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[petehosk]

So Stokes is included in the squad, isn't he?
Do we assume that he will be playing?

[alexhilly1492]

i doubt it, hes been included in the ashes squad and odi squads but made unavailable until the CPS case is resolved.

[six and out]

So Stokes is included in the squad, isn't he?
Do we assume that he will be playing?

Yes Pete he is in the squad.

I really can't see him playing though - ECB need to maintain their stance of he won't be picked until it's all sorted - so unless he's not charged etc... etc.... he won't be playing.

The conspiracy theorist in me reckons they have hedged their bets leaving Curran out knowing they can just call him up when they know Stokes isn't playing!

[FattusCattus]

Still no Leach?!Surely they must think he chucks it.
Wood again?Can only manage 5 overs of 88mph then pulls up. Was hoping for at least one new face in the pace bowling department. Pleased about Livingston though.
Woakes,Ali and Broad are lucky boys.

I think they have question marks over both his action and his temperament. I think he struggles on recent Lions outings and is a bit vulnerable under assault.

Wood got a bumming in the One Day warm up today.

[FattusCattus]

No TRJ either?

[Big Mac]

Ali at 3?After the way he batted in Australia?! Vince has possibly one more test then in comes Livingston

I mean, if a couple of nice looking cover drives before being dismissed for 20 is enough for a #3 then Moeen can do everything Vince can with the added bonus of being able to bowl a few overs and opening up a space in the test side for Crane.

[golders]

I know what you're saying BMAC. Vince is infuriating as he looks so good then snicks off every time!
Shai Hope was mentioned as someone who flattered for 11 tests before he got two hundreds against England last summer. Is 5/6 tests enough? The great Steve Waugh, Jacques Kallis struggled when they first came on the scene.
We can't keep chopping and changing,the selectors need to show a little faith,and I'm talking particularly about the batting- look what's happened with Malan.
Still not happy with our bowling options though!

[edge]

Don't pigeonhole Livingstone as just a hitter who bowls part time soon, he's a serious player. Bats 4 for lions and lancs, scored piles and piles for the Lions in Sri Lanka last year in stupid heat with most of the rest of the side getting spun out.

[golders]

Wasn't Livingstone playing club cricket and struggling to get in the Lancs side not long ago? If so,that's a helluva rise! Warner got plucked kinda out of nowhere so let's hope for a similar result! Does he bowl leggies and offies too?

[Big Mac]

I know what you're saying BMAC. Vince is infuriating as he looks so good then snicks off every time!
Shai Hope was mentioned as someone who flattered for 11 tests before he got two hundreds against England last summer. Is 5/6 tests enough? The great Steve Waugh, Jacques Kallis struggled when they first came on the scene.
We can't keep chopping and changing,the selectors need to show a little faith,and I'm talking particularly about the batting- look what's happened with Malan.
Still not happy with our bowling options though!

Kallis was a proper all-rounder and Steve Waugh was a pretty aggressive batsman that got dropped early on and was replaced by his brother. Waugh didn't become a great until he overhauled his game and cut out the hook shot.

[Manormanic]

Don't pigeonhole Livingstone as just a hitter who bowls part time soon, he's a serious player. Bats 4 for lions and lancs, scored piles and piles for the Lions in Sri Lanka last year in stupid heat with most of the rest of the side getting spun out.

The most important thing for me is that he is a cricketer who knows how own method rather than one who has been coached to a textbook, which means that he is very adaptable.

[ppccopener]

Don't pigeonhole Livingstone as just a hitter who bowls part time soon, he's a serious player. Bats 4 for lions and lancs, scored piles and piles for the Lions in Sri Lanka last year in stupid heat with most of the rest of the side getting spun out.

If I have got my players numbers right(12 are normally in my side!) If stokes don't play on the tour and Bairstow still keeps ahead of Foakes....and Ali does not play because we only play one spinner(crane) Livingstone would bat 6..

And that's still giving Vince and Stoneman 4 innings on the tour.Stoneman I think myself has less of a problem with getting picked, he looks ok and battles it out which you need up top, Vince is a different matter and like others has said NZ have a decent attack and they know where to put the ball-which almost certainly will be short of a length outside off.

[Manormanic]

Don't think I see Livingstone and Crane playing, unless Vince is dropped.  We'll want four seamers in NZ.

[Buzz]

Am I the only person who thinks the squad is unbalanced.
If one of the top three is injured, who is the replacement?

Livingston, Malan, Stokes, Bairstow are all middle order players (Stokes unlikely to play unless the CPS actually make a decision)

Malan is not really a 3, nor should Livingston be.

Once again the selectors have no plan, just a hope. Plus the lions will be in the West Indies which isn't all that convenient for a scoot off to Kiwi land. I admit nowhere is convenient for that, but the point stands.

Most of the bowling selections are consistent, but there is no variety other than the fast medium right hand stuff.

Crane has been selected when he would be better served bowling in the spin friendly west Indies rather than carrying drinks.

It makes no sense to me.

Not for the first time I think Whittaker and the selectors needs to be replaced. (I would go for Peter Moores, Steve Harmison and Graham Thorpe)

The English setup is its own worst enemy.

[ppccopener]

Hmmmm.yes Buzz...I think even those die hard supporters of England( I'm one of this although I hope not a biased fan when we don't play well)

Are thinking we don't have much of a plan. We can't really balance the side because of Stokes, but in the Ashes we didn't have top 3 coverage either, Ballance was the spare batsman, I suppose you could make a case he would of batted 3 if picked but that does not really fit either he's more of a 5 also.

Agree on Thorpe and Peter Moores, essentially with Bayliss not knowing much about County cricket we need some who do. Newell and Fraser I think are the others but how much influence do they have?

Root should bat 3 I've read everyone opinions on here and I just cannot see an argument for him not to...he's our best player by miles batting wise.Everyone else slots in down the order.

picking Crane and hen dropping him makes no sense, root, Bayliss, farbrace are talking about he next Ashes series away, how can they tell after one match if he is any good....

Without Stokes, some of our players got shown up, Woakes did not have a good tour, neither did Ali.

Ben Stokes covers up some cracks in our side, that's the reality of him not playing.

I think myself we are further behind that some care to admit, I also think we could lose in NZ.