Topic: Butterfly (Read 147814 times)

tushar sehgal · « **Reply #240 on:** April 03, 2014, 11:25:38 AM »

I guess what I feared is starting to become a reality!!

ProCricketer1982 · « **Reply #241 on:** April 03, 2014, 11:26:51 AM »

Quote from: tushar sehgal on April 03, 2014, 11:25:38 AM

I guess what I feared is starting to become a reality!!

price rises?

smilley792 · « **Reply #242 on:** April 03, 2014, 11:42:05 AM »

Quote from: ProCricketer1982 on April 03, 2014, 11:26:51 AM

price rises?

Yep, as a fad takes off prices tend to rise,

A shame, I'd have had one of those "g1" butterflies over my g3 aldred, but not at 170.

Blazer · « **Reply #243 on:** April 03, 2014, 12:00:48 PM »

Without the intention of causing any malice , The price point was attractive for forum members wanting to have the pleasure of finest handmade Aldred bats without spending a lot of money combined with the renewed viewpoint about butterfly willows and their apparent capability. However it's good from a business point of view to use early season rush to sell bats at an elevated price point. The broader market would still go on looks and can get better looking albeit arguable perfomance for 170 gbp.

e4sby · « **Reply #244 on:** April 03, 2014, 12:25:03 PM »

I wouldn't be surprised to see someone else offering butterfly bats at a bargain price now....

Not my cup of tea but can definitely see the appeal to some

MD2812 · « **Reply #245 on:** April 03, 2014, 12:56:55 PM »

I think we're jumping the gun a bit here guys.

Paul please correct me if I'm wrong.

My understanding is you can get a butterfly G1 for �170 - a bat that would be Grade 1 and �255 otherwise! (�85 saving, not bad)

Clefts which are butterfly I presume will still be �135 (or similar) if they are not what would be a G1 cleft without the butterfly stain.

I hope so as I'm planning a Frankenstein bat to be made this Autumn for next season.

GarrettJ · « **Reply #246 on:** April 03, 2014, 01:00:25 PM »

i dont understand how a butterfly cleft can be classed as grade 1.

tushar sehgal · « **Reply #247 on:** April 03, 2014, 01:07:07 PM »

Quote from: GarrettJ on April 03, 2014, 01:00:25 PM

i dont understand how a butterfly cleft can be classed as grade 1.

Thank you. We have all been saying for years that performance clefts are a way to shift ugly clefts and grading can only be done on looks as you cannot measure performance. Therefore how can a butterfly ever be grade 1? I think at best a butterfly would be grade 3, it does not and cannot perform better then a good performing grade 3, 2 or 1 so only basis left to grade is looks.

In my post on the Forum Fads I was atleast only referring to member going gaga over butterfly but I am a little surprised to see this, I had thought other brands might do this.

RoCo Da Pixie · « **Reply #248 on:** April 03, 2014, 01:11:08 PM »

I think for �170 you'd be better off going elsewhere to buy a bat. Least it would be G1 or G2 and better looking. Granted the performance might not be better. However how are we to know how good a bat plays before buying it.

tim2000s · « **Reply #249 on:** April 03, 2014, 01:22:17 PM »

Quote from: tushar sehgal on April 03, 2014, 01:07:07 PM

I think at best a butterfly would be grade 3, it does not and cannot perform better then a good performing grade 3, 2 or 1 so only basis left to grade is looks.

Sorry Tushar, a totally false statement. A butterfly bat could perform equally to any of these, including a G1+++ Super Pro Willow bat. That's down to the skill of the batmaker (talk to a couple of people on here with Butterflys that perform brilliantly). What it can never do is look like perfect, unblemished, white willow.

GarrettJ · « **Reply #250 on:** April 03, 2014, 02:13:24 PM »

grading is done the the look of the grains and the look of the willow. No room for discussion here, that's how its done in the industry.

tushar sehgal · « **Reply #251 on:** April 03, 2014, 02:38:59 PM »

Quote from: tim2000s on April 03, 2014, 01:22:17 PM

Sorry Tushar, a totally false statement. A butterfly bat could perform equally to any of these, including a G1+++ Super Pro Willow bat. That's down to the skill of the batmaker (talk to a couple of people on here with Butterflys that perform brilliantly). What it can never do is look like perfect, unblemished, white willow.

Let me correct that, what I meant was it could be as good as grade 1, 2, 3 or any of 1+++ but we don't know that as "Its a natural product and impossible to determine performance" etc. etc. so if it could play just as well as anyother grades how do you grade it? well to me only based on looks, then its a grade 2 or 3.

Buzz · « **Reply #252 on:** April 03, 2014, 02:49:48 PM »

I think we are splitting hairs here (as ever with grading)

Paul called them G1 Butterfly bats - not G1 bats - i.e. a separate grading to a G1 bat.

A butterfly bat is by definition a grade 4 bat.

A Grade 4 Blade
A Grade 4 Blade is normally over half colour or contains butterfly stain (see our page on Imperfections in Willow). This wood is also normally bleached just to make it �look better�, it will still play as well as the other grades. Any number of grains are possible with often only 4 grains, the willow containing �butterfly� stain is very strong, there could also be more �speck�.

The price is up to the seller (and how much the buyer is prepared to pay)

Neon Cricket · « **Reply #253 on:** April 03, 2014, 02:50:40 PM »

At the end of the day I can see exactly where Paul is coming from - there are going to be some butterfly clefts with 4/5 grains and some with 15 - this is simply a way to distinguish between them. Maybe calling it "Butterfly Grade 1" could confuse some but I can see the idea behind it. After all a beautiful straight 15 grained cleft with a slight butterfly stain would be more desirable than a 5 wobbly grain ugly butterfly cleft.

I'm all for the distinguished prices just maybe not calling it Grade 1/2/3 etc, potentially something like Butterfly and Premium Butterfly?

At the end of the day Paul makes a fantastic bat and even a Butterfly cleft should be more than the �135 he sells the standard ones for - the craftsmanship that goes into the blade alone should be worth that.

Just my thoughts on the subject!

smilley792 · « **Reply #254 on:** April 03, 2014, 02:55:26 PM »

I'm waiting for the magically "crown" butterfly to appear. Or just a grade 4 version.

As surely these super dense lightweight clefts that get raved about don't just come in g1+++++???

Or does no one actually bother to measure the density of the non pretty clefts?

Author Topic: Butterfly (Read 147814 times)

tushar sehgal

Re: Butterfly

ProCricketer1982

Re: Butterfly

smilley792

Re: Butterfly

Blazer

Re: Butterfly

e4sby

Re: Butterfly

MD2812

Re: Butterfly

GarrettJ

Re: Butterfly

tushar sehgal

Re: Butterfly

RoCo Da Pixie

Re: Butterfly

tim2000s

Re: Butterfly

GarrettJ

Re: Butterfly

tushar sehgal

Re: Butterfly

Buzz

Re: Butterfly

Neon Cricket

Re: Butterfly

smilley792

Re: Butterfly