Print

[Seniorplayer]

I've heard this from too many fan bases to count and the doom and gloom is never that bad. Wait till Woakes is fit again next summer and takes the new ball. Even seniorplayer will be purring with delight!

Woakes ? Not if England find a young   quick seamer  to give the attack variation during the winter tours with the X factor Ollie Stone maybe.

[Seniorplayer]

Rashid has bowled 73 overs this entire series. Jadeja has bowled 77 overs in one game.

They are saving him for Sri Lanka.

[KettonJake]

Is it though?

Again, this is the statement from Soulsman to which I took exception:

"both will finish there career as in the top 5 or 10 ever in the history of the game"

I didn't say Anderson was rubbish. I said the idea that he is one of the top 10 (or five!) greatest cricketers to ever live is nonsense.

He's not as good a bowler as Marshall, Ambrose, Walsh, Steyn, Donald, Pollock, Wasim, Lillee, Hadlee, Imran, Waqar and that's ten or eleven off the top of my head. That's ten or eleven better quick bowlers without going back through "the history of the game" and just guys that I remember watching.

There is much to admire about James Anderson, including some of the things that haters use to drag him down like his incredible fitness and longevity which is remarkable for a quick bowler along with the way that he has continued to evolve and improve through his career. There aren't many that have kept on picking up new skills in the second half of their career the way Anderson has and he's absolutely a very skilful and intelligent bowler.

He's just not one of the top 10 quicks to ever play the game and you can point to the wickets column all you like but it doesn't change that. Unless you're also going to tell me that Zaheer Khan is better than Joel Garner because he's got loads more wickets, five-fers and ten wickets in a match which Big Bird never did?

(I'm going to whisper this but Darren Gough was better than Anderson as well)

Cook's still a bloody hero though and is absolutely one of the greatest.

The argument used by some in this topic to belittle Cooks achievements is that he has batted on modern day pancakes rather than the dodgy wickets of yesteryear. Surely the reverse applies when comparing a bowler still going in 2018 against some of the ones on your list?

[rickjames]

This is depressing

[six and out]

Is Rashid bowling himself out of the Sri Lanka line up?

It's under 5 an over..... going to be all about the new ball

[LateBloomer]

Have to say im not Rashids biggest fan but Roots management and use of him as a bowler is horrendous. If someone has been picked in the team, unanimously according to Ed Smith yesterday, at least give him the best chance to succeed

[Seniorplayer]

With England having runs on the board  unlike previous matches  this series .Root is giving Rashid a bowl.

[WalkingWicket37]

With England having runs on the board  unlike previous matches  this series .Root is giving Rashid a bowl.

At the time of posting Ali the "second spinner" has bowled 17 overs.
Rashid the "frontline spinner" has bowled 6 overs, the same as Captain Root has given himself with his part time offies.

Hardly "giving him a bowl" all things considered

[mo_town]

Bairstow standing up to the great Anderson! Now I have seen everything!

[LateBloomer]

At the time of posting Ali the "second spinner" has bowled 17 overs.
Rashid the "frontline spinner" has bowled 6 overs, the same as Captain Root has given himself with his part time offies.

Hardly "giving him a bowl" all things considered

Nope, seems a token gesture which cant be good for any bowlers confidence. Anyone think Ed Smith may not have been telling the truth when he said Root wanted Rashid to play?

[rickjames]

Sigh

[six and out]

Nope, seems a token gesture which cant be good for any bowlers confidence. Anyone think Ed Smith may not have been telling the truth when he said Root wanted Rashid to play?

I have said it from the start, there is no way that Root trusts Rashid's bowling, he would have bowled a lot more overs in the series as he has had ample opportunities to throw him the ball. But can you blame Root? Why would you, Rashid is bowling pies with absolutely no control whatsoever.

[Big Mac]

The argument used by some in this topic to belittle Cooks achievements is that he has batted on modern day pancakes rather than the dodgy wickets of yesteryear. Surely the reverse applies when comparing a bowler still going in 2018 against some of the ones on your list?

You don't even need to compare with players playing on uncovered wickets 70 years ago. I named almost a dozen better quick bowlers from the last 25/30 years.

Which openers in the last 25-30 years would you place as high as Cook? Hayden, Smith, Sehwag, Anwar, Gooch...it's not a big list. Cook has been successful in more/struggled in fewer places than Hayden and Sehwag so at worst Cook is top 4.

Do the best quick bowlers that have played in the last 25-30 years and Anderson barely sneaks into the top 10. Wasim, Waqar, Ambrose, Walsh, McGrath, Steyn, Pollock, Donald are all definitely better than Anderson.

So again, is he crap? No, that's nonsense.

Is he top 5 or 10 of all time? No, that's also nonsense.

Not being top 10 bestest thing in the history of the universe is not a criticism. We shouldn't have to resort to hyperbole when evaluating people. There is a tiny, almost imperceptible area on the spectrum between GOAT and utterly useless.

It's OK to be 'just' really bloody good.

[Big Mac]

Have to say im not Rashids biggest fan but Roots management and use of him as a bowler is horrendous. If someone has been picked in the team, unanimously according to Ed Smith yesterday, at least give him the best chance to succeed

Same here, I have not been shy with my criticism of Rashid but that doesn't change the fact that no English captain in my memory has had any idea of how to handle spinners. It doesn't help that England have seemed a bit nervous ever since these two settled in, just give Rashid 8-10 overs on the bounce. Let them keep playing shots, eventually something will bounce or keep low out of the rough and create a chance. If he goes for 80 from those 10 overs then take him out of the attack and let him stand at fine leg for the rest of the day but you have to at least give him enough rope to hang himself.

There is no way India win this, because if that ever becomes a possibility then they can just have Anderson/Broad/Curran/Stokes hang the ball miles outside off stump and kill the run rate. So if you can't lose the game, it's better to give Rashid two extra overs rather than two overs too few.

Having said all that, Anderson will go past McGrath in a minute and England will probably wrap this up in the next five overs and it'll be moot.

It's funny having listened to Bob Willis spend the last couple of months putting up a half-hearted defence of Rashid with "Leg-spinners come into their own when they have 400 to defend and they can attack and England haven't been scoring that many runs this summer" only for England to score that many runs and then Rashid doesn't get a bowl.

[Big Mac]

wait how is that leg byes