Butterfly
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Seniorplayer

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Re: Butterfly
« Reply #300 on: April 07, 2014, 04:56:01 PM »

Butterfly stains are quite hard, take longer to play in and create weight making the bat heavier but the ball will eventually rebound of the stain the same as a bat without the stain if it is pressed correctly.


 
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Aldred Cricket Bats

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Re: Butterfly
« Reply #301 on: April 07, 2014, 06:50:11 PM »

Ok hope this answers a few questions. Just got in after a long day out coaching so tried to put these photos so they are a bit clearer and put them on a dark background with good lighting to try and show the grains up on the photo.
  The first photo is of 2 of what I am calling a butterfly 1 that are made up ready to go out and the middle one is of a pure grade 1 cleft. Now try and look through the staining, on one bat it is easier to do as it is minimal the other has a little more in it. Try and compare the grains on them to the one in the middle that is a pure grade 1 cleft in its raw state. Hopefully you will see that the grains are very very similar minimum 7 straight and true both are very light clefts and response superb.
  The second picture is of some raw butterfly clefts that we are classing as standard butterfly clefts. Whilst they have lovely straight grains they have below 7 in fact by the time they are cut to correct width one will have 5 on and have quite a few little pin marks and blemishes in them unlike the other two. Many of these are still light in weight but are not special clefts.
  As far as the stain is concerned yes if the stain is smack in the middle of the bat it will take a touch longer to open up but it will still fly off the face and possibly last longer too
  Staining and weight, yes people say the more colour the more weight in the bat, strangely enough in this batch we have picked out they are pretty light. In fact I sent a bat out the other day that was full of colour and it weighed 3lb 3 in its raw state with the handle in, normally in any range average out at 3lb 7 or 8 in our top grades in that particular stage of our process. In fact I was talking to Trevor ward ex Kent and Leicester today who I have been coaching with and he was delighted in seeing butterfly bats being brought back in and said he used to love finding a lovely grained butterfly that pinged.
   My view is over the years the grade ones have been converted to almost extinction and grains and clean faces are at a premium. If we don't look after the butterfly clefts as manufacturers the same will happen as popularity builds so my view is to try and manage the quality of these just as everyone does with the other grading. We are lucky in that the majority of what we have selected are very light in weight and we have some stunners. This won't always be the case as we know its a natural product. Once again we are only wanting to put the best out to our customers and that is exactly what we are offering, I know we can't please everyone and cannot cater for all but we certainly are giving people a great option of quality at very good prices.
 I understand where customers are coming from, I totally begrudge buying training gear trainers etc as I used to get them for free but when I do I always go for what I feel is the best for me Adidas they may cost more but I know that what I am buying is quality and it suits me. That's what we are trying to do with our equipment but we entered into this cricket world at a middle market price and give you offers on those so we try and look after people as much as we can along with honest and straight advice, often advising people to go for the cheaper option as I think it is more applicable to them.
So hope that explains things a little more


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SOULMAN1012

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Re: Butterfly
« Reply #302 on: April 07, 2014, 07:50:56 PM »

Forget the butterfly for a minute what is this G1+ people talk about? As far as I know there is no such grade of willow a light density cleft is not graded any different from a standard G1 its just an ideal cleft.

On the other note you do need your lower grades to outsell your G1 clefts as the ratio of clefts in G1 is determined by the amount of clefts you buy, certainly from Wrights. You can't just buy G1 clefts as to get these you have to buy a mixed range. Well that's my understanding at least anyway. There just isn't the amount of G1 willow at present to allow just a purchase of G1.
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toenails97

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Re: Butterfly
« Reply #303 on: April 07, 2014, 07:55:40 PM »

I'm not having a dig here soulman, I own a Salix which has been the best bat I've ever used, but if there's no such thing as grade 1+ and density doesn't play a part in it why do Salix have 3 ranges quoted as grade 1?
Personally I don't think looks play a part in it either as my Salix is a performance and is a stunning bit of willow with thin straight grains...top value for £200 from Asad!!
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Re: Butterfly
« Reply #304 on: April 07, 2014, 07:59:48 PM »

Don't think I mentioned a grade 1+ did I?
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SOULMAN1012

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Re: Butterfly
« Reply #305 on: April 07, 2014, 08:01:59 PM »

I'm not having a dig here soulman, I own a Salix which has been the best bat I've ever used, but if there's no such thing as grade 1+ and density doesn't play a part in it why do Salix have 3 ranges quoted as grade 1?
Personally I don't think looks play a part in it either as my Salix is a performance and is a stunning bit of willow with thin straight grains...top value for £200 from Asad!!

That's a valid point but we don't advertise G1+ just different price points for what is still a grade 1 bat. Finite is the G1 light density clefts but we don't say its G1+ its just the best in the G1 range and in limited numbers.
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SOULMAN1012

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Re: Butterfly
« Reply #306 on: April 07, 2014, 08:04:26 PM »

Don't think I mentioned a grade 1+ did I?

Not at all Paul it was just me asking a question, maybe there is a G1+ available from Wrights but I've just never heard of it is all. In no way was it a dig at all mate just it seems to have been a hot topic over last few days and it was more a query as to is there actually a defined grade of G1+ available or is it just an internal grading used by some bat companies?
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ProCricketer1982

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Re: Butterfly
« Reply #307 on: April 07, 2014, 08:05:48 PM »

Forget the butterfly for a minute what is this G1+ people talk about? As far as I know there is no such grade of willow a light density cleft is not graded any different from a standard G1 its just an ideal cleft.

On the other note you do need your lower grades to outsell your G1 clefts as the ratio of clefts in G1 is determined by the amount of clefts you buy, certainly from Wrights. You can't just buy G1 clefts as to get these you have to buy a mixed range. Well that's my understanding at least anyway. There just isn't the amount of G1 willow at present to allow just a purchase of G1.
No such thing as a performance cleft either but that doesn't stop brand that promote such things etc. If brands only graded as wrights do, you'd only have 4 options. They don't as they know they can make a fast buck by selling things as 'pro', grade 1+, 'performance' etc etc
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SOULMAN1012

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Re: Butterfly
« Reply #308 on: April 07, 2014, 08:17:32 PM »

No such thing as a performance cleft either but that doesn't stop brand that promote such things etc. If brands only graded as wrights do, you'd only have 4 options. They don't as they know they can make a fast buck by selling things as 'pro', grade 1+, 'performance' etc etc

That's what I thought mate, I personally don't have a problem with a company grading as they want. At the end of the days that's how business works as most people run a business to make a profit. I was generally just trying to understand if there was actually an official g1+.

It makes sense that if there is something limited in a set range I.e light density clefts you charge a premium for it due to its exclusivity.
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Re: Butterfly
« Reply #309 on: April 07, 2014, 08:28:17 PM »

Right I see what you meant. There are more grades than that from wrights grade 1-4 then handmade men's and boys then down through the vellum ranges. The players grades come from the grade 1s as within them you get a very low percentage of what they call specials. These are very clean straight grained clefts of which companies put different versions of a players grade out from them. If you select by hand you can sometimes get a few more than normal.
  I then regrade when I finally receive the clefts so more tend to be downgraded than upgraded. You take the rough with the smooth. You will get some grade 1 clefts that will end up with marks in them or some fault that will downgrade it. You don't get many come up from 2 to 1 as wrights grading doesn't tend to give you that benefit as they are very rigorous with it. Sometimes you get 3s better than 2s.
Make sense?
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SOULMAN1012

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Re: Butterfly
« Reply #310 on: April 07, 2014, 08:41:44 PM »

Right I see what you meant. There are more grades than that from wrights grade 1-4 then handmade men's and boys then down through the vellum ranges. The players grades come from the grade 1s as within them you get a very low percentage of what they call specials. These are very clean straight grained clefts of which companies put different versions of a players grade out from them. If you select by hand you can sometimes get a few more than normal.
  I then regrade when I finally receive the clefts so more tend to be downgraded than upgraded. You take the rough with the smooth. You will get some grade 1 clefts that will end up with marks in them or some fault that will downgrade it. You don't get many come up from 2 to 1 as wrights grading doesn't tend to give you that benefit as they are very rigorous with it. Sometimes you get 3s better than 2s.
Make sense?

Perfect thanks mate. I have seen and been with Andrew when we regrade the clefts and like you say once you plain them do end up grading more down to 2's and on odd occasions are able to grade up but like I said not often.

Once again thanks for being so open and honest Paul and sorry if I didn't word it very well.
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ProCricketer1982

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Re: Butterfly
« Reply #311 on: April 07, 2014, 08:43:38 PM »

That's what I thought mate, I personally don't have a problem with a company grading as they want. At the end of the days that's how business works as most people run a business to make a profit. I was generally just trying to understand if there was actually an official g1+.

It makes sense that if there is something limited in a set range I.e light density clefts you charge a premium for it due to its exclusivity.
Agreed bud. Wouldn't mind a few of these 'specials' though :)
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Re: Butterfly
« Reply #312 on: April 07, 2014, 08:55:51 PM »

The specials we get become our players. You don't get many but then not many people in reality have the money to spend on them. For example this one was a beauty and very light too.
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ProCricketer1982

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Re: Butterfly
« Reply #313 on: April 07, 2014, 08:57:54 PM »

The specials we get become our players. You don't get many but then not many people in reality have the money to spend on them. For example this one was a beauty and very light too.



Wow
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toenails97

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Re: Butterfly
« Reply #314 on: April 07, 2014, 09:25:38 PM »

That looks a lovely bat Paul
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