New AS Champ
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Tom

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Re: New AS Champ
« Reply #105 on: December 14, 2018, 08:36:05 PM »

It all depends on how they grade their bats. Are they graded on performance or looks?
Was waiting how long till someone trotted out that line. A bat looking like that should never, ever be a top grade. I'd be surprised if it was even a G4 cleft.

"Premium Quality English Willow Bat
9+ Straight Grains"

To me, that bat has none of those things.
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Tom

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Re: New AS Champ
« Reply #106 on: December 14, 2018, 08:38:19 PM »

It is not about cost but what I don’t understand is people expectations are unrealistic. Expecting 12-15 grains clean cleft for this cost is unrealistic. To me, these are good Bats for the price point.
I'm not denying the price point isn't reasonable, just saying that in my view they should not be considered top grade. As soon as you take that into account it brings into consideration other lower grade bats from other manufacturers.
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cesare_in

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Re: New AS Champ
« Reply #107 on: December 14, 2018, 08:44:57 PM »

lol -  at $60 if that's not a steal then I am not sure what else is.

That's an unreal deal !!  Wow !!

Hahaha.. yes. I picked up cheapest of their deals to try out. From looks perspective, this will probably be a G5 I guess.

This thing's surely got character - with that dark line right in the center  :D. Wondering what that is? Never seen 1 in a bat.
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Sitonit

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Re: New AS Champ
« Reply #108 on: December 14, 2018, 08:50:38 PM »

Was waiting how long till someone trotted out that line. A bat looking like that should never, ever be a top grade. I'd be surprised if it was even a G4 cleft.

"Premium Quality English Willow Bat
9+ Straight Grains"

To me, that bat has none of those things.

9+ Straight Grains could mean cosmetic incentive and perhaps an entry level requirements to be "Premium Q E W"
But the pressing and moisture could make a grade 4 bat better perform better than Premium Q E W"

So my point is, do we pay £500 or £700 for a premium quality bat just because it has a lot of clean grains? If not, then it's a fair play between all grades of willow.

In my opinion, the number of grains and how pleasing the bat looks to the eye doesn't really matter THAT much so and so that we jack up the price to several hundred pounds.
IMO, the ping itself of all grades of willow is not miles apart from each other. A G4 (ugly looking cleft) could ping just as well as a £700 bat if both are made in the same exact weight and ran through the EXACT same process of bat manufacturing.

It's all about pick and feel.

As the great man says himself  starting at @1:50   I mean, he is not even worried about ping when it comes to feeling good about pick of a bat.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7s8zEjRyPaY


I think this video trumps most of the granular philosophies posted by various bat grand masters on this forum
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Sitonit

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Re: New AS Champ
« Reply #109 on: December 14, 2018, 08:53:22 PM »

Hahaha.. yes. I picked up cheapest of their deals to try out. From looks perspective, this will probably be a G5 I guess.

This thing's surely got character - with that dark line right in the center  :D. Wondering what that is? Never seen 1 in a bat.

May be there is a drill hole, like a empty tunnel behind it, where they pulled out lots of fibers from the timber to make it light, and to cover the mark and put some naswaar color paint on top of gypsum coating? 
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Tom

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Re: New AS Champ
« Reply #110 on: December 14, 2018, 09:03:47 PM »

In my opinion, the number of grains and how pleasing the bat looks to the eye doesn't really matter THAT much so and so that we jack up the price to several hundred pounds.
IMO, the ping itself of all grades of willow is not miles apart from each other. A G4 (ugly looking cleft) could ping just as well as a £700 bat if both are made in the same exact weight and ran through the EXACT same process of bat manufacturing.
I don't disagree with anything you have said in your post. Of course, performance is most important in a product that is used however as far as I'm aware no bat manufacturer has an objective or scientific way to measure performance. Anyone that claims to grade on performance is using another proxy to do so, whether that's density, grain structure or a combination.

I am making the point, though, because the price of this AS 'top grade' was being compared to other top grade bats, made elsewhere. We're not comparing apples with apples. Generally speaking, and I've seen a lot of bats, Pakistani manufactured bats are inferior in the finish, handle quality and they also have a penchant for lots of wood filler.
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Sitonit

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Re: New AS Champ
« Reply #111 on: December 14, 2018, 09:15:17 PM »

Hahaha.. yes. I picked up cheapest of their deals to try out. From looks perspective, this will probably be a G5 I guess.

This thing's surely got character - with that dark line right in the center  :D. Wondering what that is? Never seen 1 in a bat.

Please PM me with their contact info and I will place an order with reasonable specs.

Since there is nothing else to do in this winter weather, lets play the bat games with Pak manufactures.

I already got a buyer for my AS bat which gives me $42 profit. lol
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Sitonit

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Re: New AS Champ
« Reply #112 on: December 14, 2018, 09:18:53 PM »


I am making the point, though, because the price of this AS 'top grade' was being compared to other top grade bats, made elsewhere. We're not comparing apples with apples. Generally speaking, and I've seen a lot of bats, Pakistani manufactured bats are inferior in the finish, handle quality and they also have a penchant for lots of wood filler.

Yes I agree but I am not sure if this actually IS their "TOP GRADE" bat or they just put the stickers of their top grade bat to our custom bat requests?
In my specs I CLEARLY told them that I don't care what grade of willow it is and how ugly it looks.

But that was a double whammy that hit me. The weight specs did not meet and the bat is over sized (42 mm edges and no concaving) for my liking, and the timer looks ugly anyway. lol
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Cholrudee

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Re: New AS Champ
« Reply #113 on: December 14, 2018, 10:31:03 PM »

Is the bat that you did order in the post to you?
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Sitonit

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Re: New AS Champ
« Reply #114 on: December 14, 2018, 10:49:24 PM »

Is the bat that you did order in the post to you?

Sorry, I couldn't follow. Are you asking me something?
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InternalTraining

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Re: New AS Champ
« Reply #115 on: December 14, 2018, 11:12:16 PM »

Who cares about grains! If the bat pings and the weight is right for you, then that is all that should matter.

We should have a CBF wide drive to encourage and procure cheapest but pingiest bats. Time to do away with the day-light robbery that is the bat grading system (grains my behind!).
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Cholrudee

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Re: New AS Champ
« Reply #116 on: December 14, 2018, 11:33:12 PM »

Sorry, I couldn't follow. Are you asking me something?

You said you were going to contact AS about the bat that you did order (which your mate left behind in favor of a pro bat for you) and request pictures and if happy you would have them  post it to you.
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Cholrudee

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Re: New AS Champ
« Reply #117 on: December 14, 2018, 11:36:35 PM »

Who cares about grains! If the bat pings and the weight is right for you, then that is all that should matter.

We should have a CBF wide drive to encourage and procure cheapest but pingiest bats. Time to do away with the day-light robbery that is the bat grading system (grains my behind!).

Great idea IT.

The final price though would need to include shipping costs, import duties, vat/tax/gst, communication to sellers costs, tt/mg/pp/wu fees etc etc
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Sitonit

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Re: New AS Champ
« Reply #118 on: December 14, 2018, 11:45:59 PM »

Who cares about grains! If the bat pings and the weight is right for you, then that is all that should matter.

For that matter, even the willow grade doesn’t matter. IMO

Quote
We should have a CBF wide drive to encourage and procure cheapest but pingiest bats. Time to do away with the day-light robbery that is the bat grading system (grains my behind!).

This is somewhat tricky.

Small business is EXTREMELY HARD to run in UK.
So the small manufactures in UK struggle to match with the prices of manufacturers in Asia where labor cost is dirt cheap and there are always loop holes to avoid business taxes.

So UK manufactured stuff will be about double the price of what you get in Asia.
There could be other extreme examples but that’s about the average difference which is a fair play.

Also,  chances of pulling cheap tricks in manufacturing the bats are less likely to happen in UK made products vs Asian made bats.IMO.

UK manufacturers tend to take pride in their products while many Asian manufacturers only focus on making money.

However, when it comes to prices like £700 for a UK made bat then the price may not justify the value and performance of the bat.
Such products (not just the cricket bats but many other consumer products) become a show off symbol, or they are for those who have too much extra money to waste and they don’t care how much it costs, or sometimes it’s for those foolish buyers who believe, everything that glitters is gold.

An experienced bat purchaser will always know what to get and how much to spend.

« Last Edit: December 14, 2018, 11:47:46 PM by Sitonit »
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Sitonit

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Re: New AS Champ
« Reply #119 on: December 14, 2018, 11:51:32 PM »

You said you were going to contact AS about the bat that you did order (which your mate left behind in favor of a pro bat for you) and request pictures and if happy you would have them  post it to you.

No, I have been quite lazy to follow up but thanks for the reminder - I will try to call Khalid tonight.
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