them all out and they'll have nightmares tonight ;) ;) :D :D
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and they have it easy - spare a thought for these guys :D
WEST INDIES FAST BOWLERS OF THE 80'S - BRUTAL COMPILATION! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3VOGoiaZlX8#)
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This might bring back bad memories.
http://youtu.be/Q-aN8-21Mpc (http://youtu.be/Q-aN8-21Mpc)
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Will be interesting to see if he get's the same swing. Much of that in-swing was generated by his round arm action and the freemantle doctor. It was also the reason he bowled toilet most of the time in that series as his action meant the release point varied too much. His arm position is much higher now which helps his consistency but makes it harder to curve the ball back in - he naturally moves the the ball away.
What has also changed is he's nearly 15kph quicker now, was hitting 135kph then, nearer or over 150kph now.
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Bowling wise Johnson is the difference between the teams. Don't think there is much between Harris/Siddle and Anderson/Broad apart from the match situation. Easy to look good with 570 on the board and the other guy bowling 90+ the other end.
Batting wise England have mostly got themselves out. Pressure/Pace yes, but mostly poor judgement. Reaction times and margins are fine but England just haven't looked ready for this series as a batting unit. It's almost like Pakistan in the UAE again, we just not at the races. Problem is you can't do much because the best players are playing. Don't see the point in wholesale changes unless somebody makes a real case for inclusion.
agree with this....australia are playing better and have hit us with everything but the kitchen sink in the first 2 tests-we have always been poor starters overseas recently and this time we hav'nt got away with it.
not sure what side we will have at perth, i would think we need bresnan in and also some pace,either tremlett or finn/rankin.
I would drop swann...tough call but monty is bowling better if we need one spinner.Johnson has been awesome and every catch is going to hand whereas we have spilled some.
it may be too late but we are starting to fight back,Perth is a bad ground for us but it's now or never.
I dont believe we will lose 5-0(boycott today on BBC) and some of our old players on the Sky commentary team should be embarrased the stuff they are coming out with-they played in the 90's when we neer beat the Aussies.
I also dont believe we are 'mentally shot' but we have to show some fight starting friday
it's probably too late but we can't give up on England yet.
Well played Australia thou-they have been ruthless so far
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Think need to drop Swanny for Perth and keep Monty as our spinner. (he has had success there before and look like hanging around longer than Swanny with the bat at the minute!)
Bresnen should replace him to bowl the hard overs into the Doctor.
Would be nice to see Rankin get a go. Would be his sort of wicket and he is more accurate than Finn. But I can't see which other bowler you drop to get him in?
Leave the batsmen as they are. Those guys got us into this - they need to get us out of it.
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Drop both spinners? Get Finn/Rankin in, I'd prefer Finn for experience over Rankin. Let Root and KP send their tweakers down.
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My team for perth is Cook Carberry Root KP Bell Stokes Prior Bresnan Broad Anderson and Finn. What do we think of that selection I would be interested to hear peoples comments all opinions welcome.
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There is the 3rd test topic for these posts - closing this topic